@say,
Membership level is defined by number of posts, not age. Additionally, international students do not qualify for in-state tuition at public colleges (I think that Dreamers might, but I don’t think they should).
As @jzducol said, you should not be so quick to jump to conclusions.
@SAY your post is just clueless rants; it contains emotion but no fact. Since college admission of international students is not the topic of this thread neither is the desirability of US education I will be brief here. As you know our immigration system is indeed broken; so the irony is that if you enter the country legally–in this case on student visas–you have to pay full tuition from elementary school to college, but if you declare yourself illegal all the tuition is waived. So what’s downside of declaring yourself undocumented? Well, you will never be eligible for a greencard or reentering the US in ten years, so most foreigners would not risk having such illegal status. Whether the public is aware or not the fact is that many public schools in recent years rely increasingly on full pay foreign students to make their ends meet or at least use the money to subside in-state-tuition students. US tax payers certainly are not taken advantage here. As far as the anchor babies are concerned I am sure if they were born to British millionaires/billionaires people like you probably wouldn’t even raise an eyebrow let alone protest in street. But that’s a discussion for another thread.
@SAY This is for you and others who are interested in US vs Chinese schools, it just came today in WSJ:
https://www.wsj.com/articles/why-american-students-need-chinese-schools-1504882481?mod=trending_now_1
You’ve yet to prove to anyone why education is important for the bottom 90% of the population.
Good post. Asians study WAY too hard. How many people are seriously going to use anything above middle school math, reading and writing skills after formal education ends?
Education, for the vast majority of the population, is a waste of time, money and resources.
Our education is expensive due to immigration. Cut them all out and education would be cheaper and higher quality. Rent and cost of living would go down drastically, while wages would go up and the rich would make a lot less money.
Immigration is a death sentence for countries.
Contrary to popular beliefs, having wealthy foreigners buy up land, property and space in a country isn’t beneficial to the native population.
Why can’t Asians just do that in their own countries? Why do they have to come to the west?
Most times, Asians turns whichever neighborhood they inhabit into another version of their countries they’ve escaped from. Ever walk around Flushing, NY? 3rd world living conditions with $1+ million pricetag for a rat-infested closet. That’s the future for any western city with an enormous Asian population.
Your country will never stop being a 3rd world craphole if you keep running away from your problems. The problem isn’t the environment. It’s YOU. You and your people are what made your country a horrible place to live, and it is time you manned up and fixed it instead of leeching off other people.
I think we are using the word “Asians” to describe too many different types of Asians. The Asians in my community are completely Americanized just like Italians, Irish, Jews, English, Polish, Black, Hispanics, etc. I live in an upper middle class neighborhood (NYC suburb) where there are lots of Asians and they are involved in their kids’ lives just like the rest of us. I actually have not come in to contact with the Asians talked about a few pages ago that don’t assimilate and are a threat to our culture (more of a west coast thing??). And I pay attention to this stuff.
My literal next door neighbors’ kids (Asians) definitely had a bit of a harder time with admissions and it very well may have been the result of Asians being held to a higher standard…can’t prove this of course, but just my feeling based on where all of their three kids ended up and knowing that they were all strong students. I know of many in my town as well.
Lynbrook High in San Jose is over 80% Asian.
Many, if not the majority, speak Mandarin at home. and the average SAT score is 2000/2400.
There are many more schools like this in our area. The bar is high for local kids–which can be good–but other excellent kids are left behind with low academic self-esteem because the are below “average”.
It has certainly changed public (and private) education around here for ever.
I’m Asian and I know my kids will not be treated fairly when it comes to college admission. Yet, I still believe Affirmative Action is necessary and fair. For most African American or Latino kids, I can’t imagine how much more effort they must put in and how much more hardship they encounter. The fact is, they combine to be majority of lower class families in US. The environment they live in, the resources available to them, are not like my kids or most kids and parents on this site.
On the subject of “race” everyone should read “Hillbilly Elegy” before they make the claim that only African American or Latino young people experience hardship.
Poor whites also struggle and there is certainly no clear cut affirmative action for them. There are no special scholarships or clubs. They are disparaged and forgotten.
@lalalander111 I just read a review on the Hillbilly Elegy, and it seems like the author grew up in this environment but got himself out of it by going to Ohio State (great school) and then Yale Law School.
