Son dismissed from Guilford College after first semester for low GPA

Parents Forum
101

<p>lbr6, I find the story very upsetting, too. I see it as a split-level communication failure, which will also serve as a warning for us parents to take nothing for granted. (If highschoolers think it's not important to tell their parents a number of things -- which they do, regardless of the quality of the relationship, they will not necessarily instantly change as college freshmen.)</p>

<p>Perhaps it would be a good policy of a college to inform not just the student about the academic probation, but duplicate that info to the parent, immediately. Yes, we want them to transition into independence, but this was a serious & critical matter. While he will recover, the trauma, in my view, was unnecessary & preventable. I guess there's no guarantee that Guilford would have been more responsive to a parent, but as a parent knowing a S or D was on probation, I would have tried myself being proactive early on & discussing with the academic dean what could be done to prevent dismissal -- such as a medical leave of absence being granted that first semester (even retroactively), effectively cancelling out the class.</p>

<p>I know that at various colleges & U's there's an appeal process for dismissal on any grounds, including disciplinary. What's done is done, & you need to move on, but I guess I would go through the appeal with the academic dean anyway, noting the unprofessional way that the advisor doubling as the teacher removed the authoritative line of communication & any remedy for your son. If the appeal succeeds in any way, possibly it will lift or minimize a negative trail on the transcript, at the least.</p>

<p>The "retroactive" practices suggested in the above 2 paragraphs are indeed done at "small, warm colleges," so I'm not sure what all the comments are about from posters about the dangers of small colleges -- unless the point is that you're more likely to be under a microscope.</p>

<p>For those who believe in a broad sense in destiny, or in things working out, perhaps you, the family, can console yourselves that the experience was an indication that the adminstration there takes no prisoners. Can you imagine if he got sick much later in the 4 yrs., with a lot more to lose on his GPA & much longer to make up for his academic efforts?</p>

102

<p>I was on probation at NYU my first semester - (calculus- that nasty Calculus) .They gave me one semester to get my act together- and I did. I graduated with a 3.4 GPA......which I consider an accomplisnment when considering my background. I am sorry to hear that this has happened to your son, but the suggestion of community college and reapplying to another private college or public college may make sense. Maybe I missed it in the previous posts but does your son have a learning disability or lack of motivation?</p>

103

<p>This is truly such a sad situation, and Northstarmom surely has some great insight into the problem. </p>

<p>I just can't get over the general feeling that kids these days just are not held responsible - and it starts early on, I know. (I AM NOT talking about OP here!) I know parents of my sons' peers that over and over refuse to deal with inappropriate and irresponsible behavior on the part of their high schoolers. The kids still have the car keys no matter how many tickets, they have no curfews in spite of past lying about whereabouts, they still have their cell phones in spite of astronomical text message bills, they have the credit card at the mall in spite of buying objectional clothing, etc. etc. </p>

<p>But college is a whole new ball game, and it is a tough place to learn personal responsiblity for the first time because the stakes are high. I'll tell you one thing: If my kids head off to school and think they are going to party hearty and fail classes, that will work for exactly ONE semester. It will kill us, but there will be no second chances at $40,000 a year.</p>

104

<p>Noticed in the post above mine- he was sick most of the semester? sorry</p>

105

<p>Another issue not address here is stacking your clases for optimal performance. There is an art to doing this. Some college kids are overly enthusiastic and unaware of difficulty of college classes. Sometimes kids schedule a 300 or 400 level class their sophmore year and then fall to pieces. Withdraw, don't cower in the dorm or run home! A W is not a big deal.</p>

106

<p>Along the lines of the last post, I was wondering how the student's advisor let him sign up for seven courses. Sure, high school students may take that many and sure, four of these were "only" one-credit courses, but we all know that college courses are in a different realm, especially when we read Garland's posts. Satisfying seven different course requirements, including some that may be unrealistic but are permitted under "academic freedom" or some other approach, would be difficult for many of us, least of all for a freshman.</p>

<p>Possibly another general lesson to be learned.</p>

107

<p>Ibr6--thanks for posting. And Jamimom and Northstarmom, thank you for your insights. Ibr6, you have a lot of company. I'm sure there are many lurking who are dealing with similar issues, but don't want to post. My oldest is struggling. Don't want to go into detail, but he definitely would have been kicked out of some colleges-- he has hung on by a thread at the one he is currently attending, and I am trying to keep the faith. Son, #2, on the other hand, freshman in college, is doing much better at this point than I could ever have imagined. Life is strange.</p>

