<p>why do you rank william and mary so low flopsy?</p>
<p>in tiers:</p>
<p>1: UCB, UVA, Michigan
2: UCLA, Wisconsin, UNC, WM
3: UT, UI, Ga Tech, UCSD</p>
<p>However, for specific fields, and for financial reasons these can easily change. I'd go to UNC over Michigan for journalism, or I'd go to Illinois over UVA for mechanical eng. And in the end a 3.5 from all of them gets you in my unscientific opinion the same "edge" over non Top tier universities (such as... Ohio State).</p>
<p>One thing that I disagree with on this thread is the idea the ADMISSION SELECTIVITY = QUALITY OF SCHOOL. Yes it's a component. I don't think Brown = Michigan on selectivity. However, there are many reasons I'd go to Michigan over Brown. Why? Quality of programs. So especially for William and Mary, and there was a huge debate on this website comparing it to Wisconsin, while it has awesome selectivity (awesome is debatable, I mean isn't public education for all?) the sheer number of top programs at Wisconsin makes it a peer institutions, despite the "easier" admission standards.</p>
<p>GradStudent:</p>
<p>I rank William and Mary low because I am an ignorant rabbit with a West Coast bias.</p>
<p>Haha <em>nibbles on vegetables</em></p>
<p>I know it's good, though.</p>
<p>GradStudent,</p>
<p>The numbers game you are playing and the information about medical schools is completely irrelevant to overall undergraduate quality and experience. UT has a much more presitigious reputation (based on what people here have said) and outside of California I'm sure most people would go "Davis? Huh?". Also, for someone interested in Advertising or Marketing, I couldn't care less about the number of NAE members a school has.</p>
<p>UC Berkeley (pretty clear cut number 1)
Virginia
Michigan
UCLA
UNC-Chapel Hill
UW-Madison
UCSD
William and Mary
GTech
UT-Austin
UIUC</p>
<p>
[quote]
no honors program, no opportunities, no diversity
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Well, you might want to reconsider your anger. I'm not sure you heard or intepreted the information correctly.</p>
<p>It wouldn't surprise me if there were "no honors program"--the selectivity and rigor of the school make it superfluous. </p>
<p>"No opportunities?" Now what does that mean?</p>
<p>"No diversity?" This was the assistant director of admissions told you? Are you sure?</p>
<p>
[quote]
"No opportunities?" Now what does that mean?
[/quote]
As in internships or resources close by. All he said that there is an Alumni office in Washington, DC, and some students go there for a semester or something. If that's the case, I'd rather go somewhere IN DC itself.</p>
<p>
[quote]
"No diversity?" This was the assistant director of admissions told you? Are you sure?
[/quote]
We asked about diversity at WM, and he gave us this look that said "Why did you have to ask me about that?" Then he struggled to get out, "Uhh... We're working on it. We aren't there yet, though".</p>
<p>I disagree that UCB is a clear cut #1, UVA has been ranked #1 multiple years as well.'</p>
<p>When US News ranked "commitment to teaching", W&M came in #1 in publics.</p>
<p>Here's something else to consider, the undergrad enrollment at the schools (from collegeboard):</p>
<p>UCB: 22,880
UVA: 13,231
UNCCH: 16,065
Texas: 36,478
Michigan: 24,677
UCLA: 24,946
UW-M: 28,217
Illinois UC: 28,931
UCSD: 20,339
W&M: 5,582</p>
<p>W&M is clearly the odd one out. Whether that's good or bad, is obviously up to individual preference.</p>
<p>As for W&M re: theoneo</p>
<p>W&M has College Scholars, which I'm pretty sure come with money. Of course, with my entering class (fall 04) there were only 4 of them. There is also the Monroe Scholars program, which also doesn't get aid, but does get research money. There are also Sharpe Scholars, which focus on community service, and have nothing to do with academics. W&M is 80% white. If you come from a school that's 99% white, it will seem diverse. If you come from a school that's 50% white, it won't.</p>
<p>As for internships, there's internships (or volunteer opportunities) in the area, of course they relate to what businesses are in the area. There's a hospital, etc. Clearly, you won't find any government internships in Williamsburg.</p>
<p>"Texas: 36,478"</p>
<p>WOW (blown away).</p>
<p>kcirsch,</p>
<p>I am not playing a numbers game. I am just presenting research funding as a point of reference for the research activity that goes on at these campuses. I agree with you that this may not have much to do with overall undergrad quality and experience. So why do you contend that UT provides that much better undergrad quality and experience than Davis or Irvine (If you do)? You say that most ppl on the board agree that UT is more prestigious than UCD or UCI but how does that claim transfer to your criteria of undergrad quality and experience? Prestige, quality and experience are all different things. As for your last remark, I again was just prefacing that UT and UCD have different areas of strengh and weakness. If UT is better for advertising and marketing, go for it. I am not trying to convince you that UCD is a better school than UT-A but that UCD is a good school with alot of resource and expertise in its own right.</p>
<p>
[QUOTE]
If you are at a very high-performing high school where half the class has taken rigorous curriculum and has stats good enough to get into top universities, you are not going to get refused by UC just because you are "only" in the top 15% of your class.
