So how did your S/D make THE decision?

Colleges & Universities A-Z Naval Academy - Annapolis
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<p>This thread is directed toward those parents and thier middies/cadets that were lucky enough to recieve more than one Appointment to a Service Academy. With an AF appointment in hand, and high hopes for an Annapolis version to follow, I would love to hear how THE ultimate decision was made - i.e. which SA to attend.</p>

<p>First of all, I fully understand that this is the son/daughter's decision, and that it is not "all about the parents" but as one, I can't imagine the difficult decision my son will have to make in the coming months if both A's arrive. Back when I was 17 my big decision was whether or not to put headers on my 69 Chevelle, not "where do I want to spend the next 4 (or 20+) years of my life"....</p>

<p>Now I'm sure that a number of you went thru the "pros and cons" of each academy so I'm hoping that you could offer some advise on how to support a son/daughter with this incredible decision. Note that I'll be posting this same thread on both the Naval and Air Force forum links so try and keep your answers fair and balanced. Yes, I know "Navy all the way" will be the answer here, but I expect the folks over on the AF forum will be saying "It's the Zoomie way or nothing" too! :)</p>

<p>Below I'll throw a few examples of the pro-con quandries my son will be sorting thru - maybe they'll provoke some suggestions to kick things off:</p>

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<p>Obviously there are a ton of other deciding factors (who gives him a higher chance of becoming a pilot, etc) but I'll post this thread "wide open" for you experienced folks to comment on, asking for your continued advise on how to support a youngster with the biggest decision of his life.</p>

<p>We all look forward to reading your responses.</p>

<p>Dknightfam</p>

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<p>My son was a recruited athlete with appointments to all three Service Academies. There was great appeal to him for each Academy for various reasons. When making his choice he took athletics off the table. While the Academies were not equal in his sport he felt he could have a beneficial experience where ever he went. Academically, while there are differences, all of the schools offered an excellent education. His primary focus centered on his career in the military, what he wanted to do with his life for the next 8-20 or more years. My Cadet examined the prospects in each branch of the military. The Coaches sent him material to read, he went on the internet, he spoke with people. In the end he decided that leading on the ground in infantry or armour was what he could see for himself in the future. My Cadet chose West Point and lives the life and the dream. He is one happy camper. While he would gladly tell you how life "sucks" on any given day he would also gladly tell you he is where he wants to be and should be. The decision was his to make...and he went with his heart and chose well. </p>

<p>As to the advantages for being a Corp Athlete...it is hard work to balance the team in addition to academics and military responsibilities. But my Cadet thrives on it. There IS a great benefit to having an instant family and support group when you arrive and it continues throughout your journey at your Academy. Ask any Plebe how wonderful it is to eat at a team table for meals...where you do not have to cut the pies/desserts or be at the mercy of upperclassmen. My Cadet and his teammates are exceptionally close and like a "band of brothers". </p>

<p>Good luck to your son.</p>

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<p>Cough...five service academies..cough :D</p>

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<p>Had the same dilemma- only son had to choose from 3
Athletics: recruited at 3 (navy2010 bows to Bossf51)
Noms: 3</p>

<p>Approach:
-Overnight stays narrowed the choice down to 2, both very postive experiences.
-He looked at academics and where he could study the major he wanted
-He looked at athletics and were he could contribute; how he interacted with coaches
-He balanced that out with where he felt most comfortable
-He looked at it from the endpoint of service selection, and what was offered from both</p>

<p>In the end he was still torn between 2 outstanding programs</p>

<p>-We revisited each academy in back-to-back weekends.<br>
-We avoided coaches this go-around, and spoke to mids and cadets...many on the team, many more outside the team. </p>

<p>-Then we waited till he was ready to sift it all through, and after a few sleepness nights, he did make a choice. Thankfully, no regrets.</p>

<p>As a parent, we advised him on the following 2 points:</p>

<p>Athletics: </p>

<p>-we instisted he make his choice taking the athletic piece out of the picture, understanding that athletics is a huge part of who he is. The reason for this is that you are one injury away from not playing at all, and you have to like where you are when and if that day arrives.</p>

<p>-Secondly, "recuited" does not always translate into playing, and in some cases, even making varsity. Teams overrecruit- especially at the SA's, and you may find yourself on JV for a year (and some even get cut completely). Even if you make the team, the chances of dressing, and then playing, during freshman year is remote. Does it happen? yes...for some, but not for the majority.</p>