Seems the author mentions his disgust with some people from him community for pretty much blaming everyone but themselves for the poverty and lifestyle they are stuck in.
Very touchy topic and nothing will change, in fact I think it is getting worse! I want the best people for the job!! Since many in my family are in healthcare this is a sore subject just look at AAMCAS applicant data and then tell me there isn’t a huge problem!!
Hispanics and AA’s get a pass and are able to get into medical school with lower gpa’s and lower mcats than white and especially ASIAN students.
Asians are the ones getting screwed nationwide!
This URM thing is semi aggravating, but I just tell my kids they have to score higher, work harder, and be better because on a equal playing field they will lose.
There is still a ton of opportunity out there …but when you get the spot to fill a quota or to check the diversity box I will always think that is wrong.
@lalalander111
I think you should go back and read the post again. The only person that wrote down “ONLY African American or Latino young people experience hardship” is you. Of course there are poor white and Asian kids but those #s pale in comparison to African American or Latino. Why is Affirmative Action in place for 50+ years? If everyone thinks like you and only cares about their own race/children AA wouldn’t be around this long, might not even be put into law in the first place.
http://www.apa.org/pi/ses/resources/publications/minorities.aspx
“In the United States, 39 percent of African-American children and adolescents and 33 percent of Latino children and adolescents are living in poverty, which is more than double the 14 percent poverty rate for non-Latino, White, and Asian children and adolescents (Kids Count Data Center, Children in Poverty 2014)”
Without AA in higher education, it would benefit Asian kids, like my own, more than any other race. Knowing how much Asian parents value and stress education it might be the ONLY race that’ll benefit.
This part of the review on Hillbilly Elegy in particular interested me:
[/QUOTE]
In speaking about the author, the review says…
“He has no patience with an old acquaintance who told him he quit his job because he hated waking up early, only to take to Facebook to blame the “…economy.” Or with a former co-worker at a tile warehouse who missed work once a week though his girlfriend was pregnant.”
I feel badly for children being born into these communities as well. Sounds like they are in desperate need of better and more education. But is there anyone standing in the way of them getting it other than their own community? Are they applying to state colleges and then realize they can’t go because they can’t afford them? Are they being denied admission because their spots are going to URM’s?
I don’t think so.
They are caught up in a culture of despair. I don’t think there is any backlash from AA. And, I also think that, like the author of the article, if they do well in school and apply to college, they will get in somewhere and probably CAN find a scholarship and/or need based aid…they have stories to tell about overcoming adversity.Colleges LOVE this. I think there are many, many schools that would appreciate this kind of diversity as well…especially after this last election.
I think the real and heartbreaking hardships these “Hillbillies” are experiencing would be viewed as hooks at many schools and if they are serious about getting into college and being able to afford it, there are options for these people as well. But I’m not sure this is really what they want.
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@JC1228 I agree that there are many Asians that are the most victimized by AA and stand the most to gain by it and similar programs going away. I live on the East Coast and there are many Asians in our communities. Generally speaking, it seems as though the Asian influence in our schools has benefited the schools quite a bit because many of the students are academically motivated.
Do schools like Miami university use affirmative action or is it used by Ivy League schools
@lostsenior4829 One way to find out if the schools you are looking at consider race in admissions is to look at their common data set.
If you mean Miami in Ohio (Miami U) - http://www.units.miamioh.edu/oir/CommonDataSet/ - “Not Considered”
Or U Miami (Florida) - http://pira.miami.edu/_assets/pdf/Documents/CDS1617.pdf - “Considered”
This has the same stats for all or most colleges in one spot: http://www.collegedata.com/cs/main/main_choose_tmpl.jhtml
The purpose of this thread is to discuss race/ethnicity and only race/ethnicity. To talk about legacy or devs or athletes or SES or trombone players is to hijack the thread. If you want to start a discussion on stats only, I suggest you create a new thread.
Seems silly to discuss one admissions preference while blissfully ignoring the other admissions preferences that actually advantage one RACE over the others. Look up at the title, this thread is called **“Race” in College Applications/b. If a policy like legacy or athletic recruitment or development favors a race - white people - then it belongs here.
Feel free to ask a moderator if you like @roethlisburger .