I disagree completely about any of the undergraduate business schools being better than a BA in Econ from Princeton. BC Carroll and Villanova do not hold a candle to Princeton Econ for IB/Consulting recruiting.
Princeton is of the same level as Harvard, Wharton, Stanford, and MIT.
^To clarify, I believe a more comprehensive ranking of top schools would be this:
-HUGE Gap-
I would argue for Dartmouth to be in the top tier as it places a disproportionately large amount of students into top finance roles (I think a higher proportion than any uni on this list, probably perpetuated by its deeply ingrained fraternity system, which serves as a feeder to top financial institutions).
MIT should be in the top tier because its low number of placements can be explained by the VERY low number of undergraduate econ/business majors as a percentage of the total enrollment. Also, keep in mind that we are just looking at private equity placements.
Stanford only has about 7,000 undergrads (it has slightly more grads than undergrads last time I checked). Stanford UGs have a propensity to pick Silicon Valley opportunities over Wall Street opportunities.
For MIT and Stanford it seems that Wall Street wants them a lot more than they want Wall Street.
Also, I would say UMich LSA/Engineering and UVA CAS beat out Tepper, Caroll, and Villanova for financial services/management consulting recruiting.
I say instead of looking at volume, we should be seeing how easy it is for students from these schools to break in.
@Alexandre That seems like a fantastic list. I didn’t mean to suggest “Econ majors at Brown, Chicago, Columbia, Dartmouth” are better positioned than Ross, Dyson, or other undergrad business school students. Those are obviously great programs.
Also, the MIT aspect does seem strange. I would imagine it has something to do with the majority of students interested in finance there going to more quant-oriented hedge funds (DE Shaw, Renaissance, Bridgewater).
So the OP’s question was around ranking business undergrad programs. It’s not about undergrad Econ programs at the ivies or anywhere else.
USNWR ranks Wharton first and Cal and MIT tied for second three years in a row for undergrad business programs. For specifically finance, which wasn’t the OP’'s question, Cal ranks fifth overall.
"Bloomberg Businessweek rankings for undergraduate business schools are known to be a joke for students pursuing careers in financial services and management consulting (which I assume OP is doing given he/she wants to major in finance). "
Yikesyikesyikes, aren’t you either a hs senior or college freshman? How would you possibly have any sense as to what’s what in the business world?
Pizzagirl, I will let yikesyikesyikes respond to your question himself, but I must concur with his assessment of the Bloomberg Businessweek rankings. Their MBA rankings are plausible, but their BBA rankings are highly suspect. Wharton ranked out of the top 15? Tepper out of the top 25? Sloan not even ranked? I don’t know.
I am an incoming sophomore - I have interned in both financial services and management consulting - and I’ve met a lot of people in those industries who would say exactly what I said about Bloomberg Businessweek rankings being a joke for finance students. Finance students (if they are the type to desire the high-paying or “prestigious” positions) should completely ignore them. Unless there is a cost issue (like Villanova giving significant merit $$$) or a severe fit issue, schools like Wharton, Ross, Haas would serve a finance student much better than a school like Villanova. Do not take my word for it - ask people in financial services yourself (excluding those who work in real-estate/commercial/retail banking, insurance, compliance, internal legal, audit/accounting/tax, or things like that).
Ok. I still would be rather cautious of assuming you, a rising sophomore in college, are some kind of “expert” on what companies look for.
Sounds like a decision has been made to vet undergrad business programs. Undergrad Econ majors and their chances of matriculating to top MBA programs and MBA programs themselves are in a different category altogether and deserve separate rankings.
I never called myself an expert - but as someone who has gone through the recruiting process, I think the OP can benefit from my insight.
If you do consult the “experts” on recruiting for top financial services positions, they will also tell you that Bloomberg Business Rankings for UG Business are nonsense (at least for students interested in financial services).
And that also applies for management consulting.
The recruiting world might have shifted.
http://www.wsj.com/articles/goldman-rethinks-campus-recruiting-efforts-1466709118
Very interesting advice.
I am planning on concentrating in finance and upon graduation I will enter financial services industry.
I am not sure EXACTLY what sector I will work in, but I want to keep my options open, and hence am concerned about prestige and placement for the schools I have shortlisted.
I would prefer to study business as an undergrad, but I’ve included some schools like Dartmouth and Johns Hopkins to my list. I reckon that although I won’t be able to study business, economics degrees at these institutions would suffice and open plenty of doors for me after graduating.
That is a new announcement - we’ll see how wide Goldman actually casts its net for its IBD and S&T roles - the divisions with the most prevalent “elite schools only” culture (and the highest paying).
Yes, Econ at Dartmouth or JHU will be good (Econ @ Dartmouth opens up A LOT of doors if you get involved in Greek Life).
Whatever you do, don’t think that “business” just consists of finance – that’s a high-schooler’s way of thinking about things. Business encompasses a very wide range of activities. Some actually involve making stuff, not just financing it.
yikes3x - What is it about Bloomberg Business Week’s methodology that makes it a “joke”? Are the factors it measures irrelevant regarding a finance education? Are the writers and editors there morons who just can’t see the ‘obvious superiority’ of schools like Warton? Or, are they attacking it from a different angle – one that may give insight to the real value of one school over another?
Also, why condemn schools like Villanova and Boston College with this “huge gap” differentiation? It wouldn’t have to do with their being Catholic, would it? The Carroll School is the hardest in which to gain entry of all the colleges within BC, and, I believe, the entering test scores are a lot closer to those of the ‘elites’ which you place ‘far ahead’.
You are painting with a broad brush and I am not seeing much behind it. By the way, you are not voting for Trump, are you?
I was taking your post seriously until your last few comments. I will, begrudgingly, still dignify it with a response:
Let me address your distasteful red herrings first:
Yes, Villanova and BC are Catholic, and no, that has nothing to do with my assessment of them. I did not call them bad schools or programs. They are great schools/programs, just not nearly as good with finance recruiting as some of the higher schools I mentioned - one of which is Georgetown McDonough, which is a CATHOLIC school (I hope that helps dispel your gross assertion that I have a vendetta against Catholic schools).
What does Trump have anything to do with anything in this discussion? But if it makes you happy, I find the idea of a Trump presidency sickening.
I am not saying those other schools will provide a fine education or even good recruiting. My rankings, as I clearly stated, are for RECRUITING - and it undeniable that a school like Wharton or Ross does better than a school like Villanova for the “top” entry-level roles in financial services and management consulting. Those rankings MAY serve a purpose, but definitely not the purpose I am addressing. In jobs like investment banking and management consulting, the “elites” are disproportionately recruited from - that is just how it works. Whether you want to acknowledge that or not, is your choice.
Also, let’s try to leave our discussions civil, and not just make accusations with no basis.
I agree that business is not just about finance. Unfortunately, students “set” on financial serviceshardly waver until they are years into their career (if they make it), and realize that they have sold their youth away. Those 80-120 hour work weeks can be brutal.
Even those in it just for the “exit ops” often take opportunities still in financial services, except buy-side instead of sell-side, and the lifestyle there is brutal too.
I am still debating whether to fully commit to such a fate if the opportunity presents itself.
Villanova does very well in the Economist value survey, as do business oriented schools like Babson and Washington and Lee. These are real contenders if you can’t make it into the HYP type of school, or don’t live in Michigan or Virginia.
http://www.economist.com/blogs/graphicdetail/2015/10/value-university