<p>Impw, I totally get what you are saying. We are pretty much in the same boat. I don't think our children really can get their heads around racism, especially if you live in any of the east or west coast suburban areas. It is something you try to "educate" them about it but they don't really see what we see.</p>
<p>Milkandsugar, I so totally agree. It's what our grandparents and parents dreamed of, a day when we did not have to think about racism. And most days, it's fine, but then you will hear a tragic news story, and the fear returns, at least for me. So, do I ignore it and keep on, or do I talk to my son more about racism and what it could mean for his life in this country?</p>
<p>Jack and Jill seems elist.</p>
<p>^They are. I know quite a few of them. You have to be i..n..v..i..t..e..d.
Pretentious and believe they have the handle on the black elite.</p>
<p>WOW--I don't check for board for 3 days and look what I missed!</p>
<p>This is a great discussion and I can only amplify sentiments already posted. Interestingly enough DS son who loudly proclaimed to live in a "post racial" society is one of the most fervent Obama supporters I have encountered. This is from a kid who had absolutely no interest in politics a year ago. I am no psychologist but I think the reason may be that for once someone who looks like him might just be the next President of the US (ps every one please encourage others to register to vote).</p>
<p>This self reflective awakening has ignited a passion because for once he perceives that it's ok to be smart AND black. He also found this to be true at LEAD which put him in an environment where there are plenty of ambitious, smart young people who priotize education just like him but even better--look like him. I must admit this racial conscious awakening on his part makes me very happy. </p>
<p>As to who he dates. As I have said to him many times. I don't care if she is black, white or asian. She just better not be stupid.</p>
<p>Triguena, I liked your post. Obama hs really changed the game. My fear is if he doesn't get elected, where does that leave us? He overwhelmingly got blacks to get out and register, young and old all across the board. Where do we go from here?</p>
<p>M&S--it leaves us in place where being just mediocre is praised. I don't want to hijack this thread b/c there are some many good ideas flying but as a slight digression--WTH is up with the love for Sarah Pallin. If I hear one more person proclaim "I like her b/c it shows ANYBODY can be President" I'll scream. I don't want ANYBODY-- I want someone who is smart and worldly and diplomatic, and introspective and smart and smart and smart.</p>
<p>One last thing. Forget having a "black friend". Has she ever met a black person?</p>
<p>I agree society is transitioning in ways that seem to make race much less important than in the past. I think that's great. However, I'm also not ready to declare we live in a post racial society by any means. </p>
<p>Thus, I see no problem discussing with our children the historical context of our society, or the various ways that the legacy of racism influences present conditions. The fact that there has been so much progress over the most recent decades is a great story and that helps. I want them to know they are the benefactors of the contributions and struggles of many great people, including their grandparents. That's very different from teaching them to be hypersensitive about race. Yet, understanding such things helps make them more capable of dealing with racial issues, if and when, they are ever personally confronted with them. I think that's about the best I can do regarding such matters.</p>
<p>I agree with you Triguena about SP. I don't get it either. I just chalk it up to too many reality tv shows. Now it seems just about everything has an American Idol/ Survivor series mentality attached -- even national elections. Very frustrating to see.</p>
<p>I am still debating who I will vote for, but I tell you, it's a great day when America has a 1/2 African, 1/2 European American in the running for President. I hope his genealogy can be completed and Native American ancestry is found too. How fitting for a country such as this one. :)</p>
<p>FLAVADAD, good correlation about reality tv.</p>
<p>I am also overwhelmed by this putdown of highly educated people (particularly the Obamas who have been referred to as "uppidy" and "elitist"). Now that all of the education is the side of this impressive Black couple, ignorance (and small town earthiness is somehow celebrated). No Black person who has gone to six colleges and has the checkered background as Palin could be taken seriously. If she and McCain win, then there is no better example to our kids about the continued importance of race in this country. Any White person is better than this Ivy league educated Black man. McCain graduated fifth from the botton of his class. If he were Black, this would be pointed out repeatedly (affirmative action choice, no doubt). We always have to be better educated for most things (and even then, the education becomes a handicap rather than an asset). I heard on the radio that one third of Black people eligible to vote are unregistered. Even a white guy commented that if Obama's candidacy isn't an incentive for Black people to register to vote, what is?? The thought of having an intelligent, accomplished Black woman as First Lady and to see these two wonderful Black girls grow up in the White House should be something all of should want - not only for our kids to witnessed, but the world. I was in Europe this summer and everywhere I went, there was so much excitement about Obama. This country has such a racist image that each country I visited, people expressed pleasure and shock that a Black man could be seriously considered for President of this country. I honestly can't comprehend a Black person not supporting Obama considering the options. I was listening to one commentator who pointed out that there were only 36 Black delegates at the Republican Convention. They said at least the Bushs know Black folks, McCain doesn't at all. We're not on his radar. Sorry to go off on the political bandwagon.</p>
<p>Um, maybe because Sarah Palin might actually bring change? </p>
<p>Seriously, it is sad that the top of the Democratic ticket is being compared to the bottom of the Republican ticket. It means that ppl are going to lower Obama in their perception, which is good because then maybe he will not win.</p>
<p>
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" I think the reason may be that for once someone who looks like him might just be the next President of the US"
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</p>
<p>I think it would be better to get excited about a person who represents you rather than who looks like you. That is why Sarah Palin is popular, because she represents a lot of people out there, from being pro-life (like me :)), to a hunter, to a mom, and even being a professional.</p>
<p>I support Palin because she represents me moreso than Barack Obama. I think it is bad and not very post-racial to support a candidate only because they look like you, if they do not hold your own positions.</p>
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"I honestly can't comprehend a Black person not supporting Obama.
