Should I do the full IB program?

Pre-College Issues International Baccalaureate (IB)
1

<p>Hi! I'm a sophomore in high school, and I need to pick my classes for junior year sometime this month. I've been torn about whether or not to do the full IB program. No matter what, I will most likely be taking IB English (HL), IB world history (HL), and IB biology (HL). So I'm not sure if I might as well just go for the full IB diploma. My main concern is IB math (SL). I wouldn't be taking it until senior year anyway because I have to take Algebra II junior year. My friend's sister apparently got a D in IB math and a 3 on the IB math exam, and still got her IB diploma, and is now at a highly competitive college. My current core curriculum grades are:</p>

<p>AP U.S. history: 84
Geometry honors: 80
Chemistry honors: 84
French II honors: 95
English honors: 98</p>

<p>I know the IB diploma would look extremely impressive to colleges, and I really want to do it, but I don't want to take on something I can't handle. Any suggestions/comments/advice? Thanks so much!!</p>

2

<p>Yes!! Go full IB! You’re a smart girl by the looks of it. If you can make grades like this in those types of classes, then IB shouldn’t be too bad for you. It’s an amazing experience. You’ll need to get adjusted first because it’ll seem overwhelming at the beginning but you’ll be fine. I’m glad I did IB. I’m going into my 2nd semester of my junior year next week in IB. You’ll soon realize how good it feels to be surrounded by other intellectuals, just like you! I wish you luck and the best! (:</p>

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<p>Thank you!! Good luck this semester and next year! :)</p>

4

<p>No problem! Goodluck to you as well (:</p>

5

<p>If anyone else wants to throw in their opinions too, that’d be awesome!!</p>

6

<p>Based on your grades, you look like a reasonably intelligent, hardworking person. </p>

<p>But I can’t tell you whether or not to do full IB. </p>

<p>It is time consuming, stressful, competitive, and the first year sucks because you slacked off the first one or two years of high school and have forgotten what a work ethic was. </p>

<p>At the same time, it’s amazing, stimulating when you’re not asleep, and the most rigorous courses you’ll ever take. And the shiny diploma is a boost to your appeal to colleges. </p>

<p>IB is not just about intelligence. It’s about metacognition and stamina. If you do choose to do full IB, forget sleep, start buying coffee and tea, always have spare pens, and don’t forget to write down your deadlines in a planner. You’ll need all of it for the times when you pull late night revision sessions or cram chats with your friends, who will be the people you go to in times of trouble. </p>

<p>You will be giving up all semblance of a social life, but the people you meet will be your best friends for life. Your life will be filled with stress and cat videos and you will probably seriously contemplate suicide at least once. Be prepared to skip school to sleep or do homework, not to be cool.</p>

<p>Are you scared? Be scared. IB is scary and difficult, but it will change your life and the way you view education forever.</p>

<p>You’re probably going to hate yourself for picking a full IB courseload, but it’s only first years who have it bad. I hear second years get cake.</p>

<p>Forgot how to have fun while doing the Gifted IB.</p>

7

<p>Hmmm… I agree with everything you said up to “contemplate suicide,” which is just going too far in my opinion (as a diploma candidate myself). I have never contemplated suicide even though the work has been heavy at times (7 HL classes, and self-studying Further Maths) and if you or someone you know has you should talk to someone about it.</p>

<p>I also don’t agree with “forget how to have fun” - what you need for IB is to genuinely have fun learning (clich</p>

8

<p>My son is doing the full IB diploma- one thing I would strongly recommend is to have an idea where you may want to go to college and see what IB exams are accepted for credit- what I have seen is that many schools only give credit for HL exams and only if the score is 6 or 7. In addition, not all IB HL exams give credit- my son sort of regrets taking Music Theory, since he won’t be able to get college credit. </p>

<p>My take on IB:

  1. I think 2 years of any course like Biology, Chem, etc. is overkill. It limits the ability to take a breadth of courses that may help for college.
  2. It is a very rigorous curriculum. If you are doing the IB diploma, it will be viewed by colleges as the most rigorous curriculum available, which is a plus.
  3. There are pluses and minuses to AP and IB. I guess it’s a matter of fit for you.
  4. IB is not that bad- although my son’s friends who are taking Math HL and Physics HL are getting killed- it is seriously difficult. I don’t agree with Quixila’s post about the lack of sleep.</p>
9

<p>Just a suggestion from a parent of a 9th grader in Pre-IB… Make sure that whoever is teaching the Pre-IB and IB classes is qualified to, and able to, and willing to, teach. So far DD2’s Pre-IB Biology teacher is 0 for 3 on the above. They’re using a college textbook but the labs are a joke (despite the incredible level of equipment available, they simply do not use them). DD2 has a solid B in the class but can’t help but wonder what’s the point compared to “this is a bunny” and “this is a spider” level of regular 9th grade Biology her friends are taking. </p>

