Hey, guys I really need your help, I got a 1410 on my SAT, and can’t decide if I should submit it to UChicago or not since it’s now optional. Do you guys think it will look worse if I don’t put a score or if I put my 1410? Please let me know if you guys know anyone that got into UChicago with an SAT lower then more mine, or of someone who got in and did not submit any test scores
This really depends on your story. If you come from an underprivileged background, or are a under-represented minority, then the test scores aren’t a deal breaker.
However in other cases, they will want to know that you can handle the work. In this case, a 1410 is not so bad. Otherwise if you omit it, they will wonder why.
OP must have missed this thread while during his/her research:
I was looking for more responses, from more students that hopefully got admitted with my score or with putting no score.
OP - that thread contains some valuable information, including a link to a student who was admitted with a lower score than your’s. Perhaps her story will provide some insight into what the Admissions Committee is looking for in a test-optional applicant. Dean of Admission Jim Nondorf’s commentary in some of the articles summarized (in the same thread) should also be helpful. What more information do you need? You have provided nothing about your own application other than your score. So in your case the answer would be: It all depends on the rest of your application.
Edit to add: that, btw, would also be the answer if your score were 1510, or 1310, or 1210.
It’s not just total that matters. Eg, if 1410 is 800/610, you’re in a different position, especially if the lower reflects your area of interest. As JB says, you need a good read on what else the college will look for, when the score aren’t there. But that’s a bit more than finding clues in another thread.
JB - I really appreciate you sending that discussion link, I read it all and it does help a lot, I guess I was just looking for more statistics. Also, these are my stats,
- White, Male in Chicago Subs.
- Income: 50k to 75k
- Applying ED 1
- 4.2 weighted GPA on a 4.0 scale,
- AP Scores: APUSH(5) AP Euro(5) AP Art History(4) AP Lang(4) AP
World(3) AP Chem(3) AP Physics 1(3). - Activites: Well rounded including nursing home volunteering and
internships(I also put Self-Studying for two exams here). - Honors: AP Scholar w/ Distinction, Daughters of the American Rev.
Scholar Award, Student of the quarter, etc. - Current Classes: AP Stats, AP Calc AB, AP Bio, Anatomy & Phys., Med
Term., Chicago Lit, Lit Seminar. - Intended Major: Pre-med/Cancer Biology.
- Intended Career: Radiation Oncologist
- Hooks: First Gen College
- Essays; According to my teachers are creative, unique, and well
written. - Teacher Rec: 2: Very Good. and Additional Rec: 1 Employer: Very Good
Unlike the girl in the post, I don’t have any significant reason to explain a low score. If you need any more info let me know, and thank you so much for your help and advice
You list your weighted GPA but the AOs are going to look at unweighted GPA, overall course rigor and the actual grades in individual classes. If your As are in core classes and your Bs are in classes like art, nutrition, etc that’s helpful. If your Bs (or Cs - hopefully not) are in core classes that will be a challenge if you don’t submit test scores.
Since the test optional policy started just last year and UChicago is generally tight lipped about admissions stats, there really are few publicly available stats. And even if there were stats, that would be no guarantee past performance would be an indicator of future experience. Based on public statements by Nondorf, it appears 10-15% of both last year’s applicants and last year’s incoming class applied and were admitted TO. Little data and not exact, but an interesting indicator that at least TO doesn’t appear to be a major handicap in an application since the TO applicants were accepted in approximately the same proportion as those that submitted scores.
My guess - and it’s just a guess - is that in your situation the 1410 won’t hurt your app and not submitting it might make the AOs guess that your score is much lower. If your APs were all 5s, you’d have other standardized test scores that could be strong indicators without submitting your SAT score, but the AP scores are a mixed bag. As a first gen, low income student you are in several categories that UChicago is specifically seeking. I think they’ll understand that you wouldn’t have the ability to do multiple SAT takes and that a 1410 indicates you’re able to do the work. If you were my kid, I’d recommend you submit the 1410, especially if your school normally sends students to UChicago so the college is familiar with it.
^ @milee30 gives great advice. I’d add that those interested in STEM did tend to submit scores, while those interested in Humanities didn’t (perhaps they had a great Verbal but not-so-great Math).
What are your SAT sub-scores? Are we looking at a 700 for each or is one section (EBRW or Math) notably stronger than the other? SAT ranges tend to be high for UChicago but that’s not the whole picture. The ACT’s are like 33 - 35. Your 1410 is more like a 31-32. Not “great” but probably high enough to allow them a closer look, especially given the first gen. status. Again, it all depends on the individual test scores.
Which AP scores are you submitting?
The girl in the link had a notably lower score and it made total sense not to send that in, given her other attributes and challenges.