108

<p>I agree with several other posters that something seems "fishy" here. If the OP facts are true then she has every right to post them here to get advice and information for her son. However if the OP is fictitious, it damages the reputation of a fine and underappreciated college. Because of this I have forwarded a link of this thread to Guilford College's President, Registrar and College Relations Office so that they may either comment or investigate the situation.</p>

<p>I have carefully read the Terms of Use and do not find that this action is prohibited and neither do I find it to be discurtious to any of the posters here. If i have offended any here I am sorry. I just feel that a small college like Guilford should be informed about what is transpiring here and either correct some of its freshman advising shortcomings indicated here or defend itself if any falsehoods are being posted if it so chooses.</p>

<p>The following is a copy of my email text.</p>

<p>Below is a link to the College Confidential MB web site involving an academic situation of a first year student a Guilford College. The "claims" being made put Guilford in a bad light and you may wish to either comment or investigate. Criticism has been leveled at the "student's" advisor, the Dean of Students and others.</p>

<p>Having a nephew attending Guilford College I know what a fine college experience he is having. However I understand that all students may not appreciate what Guilford College offers for a wide variety of reasons.</p>

<p>Nevertheless, in the increasingly competitive realm of college admissions reputation is an important and hard to earn commodity for colleges to develop. The original posting, if true offers important information for prospective students and should not be stifled. However if it is fictitious, it damages the fine reputation that Guilford has endeavored to develop.</p>

<p><a href="http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/showthread.php?t=26527&page=1&pp=20%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/showthread.php?t=26527&page=1&pp=20&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

109

<p>After perusing the Guilford website, my understanding is that the teacher of a student's FYE class is automatically that student's advisor. So that situation exists by design and is the same for all students.</p>

<p>(last poster) you have offended me. I have no problem with forwarding the thread to Guilford. I agree they have a right to know there is a discussion going on about this. I am sure there are 2 sides to the story. Guilford will likely not be able to respond with any information due to privacy concerns. The part about the OP being ficticious offends me.</p>

110

<p>hello, charlesives: I am new to this forum, and I don't know if your notifying the college violates protocol or not. Perhaps a senior member can speak to that. </p>

<p>I can only assure you that we are not a fictitious family and I would have no reason to malign Guilford College--a school where despite what happened, my son was very happy and where he very much would have liked to remain--if I did not feel strongly that this story could help others in a similar situation. Perhaps your e-mail to the college president will get a response where ours did not. I am happy your nephew is having a good experience. He may even be a friend of my son, whose story may not be typical but is real nonetheless.</p>

111

<p>Please forgive me if I bring up something that has been brought up before and is now buried in the thread. I skimmed some of the issues and responses as my time is fairly limited today. The one thing that runs through my mind is how little control we as parents have over access to the students academic records, medical records or anything else in light of the privacy act. Permission for academic advisors and deans to discuss your child with you is dependent upon it. As much as it may distress us, our kids control the flow of information. It would take a very creative and determined university official to circumvent the student and contact parents if the student does not want his or her business to be known. I am certainly not saying it is the case in this situation, but it has caused me to pause and think "what if" more than once. Ibr6, I am so sorry that you and your son are facing this stressful situation. I hope that you will be able to move ahead in the near future and that your son will be happy in his new endeavors.</p>

112

<p>I trust that this is correct and perhaps my notification will bring the folks at Guilford around. I hope that that is the case because if what you say is correct, then it seems he was not advised or treated well by the faculty and administration there. Students and their parents should expect better. Now that Guilford is aware that their actions are in the public forum, perhaps they will be more inclined to rectify the situation and perhaps now would be a good time for you to reach out to them again. If they are annoyed or embarassed, its no skin off your nose because they were not responding to you in the first place.</p>

<p>I hope that my post helps you out and I am sure that your son will learn from this experience. He isn't the first and sure won't be the last. Keep us posted!</p>

113

<p>Well, Ibr6, as you can see from the posts, your son is not the only one who has gone down this road. No fun, I know, but you get through it. He is fortunate to have someone like you on his side who wants to find out what happened and work on any issues that may be your son's. </p>