<p>Likewise, Pre-IB English has not been a good experience (teacher does not bother to teach what the ‘right’ stuff looks like) and Pre-IB History (read, AP World History with IB sprinklings) has been a similar disaster (Scantron overload).</p>

<p>DD2 gets decent to good grades so far but largely due to going to bed at 1 AM weekdays. In contrast, DD1, someone who was mortally afraid of math through HS, took a few math courses in college with excellent professors and did exceedingly well in them, a tribute to how a teacher and the right approach are key.</p>

10

<p>Thanks for your opinions everyone! I’m leaning towards doing full IB at this point, I’ll probably try to talk to my guidance counselor tomorrow or Friday so she knows I’m interested, and also at some point convince my parents to let me do it. </p>

<p>So basically, if I do full IB, my full junior year schedule will look something like this:</p>

<p>Algebra II Honors
French III Honors
IB English
IB Biology
IB World History
Religion 11 (I go to a private/Catholic school)
TOK</p>

<p>Then my senior year schedule would look like this:</p>

<p>IB Math
IB French IV
IB English
IB Biology
IB World History
IB Religion
TOK</p>

<p>So I’m definitely going to keep giving it a little more thought, but I do really want to do it. I’m just hoping I’d be able to balance it with cross country, indoor & outdoor track, volunteer work, the shadowing of physical therapists I’ll hopefully be doing, etc. </p>

<p>Feel free to share more opinions & advice, it’s really helpful. :slight_smile: But thanks everyone!!</p>

11

<p>Just to throw a different opinion in there – I don’t have any personal experience with the IB program, but my brother was and IB student. He told me that he probably would not do it again if given the option. He enjoyed taking the tough classes , but after 3 years of high school chemistry (Honors, SL, HL) – he never wanted to take another chemistry class again!
It was very expensive. Our local school district only offered financial assistance if a student received free lunch program and we did not qualify. So, I know it was hard on my parents financially when he started having to pay for all of these exams and interviews, etc.<br>
Also, he did not find out if he received his IB diploma until about 6 or 8 weeks after his high school graduation. He could apply to colleges and claim to be an “IB Diploma Candidate”, but the diploma was received well after college acceptances had been received.<br>
I am totally different than my brother. I work hard in my classes and do well, but I am not super competitive academically like he was. You may really like it, but it was definitely not how I wanted to spend my high school years.</p>

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<p>BTW – my brother graduated from high school in 2010 – he is currently a junior in college.</p>

13

<p>@smokymtngirl Yeah I’ve definitely thought about the financial aspect of it, but since even if I didn’t do full IB, I’d still be taking a good amount of IB classes, so I might as well get the most for what my parents will need to pay!</p>

<p>Thank you for all your advice everyone! I talked to my guidance counselor today, and she said she felt that I belong in the IB diploma program, so basically, I just have to get my chem grade up to an 88, and then I’ll qualify to be in full IB. I’m pretty sure I’m going to do it. :)</p>

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<p>Good luck!! I’m also a sophomore going into the full IB program. :D</p>

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<p>Best of lucky to you, xcgirl2015!</p>

16

<p>As a senior in the IB Diploma Programme (Math SL/Chem HL/French SL/English HL/History HL - dropped Physics SL, fortunately), I can say that it’s a lot of work. As one of the above posters said, IB rewards diligence, an iron will, and a work ethic comparable to Kobe Bryant’s. The amount of homework you will have will restrict the amount of time you have to socialize, and you may see your social life stagnate before your eyes.</p>

<p>I’ll just give you some advice to consider. Remember that all of this is anecdotal, so take it with a grain of salt. I personally think it’s solid advice, but other members are obviously free to chime in if they feel that I’ve misled you in any way.</p>