The 3s in chem and physics are tough for stem. If you submit only the humanities AP scores, in general, it suggests the stem are lower.
Again, what’s the SAT breakdown? If the M is much lower, tough for stem.
Remember intellectual curiosity is still important to them. It’s not just interests, it implies rounding.
^ Was thinking the same on the Chem AP. OP took it as a junior or earier so maybe that helps? Context might be important. Otherwise not sure if I’d advise my kid to submit.
My Son didn’t submit his chem score either because it was low. Everything else from before senior year was a 5 and you can self-report so he just submitted a subset. Risky, but he wasn’t interested in STEM so didn’t care that they figured he must have bombed the test.
OP, how central is that major to your application? Are you trying for pre-med regardless of where you end up, or are you the type who likes to explore a bit? My kids checked a box or two but discussion of an intended major simply wasn’t a central part of their applications. They were far more interested in the university than any specific major. But pre-med is different because you have to start fulfilling the requirements right away. My kids were more about the social sciences and getting to take the Core and no way were they planning their major from Day 1.
Sorry, I forgot to say EBRW: 710 M: 700. And yes I did take AP Chem as a Sophomore as part of a program at my school where only a handful of sophomores are allowed to take it, I believe there was twelve of us. My application is highly centered around Medicine, but maybe I could put just Biology for my major?
Also, the college counselor at my school emailed the admissions counselor for my area, asking this question since if I choose to omit the score, I didn’t want them him to know. She just emailed me his response,
“I heard back from the UChicago admissions counselor, and he said that if you feel confident in submitting your test scores, then you should. He said that if test scores are in the 1300 range they are still okay; last year they admitted students with anywhere from a 1020-1600. You will be applying to UChicago as a whole, not necessarily a specific program/major.”
So maybe they don’t consider the major, or maybe he’s just saying that…
My opinion only, but I think it’s a nuanced issue without a simple answer. If all your essays, ECs and listed intended major are “X” and your grades and AP scores directly related to X are weak, that could be a problem.
But… UChicago is very invested in the idea of a liberal education spanning a broad range of topics no matter what major you study. The college values people who explore topics of interest even if they’re not topics they’re naturally strong in. Intellectual range and curiosity are venerated. If your app reads more along the lines of someone who has interests in “X” but is also exploring a range of things including A, B, C… or exploring X to an advanced level that’s beyond the normal level of exploration for your age, that’s completely in keeping with the UChicago thought process, even if that means you get some Bs in the process. It’s all about how you present your overall picture and how you describe your experience and goals.
- Very interested in X, grinds away endlessly at X and still has mostly Bs or 3s in X and X related subjects... danger zone.
vs
- Very interested in X, pursued studying X to an advanced level and also explored in A, B, C and got a few Bs or 3s along the way... very workable.
The part about using your stated major(s) as a guide is to get a snapshot of your thinking. But that’s not just what major you’re “thinking.” It’s how you self assess your readiness and competitiveness, too. And whether or not you did engage in relevant ECs (as well as others.)
The issue with 3 scores is they unfortunately reflect a possible issue with the material. You just have to realize and make your best decisions. Be rational, not a “dreamer.”
A tip of sorts. Lots of kids don’t stick with stem. It does help to have- and acknowledge- other academic interests. With the 5 and 4 scores, they can then imagine you having other options.
You still need to nail the app and supps. And that hinges on how much you truly understand about the school, what all they want, what characteristics, stretch, and more.
Yes, UChi is being cagey about the test ranges. Ugh. But that makes nailing the rest so very important.
I think my essays are very strong and my ECs and Honors definitely show a wide range of academic interests.
Not sure they are being “cagey.” They may look closer at anything 1300 or north, whereas under that threshold means “no go” because it’s just too highly correlated with lack of academic mastery, regardless of GPA.
Just my opinion but I tend to think a 700/710 is an ok score for UChicago. Sure it’s not tops but it’s solid and it’s unlikely they will pass up on your app. just because you weren’t 750’s all around. BTW that’s around a 33 for English/Reading and a 30 for Math if you convert to ACT (I always find that helpful since I know the ACT percentiles better than SAT). If you feel that your scores supplement your overall grasp of your college prep material, go ahead and include them.
I think they also strongly consider whether you are a good fit for the liberal arts program as a whole. They don’t admit to a specific major, about 1/3 of your courses will be a wide variety of liberal eds, and the College encourages exploration (not sure how possible that is on a pre-med track but that’s still the general goal). Many pre-med majors actually choose NOT to major in Bio - they select a humanities or social science major to round out their curriculum and pursue something distinct from the heavy load of math/chem/orgo/physics they already have to take. So don’t get hung up on “the correct major” because as stated above it’s a snapshot of your thinking, you might change your mind, and/or pre-med doesn’t have to mean biology. Hope that helps!