I just realized I should’ve weighted in state percentage by size of school which adjusts the 84% down to 82%.
I think you could clone UC-B, even move all the professors to the new UC, even move the sports teams, and you’d still not get students, California or OOS, to move to UC-Bakersfield or UC-Redding. Location location location. No matter what California does, there will never be enough room at UCLA and Cal for all the instate students who want to go there. California has given other options (Merced or Riverside) and that’s not good enough for those who want to go to Cal or UCLA.
Michigan, Wisconsin, Maryland, Florida all deal with this. The flagships can’t admit all who want to attend. They make other schools attractive. Special program, new and shiny labs and 3D printers, and $$$. More scholarships, cheaper dorms and meal plans, study abroad.C
Californians need to stop looking at Merced and Riverside as lesser schools. Maybe UCLA and Cal need to accept fewer Californian, making the school unavailable to MORE students so they are funneled to Merced and Riverside. The state could pump ALL the money in to those campuses until they are more attractive to instate students. Colorado does that. CU-Boulder is a lot more expensive than other schools in the state. It doesn’t matter to most and they’d still be happy to pay more at Boulder than UC-Colorado Springs, but it does make the other schools an option for some.
Check again at: https://www.universityofcalifornia.edu/infocenter/fall-enrollment-glance
34% is too high for UCB OOS enrollment.
I get 24.6% for 2017 total undergraduate OOS enrollment at UCB. So that is presumably UCB’s new cap. That is the highest level in the UC system. So OOS undergrads are capped at 18 to 24.6%, depending on the campus.
The percentage of OOS freshman can be higher than the cap, because the UCs also admit undergraduates via transfer. There are relatively few OOS transfers, and that will bring down the OOS percentage in the total enrollment.
I get 17.2% total undergraduate OOS enrollment systemwide. So 82.8% of UC undergraduates are in-state. This number could drop slightly in the future, probably to around 80%, because some campuses (notably UCSC, UCR, and UCM) are well under their caps, and theoretically can continue to add more OOS students.
You’re right - Bad Math. 25%. I would edit it if I could. 25% makes my point even better - its not exactly overrun by OOS students.
There was a time, believe it or not, when the demand for real estate in coastal California was manageable, even in places like the Bay Area, or West LA, or Santa Barbara, or La Jolla. So you could actually find affordable housing there.
But times change. Now there is way more demand for real estate in coastal California. Places like the Bay Area, or West LA, or Santa Barbara, or La Jolla have become unaffordable, due to the high demand. There is no easy solution for this.
Today, if you want California real estate that is not prohibitively expensive, you have to look inland, to places like the Central Valley or the Inland Empire. This may fall short of your California dream, but that’s the reality.
There was a time, believe it or not, when the demand for higher education in coastal California was manageable, even in places like the Bay Area, or West LA, or Santa Barbara, or La Jolla. So you could actually find accessible state universities there.
But times change. Now there is way more demand for subsidized higher education in coastal California. Campuses like UCB, or UCLA, or UCSB, or UCSD have become inaccessible, due to the high demand. There is no easy solution for this.
Today, if you want California-subsidized higher education that is not prohibitively competitive, you have to look inland, to places like the Central Valley or the Inland Empire. This may fall short of your California dream, but that’s the reality.
The truth is a lot of the students going to the schools can’t afford the schools. If you could offer me guaranteed room and board at Merced or Riverside or any potential future campus over just tuition that’s a great deal for a lot of students just looking to get away from home.
I think a lot of people are naive to how hard college living is in California specifically because of the the cost of living. It’s what the privates can do and the public schools can’t afford to do. Paying to live three and four to a bedroom isn’t a great college experience over getting your own one bedroom at Merced or Riverside under scholarship.
There are people that can’t afford to comfortably live where they go to school or work, which affects studying. If it’s just about a degree, you can get your undergrad from any decent university and have a chance at grad school. Those students are the ones that should consider Merced if given with a full ride to grow that university.
@Parent90278 “At a minimum I think the UC schools are confusing the students in that many students look at the student profile and think they have more than the credentials to get in but don’t.”
But here’s what you’re not understanding. Many more students have the stats than there are spots. That is due to growing population (especially in CA). Many kids have the stats fo Ivy league schools. Does that mean they will get into any of them? No - the stats are not on their side with single digit acceptance rates. The schools are looking for specific and unique students. That is what holistic admissions is about. Have you gone on Stanford’s tour? They explain that meeting the stats is just one aspect of an application. They are looking for students that have unique interests and are blazing new grounds. The examples they gave, both verbally and in the slide show, were examples of students discovering things that will impact the human experience on our planet and/or kids that have achieved at a national level - often in a unique sport - or in a sport the school needs for fielding their teams. They have many Olympic swimmers and divers, for instance, as does UC-Berkeley.