<ol>
<li>There will be nights where you’ll have to forego sleep to finish up some homework, but if you ever pull an all-nighter in IB, you’ll probably need to reevaluate your time management skills. From what I’ve heard, there will be some nights in college where you’ll have to operate on little sleep, so take IB as preparation for college in that respect. However, it’s not healthy to sleep four hours for four to five days straight. Your academic performance should always take a backseat to your physical, mental, and emotional health. </li>
<li>Even if you didn’t study for most of freshman and sophomore year, I’d strongly recommend that you start. Senior year has been a nightmare because I haven’t bothered to review for anything, and it has been pretty painful watching most of my grades deteriorate to the B-C range because I don’t do a lot of my homework. This is obvious, but do your homework, haha.</li>
<li>Remember that your performance in IB is heavily contingent on your work ethic; in fact, I’d argue that it’s more so based on that than it is on your intelligence. If you work hard enough in IB, I can almost guarantee that you will succeed. The number two thing about IB is that diligence supersedes intelligence in the pecking order. The number one thing is bolded in a point I’ll make below.</li>
<li>From what I’ve heard, if you’re taking HL math/science classes, prepare for a world of pain. I fortunately only have one, but it feels like a massive time-crunch due to the massive amount of material we learn every week. It’s certainly rewarding doing well in the classes, but you’ll have to devote a considerable amount of time to them. English less so (though my teacher has been described as “a geriatric plague on education,” so take my advice with a grain of salt), but it’s still something to keep in mind. </li>
<li>Do most, if not all, of your CAS junior year or you will suffer more than necessary. I’d highly recommend playing some sort of sport if you don’t play one already. It’ll help keep you in shape and perhaps even improve your time management skills (if you need improvement in that field, that is).</li>
<li>Definitely get outside of the house. As paradoxical as it may seem, you’ll only make yourself more miserable if you agonize over your academics. See my first paragraph, which was in part about stagnation. Don’t let that happen, because you’ll only become unhappy and that will manifest in your grades in one way or another.</li>
<li>This is kind of a corollary to #6, but know how to relax when appropriate. I’d suggest setting aside some time on Saturdays to relax, then doing your homework after a few hours of respite. Remember that relaxation is somewhat of a hot commodity in IB, and it’s unfortunately more of a luxury than anything - especially during senior year.</li>
<li>Forget about your senior year being fun (this is said only partly in jest).</li>
<li>Jump at any opportunity to express yourself creatively that you can get in the programme. If your school is anything like mine, those opportunities are few and far between in IB, so it’d be silly not to take those opportunities.</li>
<li>Do not procrastinate. Seriously. Homework accumulates exponentially in IB, so be sure to do whatever work you have as soon as possible. After a few days, it will become almost insurmountable.</li>
<li>The Extended Essay (EE) is a [generally] 3500~4000-word essay which can be about almost anything you want. Although you should receive ample time to research, write, and complete your essay, I’d definitely suggest doing it during the summer of your junior year (summer of 2014 for you). You’ll save yourself a lot of unnecessary pressure otherwise. It’s a fun assignment, though! This is one of those few opportunities where you’ll be able to express yourself creatively, and the paramount goal is to have fun with it.</li>
<li>IB isn’t perfect or even ideal. You will often be frustrated in your two years in the programme. You’ll probably become close with whatever friends you make/have in IB, so you’ll be able to commiserate with them. Vent if it’s necessary, but don’t do it excessively. Thinking about frustration will only beget more frustration. Is it rewarding, for all of the psychic agony you’ll endure? Kind of. I don’t want to say that IB teaches you how to think critically; rather, it forces you to engage in critical thinking if you haven’t learned to do so already (it’s a valuable skill, don’t worry). You have the potential to earn an impressive amount of credit hours, too, so don’t take your studies lightly.</li>
</ol>

<p>Anyways, you seem intelligent, capable, and well-adjusted, so I’d suggest that you go for it if it appeals to you. If it doesn’t, I’d suggest going with AP.</p>

<p>Your junior year will be relatively easy. Although it is fairly rigorous, I got through junior year with a ~3.98 UW GPA with minimal effort, despite rarely studying. Don’t worry too much about it. Just brace yourself for senior year.</p>

<p>As an aside, I think that IB students tend to dramatize its difficulty. Most (but not all) suffering can be avoided through diligence. Although the IB Diploma Programme looks great to colleges, I’d consider taking a look at AP, too. I’d recommend taking a look at IBO’s official website and deciding over the next few weeks if it seems like a good fit for you. Here are a few links for you:</p>

<p>[IB</a> learner profile<a href=“%5Bi%5DNota%20bene%5B/i%5D:%20the%20only%20risk%20you’ll%20ever%20have%20to%20take%20in%20IB%20is%20deciding%20to%20go%20full%20IB%20-%20otherwise,%20risks%20generally%20aren’t%20worth%20it”>/url</a>
[url=&lt;a href=“http://www.ibo.org/diploma/]Diploma”&gt;Diploma Programme (DP) - International Baccalaureate®]Diploma</a> Programme at a glance](<a href=“http://www.ibo.org/programmes/profile/]IB”>http://www.ibo.org/programmes/profile/)
[Extended</a> essay - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia](<a href=“http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extended_essay]Extended”>IB Diploma Programme - Wikipedia)
[IB</a> Diploma Programme curriculum - creativity, action, service (CAS)](<a href=“http://www.ibo.org/diploma/curriculum/core/cas/]IB”>http://www.ibo.org/diploma/curriculum/core/cas/)</p>