<p>-Third- even if you are recruited, you make the team, you dress and you even get to play- on the starting line- if you don't keep those grades SAT you will find yourself right back at square one- without athletics.</p>

<p>-Lastly, coaches can, and do, change. He was lucky in that both schools had great coaching staffs... however he had a coach at one of the institutions that he clicked with immediately- who resigned later that year. IMO, the decision needs to be made irrespective of who is coaching, although I say that will a deep appreciation for how strong a coach-athlete bond can be, and how positive that influence can be. I know our son would have been very dissapointed to have gotten to the academy only to have the coach move on- in this particular case the pull was very strong. </p>

<p>Academics: </p>

<p>-we encouraged him to keep his eye on the end goal- where he saw himself in 5 years (service branch) and where he saw his life after that. What interested him in terms of a career, and how best to get there. He had a field of study he was interested in, and that influenced his decision in the end. Mind you- he had a particular major in mind....many kids will not, and many will change their minds several times. In our case, he had a good idea of what he wanted very early on, which helped us to narrow down the college choices considerably as it was a highly selective major offered at only a handful of schools (as opposed to my dd, who had us look at over 30 schools........)</p>

<p>He has had no regrets... not to say there are days when he is wishing he was anywhere BUT the yard...but you will find everyone has days like this, even those attending civilian schools.</p>

<p>The turning point for us in helping him to reach is decision was those back-to-back visits. A lot of travel, a bit of an expense, but it really helped him to reach his decision. I will NEVER forget him sitting on one of the benches alongside Alumni Hall, looking out at the Severin, when he told his Nana and I that "mom- this is where I belong." :)</p>

<p>Now that he is there...
-being an athlete on a team has it's advantages and disadvantages:</p>

<p>Plus side:
friends, team, less marching, doing something you enjoy. "BAND OF BROTHERS" ...the motto on their workout gear.... and having upperclass take you under their wing is priceless...they really do look out for each other, and it is a wonderful thing. Team tables, the comraderie, all positives.</p>

<p>Negative side:
takes you away from your "other" team- squad/company activities (can translate into taking a "hit" in peer ranking), more demands on time (time management is key otherwise academics can tank quickly), and the physical demands can be particuarly tough. </p>

<p>Worth it?<br>
For our athlete, absolutely positively "yes." Then again, he was born with a lax stick in his hand!!! ;)</p>

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<p>Dknightfam,
I would suggest that you forget both the academic majors and sports. The academies are by and large the same. Ask him where he pictures himself in 10 years.</p>

<p>Naval and Air Force aviation are polar opposites. The Air Force is a derivitive of the Army and is fraught with manuals, policies, and procedures, all giving guidance as to what a pilot can do. Some people require a structured environment, such as this. The Navy, always in the background training it's officers for command at sea, promulgates general guidance on what their aviators are prohibited from doing, allowing them, demonstrating proper headwork, to accomplish the remainder. Huge difference. I have been a passenger in an AF C-141 sitting on the taxiway in Rota, Spain, enroute to Dover AFB when, after holding short of the duty runway, the pilots taxied back to the line and shut down instead of taking the active runway. Their reason. Their perceived crew day based on estimated flying time upon arrivat at Dover would have expired prior to reaching their desination. Naval aviators would be derided out of the squadron pulling such antics. </p>

<p>Bob Norris, the author, is credited with the following letter responding to the young candidate faced wih the exact same choice as your son. I suppose there is a certain amount of humor in it, but it certainly rings true:</p>

<p><a href="http://www.keepingapace.com/blogarchives/navy/air_force_pilot_or_naval_aviator.php%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.keepingapace.com/blogarchives/navy/air_force_pilot_or_naval_aviator.php&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

<p>And remember also, in the AF, if one is not a fighter pilot, they are a second-class citizen while in the Navy there are at least four other very viable and rewarding careers.</p>

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<p>I agree totally with the idea that athletics, and to an extent academics, should be a nonsubject when deciding between the service academies. While I have not yet had the opportunity to decide between two or more appointments, and I may not ever, deciding where I wanted to apply to and request nominations for was a similar decision.</p>

