schools, suitable for: double major Bio/Engl + pre-med preparation

College Search & Selection
1

<p>Hi all. I'd be very thankful if you could help me with my college search. In brief, here's what I am looking for:</p>

<p>LAC or a polytechnic institute /I'm not into huge universities for a Bachelors degree/
size: not super-small
selectivity: ideally, something that accepts less than 35% of the applicants
place: East Coast preference, but, again, not a big deal
majors: strong curriculum, teaching, etc. in Biology (especially Molecular & Genetics) + English literature or Creative Writing. My engl/writing major will be my back up, if med school does not work out I will get a Masters in teaching.
career plans: I am planning to study medicine and will probably be research oriented, so I think that colleges that offer the most research opportunities will be the best for me (so that I can get a feel of it and see if it is for me)
I like an arty, yet academically challenging atmosphere, and it is important for me to be at a school where the community is not too heavily involved with drugs or alcohol abuse (I am straight edge).</p>

<p>Thanks in advance!</p>

2

<p>Cyan,</p>

<p>The short answer to your question is that there are many colleges and universities in the USA where you can complete a double major in Biology and English, and take the pre-med coursework.</p>

<p>However, for you to receive a more useful answer to your question, you first need to consider the following questions. How you answer them will help the rest of us help you.</p>

<p>1) As an International Student, just exactly how do you plan to pay for your education in the USA? How much money do you and your family have available? Will this be available for the eight or nine years that a Bachelor’s plus Med School will require?</p>

<p>2) If you do complete a medical degree, where do you plan to practice medicine? </p>

<p>3) If you plan to practice in Bulgaria, what evidence do you have that a US medical degree will allow you to practice medicine there, and will be more useful to you when you look for a job than a Bulgarian degree would be?</p>

<p>4) If you hope to practice in the USA, what evidence do you have that a US degree will get you a job with a work visa here? Would it be better to do medical school in Bulgaria (or elsewhere) and then come to the US for your medical residency?</p>

<p>5) If you decide to pursue an M.A.T., where do you plan to teach?</p>

<p>6) Have you discussed your interests and goals with the college advisor(s) at the international school you are currently attending? What advice did they give you?</p>

<p>7) Have you visited the Bulgarian office of EducationUSA to seek the advice of the college advisors there? If you haven’t, here is the main website, and the address for the office in Sofia:</p>

<p><a href=“http://educationusa.state.gov/undergrad.htm[/url]”>http://educationusa.state.gov/undergrad.htm&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>BULGARIAN-AMERICAN FULBRIGHT COMMISSION
17 Alexander Stamboliiski Blvd.
Sofia
BULGARIA 1000
tel: (+359) 2981 6830
e-mail: <a href=“mailto:steneva@fulbright.bg”>steneva@fulbright.bg</a>
website: [FULBRIGHT</a> Bulgarian-American Commission for Educational Exchange](<a href=“http://www.fulbright.bg/en/advising.htm]FULBRIGHT”>http://www.fulbright.bg/en/advising.htm)</p>

<p>8) Have you visited the Financial Aid, International Student, and Pre-Med & Medical School Forums here? If you haven’t, you can reach all of them by clicking on “Discussion Home” in the upper left of this screen and then scrolling down.</p>

3

<p>1) For my undergraduate studies, I am planning to apply for a scholarship. I have solid test scores , high GPA, diverse extracurricular, job experiences, so I am competitive. For med school, I’m fine with the idea of taking a loan if I have to (I know it is going to be huge, but still, dreams are high priced). My family doesn’t have much money, but I have my brains and my guts.</p>

<p>2) I’d prefer to work in an English speaking country. US will be great. </p>

<p>3) I want to practice in the US.</p>

<p>4) That’s a tough one. Finding a job is not too predictable. US degrees supposedly work in the US, especially when combined with actual knowledge, the grades, the ambition and the rest of the pack.
A Bulgarian degree is not useful for me, for many reasons. Some have to deal with the quality of education (which I doubt), others with the state of the health care, third with the financial and social state of the country as a whole. Bulgaria is a bad place to be a doc. It’s even worse for a research physician because the funding is almost nonexistent. Finally, I am allergic to the Bulgarian educational system. It’s a poor country that is going nowhere. It’s sad to say it, but things are what they are.</p>

<p>5) If I for an M.A.T., I would teach at an English-speaking institution. I love teaching, but not as much as medicine. Still, I am trying to keep my options open.</p>

<p>6) At my high school, we have highly qualified advisors. We’re working towards choosing schools and towards finding institutions where I could both fit and get financial aid. Currently the list compromises of about 20 institutions, I am planning to narrow them down to ten. I will apply to a chosen one ED, and if this does not work out, I will try at the rest. My first choice school is Oberlin.</p>

<p>I suppose I started this thread searching for some fresh opinions on schools. I mean, I know what I am doing and I have researched what would my educational path be in the US and in Bulgaria. I’ve dismissed the UK as an option along the way (not my type of country) and I have a few likes in Canada, but I am not too sure about that. I’ll benefit from US education the most. </p>

<p>However, trying to overcome my bias for certain schools (like extreme love for Oberlin - I am wondering if my judgment is rational enough), I though it might be good to ask some people I do not really know about their opinion. It is a way to put my thought in order. Perhaps I should have stated this right away, I have forgotten.</p>

