<p>my d plans a vocal performance major in college. She is looking at these: Oberlin, Eastman, Peabody, Curtis, NYU, BU, BC, NE Conservatory, Boston Conservatory, Syracuse, Ithaca, Julliard, McGill. Fortunately she is still a junior, so we have time to investigate...could anyone tell me how these fit in the pecking order of excellent schools for classical voice? She's a soprano. And, what makes a school great for this major?</p>
<p>Well, I can't quite rank those, but my friend plans on doing musical voice in college, and surprisingly University of Cincinnati has an amazing voice program. It has a 10% acceptance rate I believe. So, just throwing that out there.</p>
<p>Great schools for voice are determined mostly by their current voice faculty and how they are as teachers. </p>
<p>I haven't heard great things about NEC's and Boston Con's current voice faculty, but Boston University School of Fine Arts supposedly has a very good voice program. Oberlin and Ithaca are great; I don't know much about the rest.</p>
<p>Your D should also look into the Crane School of Music at SUNY Potsdam.</p>
<p>so how do you know how good they are as teachers?</p>
<p>My D went through the selection/audition process for classical voice last year. She is now a happy freshman at Lawrence University in their 5 year BM vocal performance/BA program. Since your D is a junior, you have some time to discuss and check out your D's options. A major decision is whether to apply to a conservatory, college, university or a combination of all three. Free standing conservatories (i.e. Manhattan, Mannes, NEC, BC, CCM, Curtis, Juilliard, Eastman, etc.) are for the student who is absolutely committed to only vocal performance. The curriculum at such places is MUSIC, MUSIC, MUSIC - with only a smattering (if that!) of liberal arts. NEC and Eastman have associations with, respectively, Tufts and Rochester, but juggling classes at two different places on two different schedules can be a problem. Both Lawrence and Oberlin have conservatories within their colleges and both have double-degree options as well as the ability (if in the BM program alone in their conservatories) to take liberal arts classes and have a more traditional college experience. Finally, there are small LACs and universities which have excellent departments of music for the vocal performance major. Some (such as CMU) have very restrictive curricula and, though, other course options are available in the university make it difficult for the student to participate. You should carefully examine each place's curriculum with this in mind. Within each of the three environments I have mentioned, the choice and availability of a teacher is paramount. My D visited several different places the summer after of her junior year and had sample lessons at all. Though the teacher choice is not cast in stone (i.e. the person you have a sample lesson with may not be the one you want!) she got a good idea of what to expect at each place. She ultimately decided that she did not want a conservatory -- too restrictive (and musically intense) for her as an undergraduate and applied only to LAC and university vocal performance programs. As she went through the process and looked at the places and curricula, she decided she wanted a liberal arts environment as well (with a BA degree). So -- it came down to Lawrence and Oberlin. She liked the teachers she met at both but found the 5 year double-degree program at Lawrence more to her liking (structured with flexibility, two advisors, etc.). In addition, she received a large performance merit scholarship based on her audition. She is now over halfway through her freshman year there and is very happy. She has two voice lessons/week, a studio class, plenty of performance opportunities, and is able to take liberal arts classes as well. I hope this information helps you in your journey through the process.</p>
<p>"so how do you know how good they are as teachers?"</p>
<p>Trial lessons are best, but since trying out every single teacher from every single school is next to impossible (!), most people go by word of mouth and some then try out those select teachers for size. But don't rule out a school just because the rumor mill isn't very flattering toward it! When I was looking into schools, I was told the University of Miami didn't have a good voice program. But after further research and inquiry I learned they had a couple very excellent teachers; it's just that those teachers alone couldn't carry the reputation for the entire School of Music.</p>
<p>CCM, Mannes, and Eastman are not freestanding conservatories. Eastman isn't associated with Rochester-- it's part of it, though it functions as if it were more independant. Mannes is part of the New School University. CCM is at the Univ. of Cincinnatti, though maybe you meant CIM.</p>
<p>You might look at Bard. Its mandatory double degree is completely innovative, and Dawn Upshaw has recently been named head of vocal performance there.</p>
<p>CCM and Indiana are very big opera centers. Oberlin's voice program is extremely well regarded, but sopranosmom obviously has more of the scoop there (I'm not a vocalist).</p>
<p>thanks, it does help. We are making a list and starting to schedule college visits, and I feel it's important to visit all three kinds of schools (conservatories, LAC, and music school in a university setting) sp d can get a feel for what she is getting into. I have told her that I will NOT TALK during tours- she has to ask her own questions (although it will almost kill me to stay quiet!!!)...a friend's d went to Tanglewood a couple of years age and came home feeling like she knew what a conservatory would be like, and she did NOT want that after all. So my d has applied there (Tanglewood), and if she gets in, I guess that will tell us something about the level of her talent, and if she attends, that will also tell her whether she is willing to spend the next 4 years of her life doing music and not much else, (right now she thinks that's what she wants) or if she wants a college experience that is broader, and with more academic classes...</p>
<p>Tanglewood is excellent for that purpose. My daughter was waffling between performance and music ed. toward the end of her junior year. She was accepted into Tanglewood, went for eight weeks (two week workshop plus six week orchestra program) and came back with her mind made up on the side of performance. She still emails Tanglewood friends from all over the country and even one from Japan. They support each other and go out together whenever they meet up at college auditions. I think she considers that the best summer she ever had. </p>
<p>I believe the vocalists can audition for BU toward the end of the Tanglewood program. If the audition goes well, it takes the place of the normal February audition in Boston. If it doesn't go well, they throw away the results and let them try again with everyone else.</p>