<p>I knew that I was sold-out for applying to USNA and requesting a nom there. I want to be a Marine officer, so there was no question about me applying there. West Point was a good alternate, knowing that while my experiences as an Army officer vs. a Marine officer would be different, I would be honored to attend either academy and proud to serve in either capacity.</p>

<p>I decided against requesting a nom. for USAFA and applying there, though I'm sure that I would have had a good chance at both. My reasoning here was that, though it's the only academy I have visited, I know almost nothing about the Air Force, compared to my knowledge of the Army, Navy and Marine Corps.</p>

<p>I was not concerned much with academics or military training, as from what I can tell, in that respect Annapolis and West Point are comparable. To me it's really about what I want to do for the next twenty or thirty years, the same as it would be if I were choosing between civilian schools.</p>

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<p>"And remember also, in the AF, if one is not a fighter pilot, they are a second-class citizen while in the Navy there are at least four other very viable and rewarding careers."</p>

<p>That's what clinched it for my mid. She had appointments to USNA, AFA and CGA. She finally took CGA off the table because of the size of the school. After the summer seminars and cvw at Navy, she felt the mids were just happier to be where they were. Besides, the hats are dumb looking at AFA (family joke). The possibilities are wider at USNA. She's happy with her decision.</p>

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<p>DKnightfam-</p>

<p>Your son is a fortunate young man. KUDOS! Yes, he's lucky, but I am positive there was a lot hard work into getting to this point! Our son has 3 Appointments in hand & felt VERY blessed to have these outstanding choices & has made THE decision. I concur 110% with USNA69 & FewAndProud16. They are spot on. </p>

<p>Recruited athlete or not, looking at the big picture/end product, career wise, is IMO the best way to make the choice. Reason, the athletic experience for most students at any given college ends at graduation. Very few student/athletes continue that career AFTER graduation. </p>

<p>Just as USNA69 put it, How does he see himself in 10 years?</p>

<p>Quick, timely example. Friends of ours son had a similar quandry. Civilian universities, NAPS as a recruited athlete <great kid,="" grades="" just="" not="" quite="" there=""> or straight into AFA, not recruited. He chose the former knowing he wants to be a pilot, he wants to go through college in 4 yrs. & he still has a good chance to play at AFA. But also realizing he won't be playing his sport professionally, regardless of which undergrad program he chose.</great></p>

<p>Best wishes for your son & your family as the decision is made.</p>

<p>And P.S. I know what you mean about making a life changing decision at 17 yrs. old. Mine was whether to wear the Jordache or Gloria Vanderbuilt jeans to a Fri. night football game ;) Life has certainly changed for our children...........for the better, I'm not so sure.</p>

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<p>coming back to the original question, "how did dd/ds decide," I think you are going to find as many reasons as there are mids showing up on I-Day. </p>

<p>Each one will have a different reason....
for some, it will be the ability to study a particular major offered at one school and not offered at another.
For others, it will be sports.
For others, it will be the service selections. Planes. Subs. Nuclear. Ships. Armor. Infantry. Marines. Seals. Aces.<br>
For others, it will be to follow in the footsteps of fill-in-the-blank.
Some will go because they fell in love with "Top Gun" when they were 5.
Some will go for a totally wrong reason- to please mom or dad or uncle joe or Aunt Mary.
I would venture to say that for some it might even be some unimportant, remote, trivial item that "tips the scale", so many things being equal.... who knows what will attract a kid- is it who has the bigger guns, the best uniforms, the best food, the best fight song.... </p>

<p>When it comes right down to it, the academies are all stellar, and what draws you to one over the other is as variable as the candidates themselves. The hardest part is making the choice to serve in the first place, and thankfully there are lots of kids choosing to do just that.</p>

<p>What I can say is that the kids manage to get it right...
and the test for me has always been if they are still happy with their choice by Thanksgiving break- and if they are going back when the turkey is done and Sunday rolls around.</p>

<p>Best of luck-
choices can be difficult, but how wonderful that your son has some good choices before him!</p>

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<p>Great replies so far and thanks for reminding us all of the ultimate goal of going to a SA - i.e. a career in that branch of service. </p>

<p>As one of you mentioned, just making the decision to pursue a military life itself really is the big decision, so perhaps the choice between multiple SA's shouldn't be as huge as I inferred originally. My son has been planning / working toward this "decision day" for years - a request to attend a month long summer camp at the Valley Forge Military Academy when he was just 9 yrs old started it all. More recently, 3 yrs in the USN Sea Cadet program earning a PO1 rating has proved that he's on the right path. </p>