Again, these are world class universities. For instance, a student in my son’s school is dreaming of going to Berkeley (from out of state) and he is already taking advanced college math courses in 10th grade and has some unique aspects to his resume. My guess is he will get in…by then he will likely have done far more. So the stats don’t tell the full story. Yeah, he will have high grades and SAT, but dig deeper and there’s much more. That is what world class academic institutions are looking for. And I think the Californians that are “mad” about this simply don’t realize what it really takes to get admitted to a tippy top university. NO, you are not entitled just because you live in CA. There are many options between UC, CSU, CC’s, and out of state, even WUE universities for in-state rates. Yes, you should have researched this further and understood your options better. You can still send DD to the UC she got into, or to a CC and transfer. Or take a gap year and re-apply. But perhaps she doesn’t really belong at Berkeley…and will fit in better at the school she got into.
“perhaps she doesn’t really belong at Berkeley…and will fit in better at the school she got into.”…Op is just another ENTITLED Californian frustrated that daughter waitlisted at DAVIS (yes, it is inland…VERY HOT too like Merced and Riverside), but DID get into the VERY GOOD UC locations of (Santa Cruz (most programs in US NEWS Top 100…by the BEACH (important to so many here but not myself), Riverside (Fastest growing UC for a reason & most programs in US News Top 100…rapidly moving up in rank) , and Merced (Brand New School already ranked #85 on 2018 US News (for Public Universities)). The parity gap between ALL UC’s is decreasing and will continue to do so…she would have received a great education at Santa Cruz, Riverside, and Merced if only she was open to it. Blindly chasing “prestige” is only one part of the college decision making process. Best to not destructively spout off in anger and denigrate other fine UC locations just because your daughter didn’t make that “mid level” UC. Regardless of what UC location (can do well at all of them), it is really what you do there, and after college that is most important. Best to work hard, grow where planted, and succeed!
It’s understandable to look at the % of OOS students and say that it seems reasonable as compared to other state flagships. However, the number of freshman slots going to OOS students is not the real cause of “pain”, it’s the huge number of in-state students that apply to the top/mid UC schools.
UCB had over 51,000 in-state applicants, UCLA over 71,000, UCI over 71,000, UCD over 56,000, even Merced had over 22,000 applicants. In this environment, giving 1 in 4 or 5 freshman slots to OOS students, is going to create push back from state residents.
I’d be curious for the statistician modelers out there what would happen if a UC applicant were allowed to choose say 3 schools as opposed to being able to choose all 9.
Yields would skyrocket, but I’m not sure if more in-state applicants would get in or not.
You get what you (collectively) pay for. W/o geographic diversity you would lose 20-25% of students paying 3-4 times instate tuition. And diversity. You would end up with an expensive tuition to a school that is now less desireable.
And you may be willing to pay more, but the CA voters have spoken…
The current number of qualified in-state applicants admitted to the UC System is approximately 100%. Due to mathematical constraints, that number is unlikely to rise. This is as per the California Master Plan for Higher Education:
The issue is with the phrase "not necessarily at the campus of first choice". Some Californians feel that the Master Plan should be revised as follows:Unfortunately, this expectation may be unrealistic. Those who feel that it is realistic should ask the residents of the 49 other US states and the District of Columbia if their public university systems make comparable guarantees. Just give them a minute or two to catch their breaths after they stop laughing.
Something I found interesting during my time at CCC was the amount of OOS and international students I interacted with whose big hope was transferring to Cal. Being that it was Berkeley City College, Cal being the hope didn’t surprise me but the number of people did.
I have no idea if one could become a resident after being in a CCC for a few years…I don’t know residency status criteria for UCs. But these were truly OOS/foreign students living on their own attending a non-residential CCC in hopes of getting into UCB.
The demand for UCs crazy!
Gator88NE made me curious. Yes, there are 70,000 applicants to each school, but many of those are overlapping, so what is the overall acceptance rate? Not that at any individual school, but what percentage of students trying to get into a UC get into one?
Here are the stats.
In 2017, there were 171858 individual applicants to the UC system. Of those 104822 were accepted, or 61%. 61% of the Applicants to the flagship school system were accepted into at least one campus.
Of resident applicants, there were 111857 applicants and 69,154 acceptances. 62% of California applicants to the UCs were accepted to at least one. That is actually really amazing. The chance of getting into a UC is actually really good - it just may not be your first choice campus.