<p>7) I prefer to rely on my counselor.</p>

<p>8) I’ve checked these places, thanks. :)</p>

4

<p>You sound like a perfect candidate for Johns Hopkins University.
For Pre-Med, they are in the top2 or at least top5 along with Harvard, Yale, and Stanford.
For Biology, Hopkins is particularly strong in your desired fields, and research is very very strong for undergraduates as well, as 80% of the student population conducts some form of research during undergrad at Hopkins and many students start in their Freshman year.
For English and Writing, Hopkins has been ranked pretty consistently within or around the top 10 for English and top 2 for Creative Writing (Writing Seminars). One of the professors (of the many great ones) for writing is Alice McDermott, a pretty famous author who you might have heard of.
Hopkins is pretty selective and acceptance rates range from 20-26% each year. It is east coast. Also, the student population on campus is only 5000+ with only 4400 or so undergraduates with 1,100-1,200 in each class/year.
If you want to study medicine and do research, Hopkins is arguably the best place to do it. As an undergraduate, you will be allowed to intern and research at the Hopkins Medical School, the Hopkins school of Public Health, the biotech labs, etc. Also, the faculty is full of very bright minds and pioneers in their respective fields.
In my opinion, Hopkins would be a perfect fit for you. Now, you’ll just have to see if you like Baltimore ;)</p>

5

<p>While I agree with Hope2getrice that Hopkins could potentially be a good fit for you, we really need a bit more information before helpful suggestions can be made. Quite frankly, there are dozens of colleges that could fit you at the moment (e.g. Swat, Haverford, Bryn Mawr, Allegheny, F&M, Bucknell, CMU, Gettysburg, Penn, Dickinson, and Susquehanna in Pennsylvania alone!).</p>

<p>So far we have:

  • Small/Medium (1000-10,000)
  • East coast (presumably the Northeast is meant)
  • Merit scholarships are a plus
  • Artsy yet challenging atmosphere</p>

<p>My questions to you:

  • Coed or single-sex?
  • Rural, suburban, or urban?</p>
6

<p>Definitely coed, and I’d prefer suburban, or just close (like, within 50-60 miles) to a big city.</p>

7

<p>Before I saw your second post, I was going to say that Oberlin sounded perfect for you, in all respects…</p>

8

<p>The College of William and Mary fits your criteria as well, although its merit aid is not extremely strong.
Suburban setting in a historic town an hour from Richmond and Newport News and 3 hours from DC. 6000 undergrads. 80% med school acceptance. Around the top 30 universities (the “College” is just for historic reasons) in the nation. About a 33% acceptance rate. Known for its academics yet not a competitive atmosphere. Its a combination of a research university and a LAC. </p>

<p>Hopkins sounds good as well.</p>

9

<p>Since you will essentially need a full-ride, you need to concentrate your efforts on the places that fully fund international students. This is a very short list. Any of them would serve your needs.</p>

<p>Whatever college or university you look at, check the website for information about funding for international students. If they won’t meet your full need, don’t spend another second looking at that website. As an international student with financial need, academic competitiveness is not enough. You will need a serious dose of luck. I would not recommend that you apply anywhere ED. You will need to be able to compare financial aid offers.</p>

<p>Happydad is a research biochemist. His lab group includes researchers from all over the world, with Ph.D. and M.D. degrees from their home countries. One of them has an M.D. from Romania, followed by post-graduate research in the Netherlands and Japan before ending up in the US. A career path like that might work for you if you are willing to start with a Bulgarian M.D. followed by research in a European lab. Please remember that as an international student, your financial and academic safety is not a school in the US. It is a school in your home country.</p>

<p>Believe me, I understand what you say about your home country. It is a truly challenging place to be! I also understand that you want to move to the US, and would like to be able to make your life and your career here. But please, please, keep your head on straight about this. It will not be a simple thing to do. You need to find a solid option closer to home in case things don’t work out the way you’d like them to.</p>

<p>Wishing you all the best.</p>

10

<p>Thank you a lot for the replies! (:</p>

11

<p>cyan, you seem to have thought through the process but I think you need to probe a little more deeply into how financial aid works. If your family doesn’t have much money you may be eligible for need based aid. You could use an on-line calculator to give a rough, rough idea of how much you would be expected to contribute. If that amount works for you, then you need to find out which colleges guarantee full-need for internationals. Make sure you have updated information on this because the rules have changed somewhat in the past few months.</p>

<p>If need-based aid isn’t enough for you then you will have to find colleges that offer merit aid to internationals. These are few and mostly not in the northeast.</p>

<p>I would suggest that you consider some of the more remotely located LACs that often recruit internationals as part of their effort to increase their diversity percentages. Some that fall into this category, but also have excellent academics, are Grinnell, Kenyon, Hamilton, Williams, Middlebury. I would also urge you not to eliminate women’s colleges, especially Smith and Mt. Holyoke. All of these would have what you’re looking for academically.</p>

<p>I’m not sure how Oberlin rates in fin-aid to internationals. If that’s your first choice, you should explore carefully before applying ED.</p>

12

<p>Medical school is definitely not a path I would recommend for an international students with financial restrictions for two reasons:</p>

<p>1) Medical school is very expensive and requires over 10 years of studying and working as an intern (very low pay and very long hours) before doctors are in a position to repay their loans, which sometimes run in the hundreds of thousands of dollars.</p>

<p>2) In the US, Medical schools seriously discriminate against international students. As such, even if you get into a good undergraduate institutions, graduate with a very good GPA (over 3.8) and do well on the MCAT (over a 33), there is still a good chance you will not get into Medical school. </p>

<p>If you really want to be a doctor in the US, I recommend you complete your medical school studies in Europe, where the standards are just as high but the cost is much more manageable, and then go to the US for your Medical school residency.</p>

<p>Of course, if you really want to complete your undergraduate studies in the US, you can also do so, but you will probably want to work as soon as you graduate, whether that be as an Engineer, Banker, Consultant etc…</p>

13

<p>Yeah, my first thought was Oberlin as well.</p>