<p>I want to say that though Loren Pope did a great service to those looking at colleges in his "Colleges That Change Lives", the descriptions have been critisized by many as being a bit too idealized, and not balanced enough. I know a few of the featured colleges pretty well, and though they are certainly good schools, there are certainly issues that should be addressed in a balanced writeup. Some of the info is also downright incorrect. I think that there would be a market for a "Fiske" type book for all the colleges in the US--it would have to span several volumes. It is difficult to get a good narrative description of schools that do not make the top 300 or so list whereas certain schools are discussed and critiqued in many publications. I know that parents' accounts of these other schools are so welcomed on our forum as there is such a dearth of material. Though Pope's book is a good start, I think a more objective take on those schools would be very helpful.</p>

114

<p>alongfortheride: I agree---and I'll be a college student this fall. While I don't exactly relish the idea of having grade reports sent to my parents, they are financing my education. Also, the "student privacy protection" policies seem to help the school more than they help the student---the school loses a good deal of accountability when it no longer reports to parents.</p>

115

<p>lbr6 - good luck working through the situation. </p>

<p>I wanted to add my story to those who started slow as an undergrad and then kicked into gear after maturing some. My school gave "+"s and "-"s so there were 13 grades ... I managed to get 12 of the 13 possible grades ... I never got a F but got all three Ds and all thee Cs and came very close to probation. Eventually (after I started paying the bills) my grades kicked in and I did well and eventually got into a couple great grad schools.</p>

<p>Hopefully your son will come out of this lousy experience a little wiser and move on and do well!</p>

116

<p>Ibr6 - it sounds like you've given your s. the 'hairy eyeball' and haven't unearthed anything new. I, for one, really hate FERPA (I think that's the acronym for the federal law that says 18 years olds are independent agents until it's time to pay the bill.) It's ridiculous - under the Patriot Act the government can inquire as to what our 'adults' are reading, but we aren't informed of academic problems until it's too late to remedy. (That's where I am right now. Had I known, I could have intervened. Now s. is in position of having to advocate on his own behalf. I have to say, although I'd never invite this kind of thing in to my life if I had a choice, I'm determined to look on the 'bright side'.) </p>

<p>Today's NYTimes has an article in the business section about the value of a college education. The pay range between high school and college grads. is narrowing (turns out it expands and contracts over time) but "there continues to be rising demand for people who have very strong cognitive, managerial and communications skills...." It's not about the money, to me, it's about being able to use your abilities and communicate. A student having this kind of a wake-up call has an opportunity to assess where they are, where they want to be, and how to get there. I hope you've passed the worst days of this, and are looking forward to what your s. can do.</p>

117

<p>Jamimom, Good point. The problem with most guidebooks, including the Pope book, is that it is impossible to tell how what a particular child's experience is going to be at any school. My daughter and I have noticed on college visits that sometimes her reaction to a school bears no resemblance to her reaction when she reads a glowing (or negative) description in a guidebook. Thus, it is vital to move beyond the guidebooks and dig deeper. Read the academic guidelines, read the back issues of the student newspaper (often policies like this will crop up there), go on live journal and other student discussion sites and ask questions about the atmosphere, support, etc. Finally, always keep in mind that what makes one student may have a WONDERFUL experience at the same school where another student is woefully unhappy. And, as I always say, there is NO perfect school. Anywhere. They all have quirks and problems.</p>

<p>Regarding Guilford, re-reading this thread it does sound like the OP's son was given chances to rectify the situation before the end of the semester. He was offered the chance to talk to the academic dean - he didn't. He was given the chance to drop a class and move off campus - he didn't consider this or discuss it with his parents apparently. There was academic counseling and support available on campus - he didn't take it. While Guilford might have handled the notification with more sensitivity or in a different manner, the student probably had a pretty good idea of what his GPA was going to be when he left campus in December --- and a simple reading of the school's information would have indicated what the consequences were likely to be. </p>

<p>My heart does go out to Lbr and her husband. I know getting that certified letter and the lack of response from Guilford must have felt like adding insult to injury.</p>

118

<p>What was your son sick with??</p>

119

<p>Another thought, most colleges/universities have medical withdrawal as an option, even retroactively in some instances. If your son has documentation of medical diagnosis and treatment of a condition that interfered significantly with attendance/academic performance, the Dean or representative may be able to withdraw your son, effective the last day of classes, resulting in no grades for the semester.</p>

120

<p>OOPS just saw that I skipped the last 3 pages of the conversation.</p>