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</p>
<p>I can because I am Christian and since Barack Obama supports abortion I will not vote for him. To me the lives of innocents are more important than the color of a persons skin. </p>
<p>Also Obama's whole economic distribution thing and universal healthcare (which is not universal under the plan) seems like a step toward socialism, and if we go there then this country is really in danger.</p>
<p>There is room under the Christian tent for all. My religion has been co-oped by the Political Right in an insidious manner that would require me to choose between my political beliefs and my church. It is a choice I refuse to make. The key word here is choice.</p>
<p>Dbate you fear "socialism." Is it socialism that gives poor children possibly their only hot meal in the day (federal school lunch program). Is it socialism to make sure that the elderly have at least a minimal income after retirement (Social Security). Is it socialism for poor students to have access to low interest loans (Pell program). We, as a caring community, have the duty to insure that basic health care is available to all--not just those of us fortunate enough to work for an employer that allows us to buy the benefit. </p>
<p>One thing I do agree w/ Dbate--let's stop comparing Obama with Pallin. There is no possible comparison and we are playing right into their hand.</p>
<p>I'm curious why Dbate is even on this thread. I'm not going to argue about voting for Palin or anyone else because they are "Christian". I'm also a Christian and so is Obama. I believe in choice. Bob Herbert wrote an excellent Op Ed piece in the New York Times a couple of days ago pointing out all of the things that "liberals" have done for this country, some were mentioned by Triguena - student loans, social security, medicare, medicad and many, many other things that help make our society a better and more livable one. Dbate, how does being a hunter or a mother qualify someone for high political office. Is this a joke?</p>
<p>^No, read some of Dbate's posts. He is a proud conservative republican.</p>
<p>Having lived in the South, Northeast, and Upper Midwest, I have to say I vastly prefer the midwest. That despite having grown up in the Northeast. The South is no place for this black man. I'm just not comfortable with Southern mores and traditions. </p>
<p>As a black man, I found the Minnesota/Iowa/North Dakota area almost a relief from East Coast racial tension. True, encountering blacks was not an every day experience (like in the Northeast) but it didn't matter. I always found the tribalism and tight ethnic neighborhoods of the Northeast a major turnoff. I guess I'm a believer in integration.</p>
<p>For that reason, I fear sending my D to a Northeast school where she might encounter ethnic "houses" or race-based dorms. I've heard they are very popular at Cornell U. and other schools. That just isn't consistent with MLK's dream. The last thing I want is for her to feel she has to sit at the "black" table in the dining hall or be ostracized by black students when it comes to social engagements or study groups. Haven't we gotten past that B.S. by now?</p>
<p>plainsman, don't fear. We live in the northeast. Most schools that we visited here are diverse. At her college in the northeast, she has never felt that she had to identify with any one group. She associates with people of like mind, interests and intelligence and no one cares who you are with. When I walk around her campus, I see different groups of students that are so mixed. One of the great things about colleges in the northeast is that it attracts all sorts of students from around the country and abroad. I find that younger people have less issues with crossing cultural lines than older people.</p>
<p>
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"Dbate you fear "socialism.""
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</p>
<p>No, the things you list are the good things. But socialism requires that the government provide them, once the government is the one providing something then the government can take it away. That is my fear.</p>
<p>When the government has the power to take away your health care, or your education, or your food, then the government has coercive power. There was actually a debate topic on government providing healthcare and coercive power was a counter-arguement.</p>
<p>I fear that when the government is allowed to give the neccesities that we need then the government will be able to control us because we would need them. When ppl think of "government" they tend to think of this entity, but government is only a conglomeration of ppl. Ppl innate are bad and I think crave power, once we set up a system that can manipulate ppl then we can be controlled.</p>
<p>A closer example is when ppl should say we are greatful that america gives us our rights. This is exactly what I am saying, when government gives rights it means we have an obligation to government, and that government can take it away.<br>
But if our rights are ours and we provide things like:food, education, and healthcare for ourselves, then the government can not take it away. That is why I believe in capitalism, because capitalism is private ownership, whereas socialism is government ownership.</p>
<p>That is one of the reasons why I am a conservative.</p>
<p>
[quote]
"I'm curious why Dbate is even on this thread."
[/quote]
</p>
<p>I am sorry I did not know that middle class black posters was code for Obama supporters only. And if you look back a few pages, you will see the discussion I was having before.</p>