What is also amazing is that of the California applicants that were admitted only 36,306 decided to actually ATTEND a UC - just about 50% of California accepted students took their spot in a UC.
If you meet the UC’s standards for eligibility in the local or statewide contexts (which is how they define the top 12.5%), then you are guaranteed a place in the system – i.e. the chances of admission are 100%.
The actual acceptance rate for CA residents is only 62%, but that’s because the UCs also get applicants who are technically not eligible in the local or statewide contexts (i.e. not top 12.5%). There is nothing to stop non-eligible CA residents from applying to the UC system, and they are sometimes admitted to less popular campuses if room is available.
Some people with limited financial resources decide that a UC will cost too much. The cost of attendance may be lower at a CSU, especially given that most Californians live within commuting distance of a CSU campus.
Other people with greater financial resources decide that a private school is more attractive than the available UC options, even though the cost of attendance is likely to be higher at a private.
@corbett…“all California residents in the top one-eighth of the statewide high school graduating class who apply on time will be offered a place at a UC campus, located near a cool metro area or fun college town, that is ranked among the Top 50 National Universities by US News & World Report. Unfortunately, this expectation may be unrealistic. Those who feel that it is realistic should ask the residents of the 49 other US states and the District of Columbia if their public university systems make comparable guarantees. Just give them a minute or two to catch their breaths after they stop laughing.”
So true lol! The “lower tier” UC’s of Santa Cruz, Riverside, and Merced are all very good and ranked higher (will keep going up) than the flagship universities in at least half the states of the nation or more! The University of California System is one of the best Public University Systems in the nation and world! Entitled Californians don’t even realize how good they have it compared to the rest of the nation!!
STOP COMPLAINING THAT YOUR KID DIDN’T GET INTO THEIR FIRST OR SECOND CHOICE UC AND BE THANKFUL THAT THEY MADE IT INTO ANY UC SCHOOL!!
As I mentioned. My daughter got into her first choice, which was not a UC school. I was only using my daughter as an example and stating what I am hearing from multiple parents. The UC schools are land Grant schools. The original mission was to educate California students. This has nothing to do with my daughter. Just because you think things are better in California it doesn’t mean it’s right or fair. I’m not complaining. Just trying to have a discussion about the issue. Should less out of state and country students be admitted to UC schools. Ihave a right to voice my opinion. If you do not like it please do not respond. There is no need to be rude. You are not the king of social media.
Also, I want to thank all the people that responded in a civil manner even if you did not agree with me. I also want to appologize if in any way I appeared rude. That was not my intent.
@Fisherman99 - Nailed it!
Exactly…Californians have a great deal, with so many options, at reasonable cost.
And @momneedscoffee made an excellent point, most UC applicants apply to multiple UCs (and CSUs) - so easy to do by checking the boxes on the UC app so that impacts the #s applying (increases it to make acceptance rates look lower).
@Parent90278 I actually find your points to be rude to out of state and international applicants. While I may not reside in CA, I have spent many thousands of dollars in CA over the last few years and my student is interested in a field which happens to thrive in CA. If your DD wants to apply to NY schools to be closer to Wall Street, or FL schools because she wants to study alligators, or CO schools because she wants to be near ski resorts, I am not going to complain about her applying from out-of-state. State Universities are not meant to have ONLY in-state students and exclude out-of-state students. That is just not how it works. I would change your paradigm and get to know your daughter’s new school.
They could also take money from the UC System and give it to the Cal State System. Although they seem to be headed the same way. You bring up a good point though. One which I stated earlier. Many students from out of state want to go to the higher level UC schools because of location. Wrong or right. I’m from the East and I wanted to go to school here. Even if there is a comparable lower cost school in their state. I think this creates a different dynamic for the UC schools. For example I was surprised how many instate students who get accepted to Ohio State don’t go. Havent checked the statistic for UC. Does this dynamic create more competition from out of state and country for in state students. Should kids mainly want to come here for the education? What about the fact that the UC Schools were mainly created to educate California kids. Maybe instead of adding a school in Merced, CA they should had added one by the ocean. I know this would have been more expensive. This just seem a little conflicting to me. More out of state and international students are competing for spots at the top UC Schools because of location so California kids are offered spots at Merced and Riverside. I’m not saying that it is not fair for students to consider quality of life issues when deciding what school they want to go too. Problem is California kids don’t want to go to Riverside or Merced either so they end up going out of state. If they want to come back after two years it is difficult to transfer in. One more thought, top 9% of kids in California are guaranteed a spot in a UC School. So they buy some cheap land (compared to other areas in CA) and send them there. So on one hand they are saying location should not count and on the other it is OK. Just trying to make a point here. I don’t mean to come off as sarcastic.