<p>The only downside is the fact that you don't find out whether you got in to Tanglewood until April. Most other decent camps are full by then, so it is difficult if you are not accepted.</p>
<p>Oberlin is another good test. It is quite difficult to get in there as a female vocalist, but you can audition in early December and get an Accepted/Deferred/Denied decision within a few weeks. (I believe Sopranos and possibly Mezzos have to submit a pre-screening tape to be invited to a live audition - check the oberlin.edu website for details.) If accepted, the decision is non-binding so she can then shop around at other schools with a guaranteed acceptance at a highly-respected program already assured.</p>
<p>Best of luck with Tanglewood and with colleges next year.</p>
<p>My D went to Tanglewood after her sophomore year in hs and was very sure after the experience (which was fantastic!) that she did not want to attend a conservatory. She keeps up with several friends from there and has met other acquaintances at subsequent summer programs. It is a fantastic program and I wish your D luck in getting into it. Like BassDad said, vocalists between their jr and sr hs years can audition for BU at the end of the program. If the audition goes well -- great -- otherwise, it can be repeated in the following winter.</p>
<p>To Fiddlefrog -- you are semantically correct in stating that Mannes, CCM, and Eastman are not freestanding conservatories -- they do have university associations. However, for all intents and purposes, vocalists who attend them have extremely restrictive curricula like the other conservatories I mentioned (Curtis, Juilliard, etc..)-- i.e. minimal to no electives or required liberal arts courses within the respective universities -- and very heavy music requirements. At Eastman, vocal performance students can take courses at Rochester but the schools are some distance apart and scheduling difficulties commonly ensue. CCM and Indiana are excellent opera centers, however, much better for vocal performance grad students than undergrads. Oberlin's undergraduate program is well-regarded but, again, depends on teacher availability for an individual student. My bias is that it is overrated. Fiddlefrog is right -- Bard just started a new vocal performance major with Dawn Upshaw - no track record yet -- and the rest of Bard's environment will not appeal to some students. </p>
<p>To BassDad -- yes, vocalists can audition at Oberlin for early (non-binding) review in December but it is extremely competitive as that timeframe is when most of the tentative double-degree students audition (trying to get into both the conservatory and college at once -- and they have very strong academic credentials in addition to their music talent). Sopranos do have to submit a screening tape both for early and regular review before they are invited to audition.</p>
<p>D, a mezzo, graduated from Interlochen, was accepted to many of the top voice programs and chose Rice. The voice faculty is excellent and there are good performance opps for underclassmen. She liked Indiana second best, but thinks it would be better for grad school. She has Interlochen classmates who are happy at CIM (Cleveland) for voice. NEC is more risky.</p>
<p>Bard's environment is surely no less unappealing than Oberlin and Lawrence. If anything, it's more restrained.
The reason I pointed out the university affiliations of Mannes, CCM, and Eastman is that while students at those schools don't have the academic rigor of Rice, Northwestern, or Vanderbilt, they do have more liberty in terms of degree programs than do students at independent conservatories like Juilliard and Curtis. CIM is an interesting middle ground, since it is technically independent, but is adjacent to CWRU, and students are allowed to take electives or even minor in academic programs there, making the arrangement function more like Indiana or Cincinnati than Peabody-Hopkins, for example, even though Peabody is technically part of JHU.</p>
<p>OCU!!! Our voice faculty is absolutely incredible! i'm not just trying to recruit or anything. but i know how my voice teacher has helped me, and how my peers' voice teachers have helped them... classical training that can't be beat in my opinion. but i guess i'm a little bias...</p>
<p>I'm a high school senior going to college this fall, and I applied to a number of colleges as a music major in vocal performance. I have a similar question to calicomom's: What should I be looking for in a teacher when I go and have a trial lesson?</p>
<p>When I've asked before, I've been told that the important thing is that there is a rapport between myself and the teacher, and that I feel I've learned something, but my problem is I don't know how to tell that I'm being told the right things. I know that different teachers have different styles, but to me that just makes things more confusing. I just got out of an unhealthy situation with a previous teacher, so I don't really have anybody to mentor me through the process, and I'm just lost.</p>
<p>Also, is it common practice for voice faculty to send anything beyond a nice letter and some contact information to applicants that they want? Some of the places that I've auditioned have gone as far as to try to get me to commit on the spot or cancel any other college auditions I might have, and while it's nice and flattering and all, I don't know what to make of it (Good sign? Bad sign?).</p>
<p>If it makes a difference, the places I've applied are: UCSC, UCSD, UCSB, UCLA, USC/Thornton, Oberlin, Northwestern, Boston University, Johns Hopkins/Peabody, Yale, Tufts/NEC, and Harvard/NEC. The first two UC's are just because I'm in-state. Thanks!</p>
<p>Erlkonig,</p>
<p>Wer writeth so spaet? (Sorry, bad pun, I know.)</p>
<p>Check out the thread at</p>
<p>if you have not already done so. Look at some of lorelei's posts in particular.</p>
<p>I believe the Eastman School is best for vocal performance. How to judge? credentials of faculty, resources, history, success of alumni (singers Ren</p>
<p>Well, she didn't apply to Eastman!</p>
<p>Mom- the OP listed Eastman as one of the schools she was considering. I think Eastman is generally recognized among the top three. It is almost certainly among the top 5 for vocal performance. Indiana, Michigan, Julliard, and Cincinnati are good too, among others.</p>
<p>I can't believe so few have mentioned Peabody Conservatory/John Hopkins - they have sonme excellent voice teachers...</p>
<p>New England Conservatory, Eastman and Julliard probably have the best reputation. I have a good friend who did opera at NEC and loved it. There have been some complaints about the recent turnover of vocal faculty at NEC. Many singers seem to jump between these three schools for grad work etc.</p>