<p>Nearly everyone who applies to top notch universities has reputable stats (GPA, Test scores , ECs..etc.). Suppose a person possess some of these stats, but lacks a decent GPA. In fact, suppose the GPA is considerably below par of top colleges (In my case A-/B+ average). Should he/she bother applying to..say.. an ivy league school? What are your thoughts?</p>
<p>Not unless he has a hook or an extraordinary achievement. Class rank /gpa is the biggest factor in admissions.</p>
<p>Yes, because college is primarily an academic institution. There is no point in applying if you won’t be able to handle the academics. However, I think a A minus or B plus average is that bad; you should apply if you want to.</p>
<p>A-/B+ is not low academic performance. Having said that, there are universities where the average GPA is above 4.0. I recommend that if you are really interested in a school and you match in some parts of your application (e.g. SAT scores and/or impressive ECs), then you might consider the following: what will bother you more – being denied admission OR not knowing what would have happened? The reach/match/safety approach allows you to try at least a couple of reaches (one high reach??) </p>
<p>The important part is that “top schools” is a very relative term. There are many who think it applies only to the Ivy league, and others who add another dozen or so schools. And still others who think of top-30. Actually, there are dozens of “top schools” if you consider 1) quality of the faculty 2) resources and programs on campus and 3) quality of students/peers.</p>
<p>Only in America could this be a question; universities everywhere else will flat-out tell you on their website to cut your losses while you’re still ahead. Unless you’re a fabulous athlete (and even then you’d still have to be a good, if not great, student) or otherwise one of the rich and/or famous, I’d wait until grad school. Why waste your money and your time? Unless it’s free. Then you have nothing to lose.</p>
<p>But wait, you have an A-/B+ average. Apply. Why not??? Most, if not all, of the top schools will be reaches, but depending on your school and your course load, it could be that your A-/B+ average is worth more than someone else’s 4.0. And you could be part of the lucky 25% who falls below average of the middle 50. One never knows.</p>
<p>If your A-/B+ GPA is not in the top 10% of your class, and you don’t have a major hook (are you a 300 lb lineman or is your father going to give the school $1M?), applying to an Ivy is a waste. A school might accept you because you could do the work, but so could most of the other 90% of students the school turns down, and many of them have attributes equal to yours PLUS good grades.</p>
<p>Honestly, when i give info sessions for my HYP alma mater, I tell students/families that they need to be one of the handful of top scholars at their HS class this year to be viable. My unspoken word is that if one isn’t then he/she isn’t a viable candidate. You should see the kids that are rejected. Simply amazing kids. Kids whom aren’t considered amazing by their own teachers and principal? They have no chance in my opinion.</p>
<p>I’ve interviewed nearly 30 kids the last two application seasons. Some were jaw-dropping amazing kids I thought. Of the ~30, zero accepts and only one WL. Honestly, I wasn’t surprised. The competition is just that fierce. A person with >3.5 GPA and without some signifcant hook – is not viable in my opinion.</p>
<p>HYP are not the only top notch universities.</p>
<p>A-/B+ grades are near 4.0 at my school (a 90+ being a 4.0). If you can get rid of the Bs altogether and just make As and A-s, you should be fine… But even in your case, a couple of B+s shouldn’t be detrimental.</p>
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<p>That makes me quite nervous haha</p>
<p>When someone says not great grades, I assume a B plus is not top of calss at his school. At many US schools you wool not be top 20% with straight a- grades.</p>
<p>Kids here severely underestimate what it takes to get into a school with a sub 15% acceptance rate.</p>
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<p>To be perfectly honest, there are plenty of kids with 4.0s (weighted or not) that neither the principal nor the teachers find to be remarkable.</p>
<p>What if the school does things differently? Like if a private school goes more in-depth on subjects and goes through more material. A B+ at a public HS in my state is not the same in a private HS.</p>
<p>Grades are looked at in context of the school. A student with A-/B+ grades at an Ivy feeder school would probably be OK. One at Podunk HS, not so much. But very few High Schools get that admissions tip from the Ivies.</p>
<p>“kids here severely underestimate what it takes to get into a school with a sub 15% acceptance rate”… Sooooooo true!!!</p>
<p>I went to a college seminar at my S’s private prep school where 50% go to top 20 schools. There were admission rep’s from Princeton and Bowdoin. They said something to the effect that of that 7-8% admission rate, 80% are URM’s, recruited athlete’s, legacy or donor kids. So if you are in none of these categories you are in EXTREME competition and have a almost zero chance of being admitted. You should have seen the jaws drop of the parents and the kids. If the colleges would publish that instead of encouraging kids to, " just apply" so there stats go up and they look even more selective, I think a lot of kids wouldn’t waste their time or money on applying to these schools. I’m so glad my DS has no interest in ay of these schools. He is the smarter one that knows there are a ton of great schools out there that he would love to attend and won’t have to face this insane competition.</p>
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<p>Are you serious, Redroses? If anything, the kids who are actively on this site are the ones most knowledgeable about the process and thus most aware of what their chances are. I have kids at my school near the bottom of their class who seriously tell me that they could get into Harvard but wouldn’t go because it’s not worth the money. HSers who use CC on a regular basis are far and away more aware of what it takes to get into a HYP or a similar caliber school. And that includes knowing that if you’re not in the top 10% of your class with an UW GPA of 3.75 or higher, your chances are second to none.</p>
<p>To the OP:
If your UW GPA is below 3.75 and you’re not in the top 10% of your class, don’t apply to an Ivy. There’s plenty of other great institutions that would love to have you, but with current trends, you’re not getting in unless you’re a Native American female engineer or the son or daughter of a Fortune-500 CEO. You don’t have to go to an Ivy to be successful. That’s a painfully inaccurate measure of success, in fact. Find some good schools that your stats match up with and start working on your application in advance. Good luck to you.</p>
<p>IDK, decrescendo. I find that even CC has an improbable mix of the aware-to-the-point-of-obsessed on one hand, and the completely oblivious and deluded on the other.</p>
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<p>Lol. Please don’t count the kids who only got one once to post a slew of chance threads and then never got on again. I’m talking about CC users who are in HS and use the website on an active basis to try and learn about the process. What other teens could be more knowledgeable about getting in than them?</p>
<p>Double-post. :P</p>
<p>You may have a point. I haven’t really studied the subpopulations.</p>
<p>And since I’d rather eat bugs than study the subpopulations, I’ll take your word for it, dec!</p>