<p>We have a mentally ill person in our family. The sort of ridiculous advice we get from simple minded people is excruciating at best. I can not even imagine being in the Rodger’s shoes. </p>
<p>Pizzagirl: I think your comments are illustrative of what is really going on in the discussion of how to prevent these killings. There are people who either own guns or understand why people want to own guns and there are those who don’t. It is a cultural thing, and a sort of knee jerk reaction to events like this. The fact that none of the gun control laws proposed or enacted would have prevented this killing spree or Sandy Hook or Aurora or Columbine seems not to matter. On the other hand, mental health issues run across all political groups and cultures in this country and therefore the debate about what to do is more nuanced. </p>
<p>Excellent article in the NYT by a psychiatrist/psychopharmacologist at Cornell Weill Medical college <a href=“Opinion | Why Can’t Doctors Identify Killers? - The New York Times”>Opinion | Why Can’t Doctors Identify Killers? - The New York Times;
<p>I do think having a loved one with mental illness gives you a totally different perspective. My son has treatable bi-polar disorder and is doing fine. But a young woman who is very dear to me suffers from mental illness that doesn’t respond as well to treatment. Despite her intelligence and talents, she may never be able to support herself or live without supervision. I watch her parents’ struggles with the same kind of “there but for the grace of god” feeling that I am trying to have when reacting to this situation. </p>
<p>If your adult child is enrolled in community college, there is no way for you to know whether they are attending classes, other than following them around. Because of FERPA, you don’t have access to their records. And even if you get the kid to waive FERPA, you still can’t find out. </p>
<p>And even if your child is in a program that you pay thousands of dollars a year to monitor your kid and make sure they are progressing in class, you STILL can’t get reliable information. </p>
<p>Not that I would know anything about that.</p>
<p>I agree with Pizzagirl. A big issue with mental problems is that are often not consistent so any plan of treatment can go right out the window with a turn of events. My friends sister worked in a bank for years. Yet, there were times she HAD to be restrained and anyone seeing her then, would think she should be institutionalized for life. She was a valued bank employee that those who so saw her would not believe for an instant she could go so low. When she is up, she can pass any psych eval. When down, not any. </p>
<p>From the CDC, the number of unintentional deaths from fire arms for children aged 1-14 in 2010 (the most recent year available), is 62. See, <a href=“http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/pressroom/FIREARM_DEATHS_AND_DEATH_RATES.pdf”>NCHS - 404 Error - Resource Not Available;
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<p>It seems to me that he was terribly sad and lonely and didn’t think he had a reason to continue living. In his deranged mind, he was killing himself in a spectacular manner. Just like other suicides, in their deranged minds, think “I’ll show THEM,” he wanted to show THEM.</p>
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<p>FYI, possession of or even trying to purchase most firecrackers beyond sparklers is effectively banned and being caught will result in large fines and/or prison time in my area. </p>
<p>Also, some residential apartments…including co-op/condos have terms which made discovery of a unit owner being in possession of such in a unit one sufficient ground to force a sell to get the unit/owner and/or renter kicked out. </p>
<p>While firecrackers more powerful than sparklers was technically already illegal during my '80s childhood, it used to be strongly winked at by local authorities considering how easy and openly firecracker vendors came right before 4th of July and Lunar New Year in NYC. I’m not talking small stuff, but even ones like M-80s and M-100s.</p>
<p>Once Mayor Giuliani came into office, however, there was a major crackdown on selling and possession of fireworks and this continues into the present time. </p>
<p>There’s a major visible difference in seeing how 4th of July and Lunar New Year was celebrated by groups and individuals not affiliated with any official licensed fireworks groups during the '80s and extreme early '90s and afterward. </p>
<p>"The fact that none of the gun control laws proposed or enacted would have prevented this killing spree or Sandy Hook or Aurora or Columbine seems not to matter. "</p>
<p>Yes, that’s right. That’s exactly why things like Sandy Hook and Aurora and Columbine and VA Tech and so on and so forth happen at pretty much the same rate in the US as in Western Europe and Australia. Isn’t that right, TatinG?</p>