[/QUOTE]
</p>
<p>Ever wonder why Cal State-Hayward (I'm hearing it called East Bay since I left) and San Francisco State are in such close proximity to UCBerkeley?</p>
<p>Do any other states have this situation, where two state university are within 20 minutes of each other, probably even closer if all transit goes right.</p>
<p>Ah... I also agree with the sentiment that UT is heavily underrated. I obviously have a bit of a bias in this field though. As all of us 'longhorns' know, UT was ranked in the top 15 worldwide by a The Times of London (a more comprehensive list of top universities: <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Times_Higher_Education_Supplement#Top_universities_worldwide_by_research_impact)%5B/url%5D">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Times_Higher_Education_Supplement#Top_universities_worldwide_by_research_impact)</a>. Although that is strecthing it a bit, I would personally rank UT as second (after UC-B) (or third, after UMich) best public school. UT's endowment is the 4th largest in the nation (after Harvard, Stanford, and Yale). All of those numbers aside, I believe that UT's rank would shoot up like crazy if they became a bit more selective in their admissions process. A lot of students just stay at UT taking easy classes and barely passing... they go to school for the parties...</p>
<p>Also, different school have different specialities. UT has engineering (especially petroleum, for obvious reasons), law, etc...</p>
<p>To give an example: the average SAT of incoming student in my major (in the College of Liberal Arts, which isnt a very reputed college at UT) is around 1444 (entering freshman of 2004).</p>
<p>I've just thrown out a few numbers and I honestly hope that it doesnt come across as bragging.</p>
<p>peace
-Hindustani</p>
<p>edit: I heard a while back that UT is going to start a medical school.. Is that true and if it is, when is it going to open?</p>
<p>hindu - </p>
<p>The times london ranking is a joke. It placed Duke ahead of texas. Its endowment is large but look at the student population...how are you able to compare this to schools like Yale and Harvard and have such exponentially little students? You think Texas is a better school that UVA? I dont think so but texas is an awesome school, certainly on par with Wisconsin and Illinois OVERALL and comparable if not better than Berkeley, UVA, Mich. on many levels.</p>
<p>Your faculty has an incoming avg of 1444? You MUST be at an honors college, which we all know are very selective. UF's honors college is 1400 MINIMUM for entrance.</p>
<p>"The Killers met at UNLV . . ."</p>
<p>the killers also suck.</p>
<p>haha ouch. No they don't.</p>
<p>
[quote]
I disagree that UCB is a clear cut #1, UVA has been ranked #1 multiple years as well.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>UVa is ranked with Berkeley only according to the current USNews formula. Take a step outside your USNews magazines, and you'll quickly find that UVa doesn't hold a candle to Berkeley.</p>
<p>Faculty, resources, programs, reputation both domestically and internationally, selectivity according to USNews (UCB = 13, UVa = 2x).</p>
<p>Take a glance at all that, and UVa really pales in comparison.</p>
<p>The key is quality for undergrad versus the overall quality and strength of the school. They may be vastly different.</p>
<p>I must agree with you Kazz, Cal is clearly the best state university in the nation. Michigan and UVA are awesome, but Cal is in a league of its own.</p>
<p>i know weve gone over this many times but i think the clear distinction between Cal UVA and Mich is the strength of Cal's grad programs. Cal's grad programs compete with the best of em.</p>