<p>Of course, as all young 17 yr old males do, he wants to fly fighters, so AF and NA hold somewhat the same regard there (though he's alot more familiar with Navy due to the Sea Cadets and our east coast proximity to Annapolis....). But somewhere along the line he's going to have to make the choice between the two, and hopefully your reminders of what's important will steer him in the right direction....</p>

<p>Keep em coming and thanks for the advise.</p>

<p>Dknightfam</p>

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<p>OY! When it rains it pours! We just spotted that my son's page on the NROTC program was updated last night to offer him a 4 year NROTC scholarship at Mizzu! YIPES! Now he's gonna have to make an additional decision, i.e. NA or NROTC, knowing that either one will get him his stripes in 4 yrs. :)</p>

<p>Feel free to add this "ingredient" to this thread of suggestions....</p>

<p>Dknightfam</p>

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<p>the best advice I can offer, for what it is worth, is to have your son do an overnight at each- and visit them often if you can swing it. The more info he has, the better to base his decision on.</p>

<p>congrats- and best of luck!</p>

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<p>Actually, he was able to do Summer Seminar's at each this past year, a week at AF, and then NASS (followed by a killer week of heat at Coast Guard AIM). He came away liking all of the SA's, but dropped CG due to thier lack of fixed wing aircraft careers. AF appeared more laid-back than NA, but it had the History degree he was interested in, as well as a rifle team to compete on. Annapolis, on the otherhand, has always been his first choice when it comes to campus/traditions, etc. and the fact that he's been "Navy" thru his three yrs of Sea Cadets.</p>

<p>I think he'll try to attend one of the AF Orientation(s) in April - maybe that will help make or break that decision. But now with the NROTC scholarship in hand, he'll also have to make a ruling on SA-vs-Civilian College now too...</p>

<p>Thanks again for the thoughts </p>

<p>Dknightfam</p>

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<p>
[Quote]
as well as a rifle team to compete on.

[/Quote]
</p>

<p>That shouldn't be an issue. Navy rifle team is headed for the national finals for about the umteenth time in a row. If things haven't changed, the majority of the members are walk ons.</p>

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<p>And what's the deal with the history major @ USAFA vs. USNA history major? Is it the label of "war studies?" Or is it somehow different history? :confused:</p>

<p>While I know quite well the adolescent proclivity to avoid decision making until the last moment, I confess to being baffled as to why so many questions and unknowns at this late date. It's March, man. :eek: Is he waiting for the ROTC/SA revelation? I'd have projected that decisions would be long past pondered dependent upon the various scenarios. An argument could be made that in light of no decision he's indeed made some profound decisions.</p>

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<p>In a 17/18 year old’s mind from December to May 1st is a life time, things change, what you thought you wanted one day may not be what you want the next. I have seen many a young person do early decision and by May be unenthusiastic about their college choice. Signing on the dotted line early many times is the decision avoidance.</p>

<p>Surprising, there are kids here who are making a decision based also on the education they will receive. Maybe the history department at USAFA has a bigger emphasis on lets say European History and USNA is more American Studies (Only examples as I have no knowledge of who has what types of programs but do know that most programs very from intitution to institution) So it is not unusual for a perspective “student” to want to chose the program that better fulfills his educational needs. Maybe service selection needs for this individual are not as important as his educational desires after all he knows that he does wants to serve, how may just not be as important as the desire. You may want to fly at USNA and end up under the water so the how better be flexible.</p>

<p>As our Mids have chosen their majors this week they were reminded that you have to like what you are selecting or it will be a very long three more years.</p>

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<p>And they'll not be a "long three more years" anyway? Good to know that all it takes is picking English over engineering. ;)</p>

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<p>For mine that would be a long, no really long three years. He is in the "avoid having to write papers mode" after two history classes this semester!</p>

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<p>LOL..... just got off the phone with the thorpedo, who said "today" was one of the LONGEST days on the yard ever!!!! I guess spring break couldn't start fast enough!!!</p>

<p>(hey everyone- enjoy your MIds at home this week- hope they all arrive safe and sound...and if headed elsewhere, hope they have some good time to relax and unwind!! ) Fair winds and following seas and all of that!!! :)</p>