<p>The psychiatrist’s article in the NY Times makes a good point. If we want to disallow gun purchases to people with diagnosed mental illnesses, we should also disallow gun purchases to alcoholics. </p>
<p>"There are people who either own guns or understand why people want to own guns and there are those who don’t. It is a cultural thing, and a sort of knee jerk reaction to events like this. "</p>
<p>Oh, absolutely, it’s a cultural thing. And I have no problems saying that I look down on some cultures. I look down on the gun-owning and gun-promoting culture just as much as I’d look down on the Kardashians or Honey Boo Boo. I see no reason I have to pretend all cultures are equal in value or worthy of my respect. </p>
<p>In order to get rid of all the guns in this country, some 400 million, there would have to be massive confiscation effort. In order to confiscate all the guns, police would have to enter every home, apartment, shed and outbuilding in this country, without a warrant, turn everything upside down, destroy property, use Nazi like tactics to find them all and confiscate them. Does anyone really want that? </p>
<p>So we have to get real and find workable ways to deal with those who would commit these types of atrocities.</p>
<p>Well, I think shaming of those who own guns is just fine with me. I want the reaction upon hearing that someone owns a gun to be … “eeeeeewwww, really?” and turn away with disgust. Not that it’s just another lifestyle choice.</p>
<p>We demonized smoking … why can’t we demonize guns? </p>
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<p>I want fewer deaths overall. That includes
Hammer/machete deaths.
Knife/blunt object deaths
Gun deaths.
Drunk driving deaths.
Car accidents.
Purposeful car killing.
Drowning deaths.
Obesity related deaths.
Tobacco related deaths.
Drug related deaths.
Alcohol related deaths.</p>
<p>It is really hard to legislate around stupid people doing stupid and irresponsible things. We learned that from the war on drugs and are losing efforts on stemming obesity, alcoholism, etc…</p>
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<p>A gun doesn’t can get up and kill people either. Unless it is an “automatic”, or “semi-automatics” if it has that feature</p>
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<p>So you are okay with something that kills people as long as other people use it for a recreational activity?</p>
<p>Many do do demonize guns. Demonizing doesn’t do anything. And plenty of people still smoke, too. </p>
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<p>So? This has nothing to do with anything.
You claimed that ammunition is unsafe because of all that gunpowder in them.
I pointed out how “dangerous” they are using the firecrackers as an analogy.
No one said that firecrackers are legal or should be.
Owning ammunition is.</p>
<p>Have you found any references yet to cities that prohibit ammunition that you cited?
I am curious as to how that works.</p>
<p>Pizzagirl: And yet none of the killers in the recent mass killings have been from those types of people that you culturally despise. None of these mentally off young men have been hillbillies, rednecks, hunters, or even rural people. Rodger was a suburbanite, So was Lanza. So was Cho, the VT killer. So were the Columbine killers, the Springfield, Oregon killer, the Aurora killer, and on and on. </p>
<p>Most of the street murders in this country are done by gangbangers, drug lords, urban street thugs, a ‘culture’ not mentioned as one you despise.</p>
<p>So what? That’s not the point. It’s that because we have to indulge the sensibilities of red-state bubbas who proclaim that the Second Amendment is the most important amendment of all, that we don’t have the kind of very strong gun control legislation we need - so therefore the urban gangbangers / drug lords / thugs AND the mentally disturbed suburbanites AND innocent-little-kids wind up having access to guns in a way that they simply don’t have in Western Europe and Australia. I’m no fan of urban gangbangers and drug lords either, just to be clear. </p>
<p>Do you really think that any Congress is every going to vote to repeal the Second Amendment? And then do you think that the requisite number of states (is it 2/3rds or 3/4ths?) would also vote to repeal it? And then the drug lords, street gangs and other criminals would meekly turn the guns in? </p>
<p>So to be real, something else to curb crime and mental illness has to be done. </p>
<p>Sort of off-topic, but for the last couple of days, I’ve suddenly remembered the Richard Speck killings. When I was a kid in Illinois, this was all over the news and what everyone talked about for months. For those who don’t recall Richard Speck using only a knife, invaded a Chicago apartment and killed eight student nurses, one by one. One woman survived by hiding. </p>