<p>Sorry for any grammatical errors/unintentional harshness. I just woke up and I’m really tired. By the way, if you’re worried about Math SL (it’s easy enough, don’t worry), then I’d suggest Googling Khan Academy. Even with Algebra II, it’s pretty helpful, so if you need any extra help, it’s a great complement to your courses. Good luck and have fun if you decide to go the IB route!</p>

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<p>It was a difficult decision for me, but I decided not to do the full IB Diploma. I am now a junior taking IB Math I SL, IB French I (will declare HL senior year), IB HOA (will declare SL or HL–unsure at this point), IB Physics I (only doing year 1, will take one-year IB Bio SL course senior year), IB Business SL (will test in May–debating whether to take HL next year). My other elective is Journalism 3.</p>

<p>I am taking all of the courses necessary for the diploma, however I am not pursuing the diploma. All of my friends were shocked when I said I wouldn’t do the diploma, but I now realize it was the right decision for me. I still have those late nights, but I’ve learned more in 4 months since I started the certificate program than I have since I began middle school! I’ve learned time management, planning, dealing with pressure and stress, and enjoying the ample free time I am fortunate to get. I’ve also developed a higher level of critical thinking and analysis. All of my previous courses, including the one AP my school offers (U.S. gov’t/politics–got a 5 sophomore year) now seem superficial to the learning I’ve achieved in IB.</p>

<p>Part of my decision not to do the full diploma was to focus on the learning, not meeting the requirements for IB. I’ve already got a lot on my plate with extracurriculars, particularly newspaper, so adding TOK (which I would have to take 3 hrs/ week after school) and EE on top of college preparation would put me at my breaking point. In the past I’ve stressed myself and pressured myself to achieve perfection and accepting nothing less. It really was detrimental to my self-esteem and mind. Now I have a new mindset. Every paper I write, every exam I take is a learning experience. Any bad grade I get now I know there is a chance to improve in the future and sharpen my skills. That opportunity is available nowhere but IB.</p>

<p>So, the decision is up to you. In no way am I bashing IB, I love it! But do understand your limits and surround yourself with a support network of fellow candidates who will share your pain and jubilation. You seem fully capable based on your resume, so now the choice is yours. Don’t let IB scare you, face it head on and stay smiling! Keep up the hardwork and remember the end goal, but realize the experience is more than just scores and points. There will be bad days and mental breakdowns, but with every difficult endeavor, nevermind the most difficult endeavor a high schooler can partake in, comes challenges. Never back down! And once you make you’re decision don’t look back! Your school will let your colleges know that you dropped out of the diploma when you apply.</p>

<p>P.S. Colleges love the diploma; it gives you an edge in applicant pool. Most schools only give credit for scores on HL exams, however you usually get more if you get diploma. Also, regardless of what you do, look at Florida colleges/universities. Florida has the highest percentage of IB high schools, so the state’s colleges accept the greatest number of IB students. Florida is really the only state that wholeheartedly appreciates IB. If Ivy League is up your alley, the diploma really gives you an edge.</p>

18

<p>Psychosomatic’s post is spot on. By the way, I’ve found Math HL not as time-consuming as Physics. Physics is DEATH. The class’ average grade on the Kinematics test if i remember correctly was like 54%… lol</p>

<p>Another thing I should mention is teachers… Basically, your IB career will be stressful or not stressful depending on your teachers. For example, if you happen to have a completely unrealistic teacher (like I did) who did not give a single grade above a 90 for about 45 highly competent History students, well then there’s nothing you can do about it, and you are the one who ends up suffering in college admissions.</p>

<p>If I could choose though, I would have done AP, simply because it prepares me better for SAT Subject Tests and the classes are one year, meaning I can take a larger variety of courses in my last 2 years of HS.</p>

19

<p>Well, when teachers grade hard they are only preparing you for the IA and exam, which are graded to draconian standards. </p>

<p>It does also depend quite a bit on the teachers you have. I actually found Physics to be my easy class (plus math and chemistry) last year. Take this with a grain of salt, as mentioned above - I got a 7 on the exam with a markdown described as “steep” on the IA (mine didn’t get moderated though). YMMV</p>

20

<p>lol this is coincidental, I took honors Geometry when I was a sophmore and now as a junior in the IB Diploma program, I take IB English (HL), IB Independent Society (HL) and IB Biology (HL) and I chose AP Statistics (SL), IB Spanish (SL) and Alg. 2/Trig (SL).</p>

<p>I’m maintaining A’s - touchwood - in all of those classes. I didn’t take Calculus(SL) this year as I didn’t want to affect my GPA, but I probably will my senior year. You could do the same, it’s a reasonably managed schedule. Plus you need to do your CAS, EE, and extracurricular activities (ECs) so plan it out as you like it. </p>

<p>Good luck! :)</p>