Off topic, but many, many people need or prefer to wfh. Those with childcare or eldercare responsibilities, long commutes, financial constraints as well as minorities and women consistently poll that they prefer wfh. But unencumbered young people may return.
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Many who were new hires just before covid hit talked about the difficulty they had getting a sense of connection with their team/colleagues. There is something to be said for face to face activity in the office. Seems many of the companies are setting hybrid models, where there come in to the office a few days a week. Perhaps if/when they hire new hires, the expectation/requirement for in office time will be clear at the time of the hiring process, with some individual manager desires as well.
One of my kids moved a bit farther from his office, the other closer to his office. He and his w chose to move up to SF to enjoy city life before they had kids. Unfortunately that was in Jan 2020. Cue covid! So now over 3 years later, they moved back down to SV, though walkability was still important to them. They now have a 1 yr old so that played into the decision.
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It is not the new hires straight from school who are reluctant to come in. They enjoy the socialization with other 20 somethings. My DD rarely sees anyone over 30 and never anyone over 40 in the office when she goes in.
Not necessarily talking about the right-out-of-school young hires. Many change jobs (this seems to happen a lot, and seems to be the rule, not the exception) or hire on after completing an advanced degree and already have families, etc. A “new hire” can be any age.
It’s noticeable that senior people tend to count work travel as their in-office days, so if they are traveling 3-4 days per week they never come into the office.
I was just talking to a neighbor who is a mid-level manager and is moving on because he no longer gets any mentoring from the partners in his current firm.
That’s exactly what my son did. He graduated in 2019 and just moved to another job in Jan. His team works 3 in and 2 remote. They can go in more if they need or want to.
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With respect to a city-to-city comparison, Detroit’s image as the
Paris of the Midwest extended into the 1920s.
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And everyone counts a holiday as an “in-office” day!
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Discussion at our neighborhood gathering last night was deeply negative about the prospects for tech, much of the conversation was about “how long will your funding last”?
And we are now getting advertising postcards from realtors (clearly directed at H1-B holders) offering to help pack up and sell your house if you have to leave the country…
This was a striking chart which makes me think the financial markets haven’t really caught up yet:
From https://twitter.com/marlin_capital/status/1654470761955078148
To get back to the crime in SF, we’re visiting our techie kid there right now. I’ve noticed less people in the city, cleaner, have only seen a few homeless guys roaming around, talking to themselves. It may be just a matter of luck and where we’re walking, but it seems safer and nicer than it’s been in recent years. I’m hoping we have the same experience today! Staying at a hotel that used to be costlier before. It’s quite nice, but our son says that commercial buildings have a 30% vacancy rate, so that can’t be good.
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My husband used to commute to South SF just before the pandemic. The hotel prices were INSANE. $400 a night at a Motel 6 type place on some days when a large convention was held there. Just crazy. Not sustainable. The same hotels seem to be bargain priced now!
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That is crazy for a crummy hotel! We are staying in a very nice hotel in the middle of turn for $180. This place was always over $300-$400 before, so I never booked it.
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I’m enjoying a fine day in the city, save for a bit of rain. My childhood neighborhood is crowded with families with dogs and young kids at a cute little farmer’s market that wasn’t there when I was growing up. I love seeing that the same independent bookstore, children’s clothier, and coffee spot are all still there! Alas, it is still quite hard to park. Anyway, happy Saturday to all!
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I was just in SF for two day in April (on a cruise ship and we overnighted there). The first day we went to Sausilito, but we walked the entire waterfront. We actually commented on how few people there were in the city, especially workers. We sailed in under the Golden Gate at 7 am and it wasn’t busy at all (few commuters). Same with the Bay Bridge, just no traffic. There were a few homeless people on the sidewalks, but not nearly as many as I see every day if I walk to the bus in Denver. Where we did notice how bad it was was by Fisherman’s Wharf. More than a few restaurants out of business and homeless sleeping in the doorways.
The second day we walked (and walked and walked) around the city. North beach and Chinatown were not that busy. Took several Cable Cars and they weren’t busy either. We did run into several high school groups at a journalism conference, but school groups aren’t going to spend enough money to support tourism.
I didn’t feel it was unsafe, but we didn’t go into the city at night. It also just didn’t seem as fun a city as it was when I’ve been before (many times).
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We had that happen to us 5 years ago when our granddaughter was born. I had a broken ankle and was on a knee scooter so wanted to stay somewhere easy to manage. There was some HUGE annual tech conference going on and the hotel price was like 4x the normal price!
The city is definitely cleaner than it has been, but downtown feels somewhat deserted and lacking energy. And all the “For Lease” signs in the windows is very depressing.
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I get what you’re saying, but actually, we haven’t seen a bunch of vacant buildings. It seems like a lot of economic activity, just not as much as before. I haven’t had to step over any vomit or feces, and only had to cross the street once to avoid a crazy guy. Low bar, I know, but it just seems better.
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My son is a software engineer for Google in Mountainview and chooses to live in SF because Mountainview is just a suburb - said he could have stayed in Atlanta if he wanted to live in the suburbs for less money. SF is about as safe as Atlanta, maybe more safe. He also is very glad to be back in office 3 days a week - he agrees with those who believe creativity in person to person communication is much greater than via online meetings…there is an energy and atmosphere that cannot be duplicated remotely. His opinion, but he said many of his coworkers feel the same way.
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There are benefits to living near the mothership, especially if team members are nearby.
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Our S lives just down the road from Google HQ. He prefers living outside SF (different strokes, different folks). He started going into his office area as soon as they allowed it. Early on it was usually just him and his manager, but now, in-office time is required so more and more are back. He has been in office 5 days a week for quite a while now (unless he has outside appointments. Group get togethers are now more frequent and things are slowly getting back to “near normal”.
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