<p>My son definitely prefers Tier II schools. He just doesn't want the stress and the competition in the top tier. Honestly, if he just finishes his degree anywhere in anything and really loves his college and his college years, I'll feel like we really accomplished something!</p>
<p>--Rhonda</p>
<p>When it comes to pressure and stress, much depends on the child. My children have both taken similar classes in high school, yet my daughter has found the experience much more stressful and pressured than my son. She tends to have more discomfort when faced with challenge and change, while my son just seems to sail through even the most difficult situations. He is also better able to manage his time and sees things like heavy EC time committments not as burdens but as fun while she sees them as another thing to worry about. They just have very different personalities.</p>
<p>I do think that I have put a great deal of pressure on my children along the way that wasn't necessary. I have always had high expectations for them and sometimes I may have pushed them both a little harder than was necessary. I am gradually learning that this ultimately is THEIR life, not mine, and as long as they are not drug addicts or murderers, I need to back off and let them live it, even if the results don't quite match up to how I would do things.</p>
<p>I guess I am on of the few on cc whos' child is not looking at a top tier school,>></p>
<p>There are actually many of us hiding in the bushes here at CC. :)</p>
<p>I had an interesting conversation with my son on the way home from school today. I was telling him how his SAT scores and grades would place him in the running for a lot of great schools, even maybe some Ivy schools. He looked at me and said, "I don't want to aim too high, Mom. I just want a school where I can be happy." Then he mentioned several of the colleges my D. looked at as schools he liked the sound of and wanted to visit. So, heat up the fire, start sharpening the stake, I may be burned as a heretic yet.</p>
<p>Junefour, my S2 will not be looking at the same level of schools that S1 is/was. He may look at some of the same ones S1 looked at for safeties and matches though. </p>
<p>S2 has a girlfriend who has been asking me questions about the college search. I am like the "carolyn" of my real life circle of acquaintances.....and that is a scary thought as I really don't know that much :eek:<br>
But apparently her and her family haven't really started yet. The thing about it is I am really happy to help her research this! I'll pass that quiz on to her and S2.</p>
<p>DrDrewsmom</p>
<p>Regarding being the "Carolyn" in your circle of friends....I can relate!</p>
<p>Just ten minutes ago, a friend IMed my son to ask me what to do if you want to send the FAFSA to more than six schools! :-)</p>
<p>This all reminds me of a conversation my son & I had when he was in 6th grade & on the school basketball team. I was puzzled as to why he wasn't putting in his best efforts to be in the 1st string & he told me honestly he REALLY wanted to be in the 2nd string (meaning ranked 6th-10th best), NOT first string, even tho honestely he could have been if he exerted himself. I was surprised (can you tell I'm a bit competitive? He explained he doesn't LIVE for basketball & he doesn't really want/need the pressure of being 1st string & having to play on the edge--when the team really needs points & plays. Being 2nd string suited him great--you're likely to play at least a little for every game (giving the 1st string some time to recover), but likely put in when there's less pressure (1st string should have gotten a nice lead or so far behind it doesn't matter). Also, he said expectations are lower of the 2nd string & you're just trying to "hold the fort" while the 1st string recovers & comes back to get the glory.</p>
<p>True to his goal & fondest wish, he was in the 2nd string & enjoyed being a team member without the pressure. It was a win-win, since the 1st string really wanted to be 1st string. He was glad he wasn't lower down (3rd & 4th string rarely ever got any court time--he never wanted to be one of those--huge team), but there is a lot to be said for not ALWAYS shooting for the top & finding what the CHILD wants & will be happy with.
Our kids are wiser than we are in many ways. Sometimes we can learn a lot by listening to them (of course they could learn if they ever chose to listen to use too <grin>).</grin></p>
<p>My s is sophomore. I like to know when is the best time to take the first SAT I test. He may consider early decision or action next year.</p>
<p>He will take the PSAT in the fall (Oct) and should plan to take the SATI test in the winter (Jan-March). You want to avoid having him take the SATI in the late spring because of AP tests and SATII tests. If he needs to retake the SATI, he'll still have plenty of options for retesting dates before he has to apply to college in fall of senior year.</p>
<p>Gee. I find I'm liking having this thread. I think I had my head in the sand before. From reading the posts from the less ignorant than me, sounds like having S do independent SAT prep this summer/fall to ger ready for the PSAT and the SAT is the right path. Especially since heaven forbid he might have a tutor who was not a genius and therefore would be worthy of no respect.</p>
<p>S is another who doesn't care to aim too high. Case in point, music. <em>Close your eyes now if you don't want to read parent going on and on about child's achievements:)</em>. S could sing at the age of 1. Noodled away on the piano early. Started piano lessons at 9 or whatever. Teacher told us in her 30 years of teaching he was the most musical student she had ever had. He hated the lessons. Took for only 2 years. Since the lessons had forced all joy for music out of him, we said fine, quit. Come high school, the kids have to take some artistic something. I, being a scheming mother, sign him up for band. OK, so he doesn't actually play a band instrument, whatever. He picks up the saxophone. Despite never practicing he now plays adequately. Does he take lessons? Nope. Just picks it up from school. Does he like it? Yes. Finally. Letting him do this without any performance pressure, it's been one of his favorite classes. </p>
<p>And then there was the obssessive downloading of '70s R&B and soul music. He knows really a lot about the OJays...</p>
<p>BTW, just to be open, I confess to exaggerating S's traits a wee bit....It's all in fun, right?</p>
<p>Carolyn,
I've come to a similar conclusion as you have about pushing my kids too hard at times. I think it was a reaction to not being pushed at all by my own parents, who were very laissez-faire in all aspects of child-rearing, and practically non-existent in terms of college help. I always sort of wondered if I would have done more or better with higher expectations and more support from them. However, I'm very happy with what I've accomplished in life so far and am proud to have done it basically with little support (except financially for collegl, thank goodness for that). I relish the independence and self-discipline that I've learned. So things do work out.</p>
<p>When I look at what my college-freshman S has accomplished and is doing now that he is independent from us, however, I am happy that I had high expectations for him in high school. Left to his own devices, he definitely would not be in the calibur of university he's in now and likely would not be getting the fantastic opportunities that he's getting. Would he still be happy? I'm sure of it. He's very adaptable. But he's getting to experience college at a really different level than he would have were he allowed to just coast through high school (he had strong slacker tendencies develop in sophomore year; thankfully, by junior year, he emerged from that, though it hit again in senior year). I can't help but think that his life opportunities might turn out a little better for having pushed a bit in high school. The key, of course, is balance. You really do have to know when to push and insist and when to back off and let them make their own way. That was the hardest part for me, those times when he just said "enough, I'm choosing not to give this thing (project, class, event) my full attention. I'm only giving it a C effort and that's okay." He was good at saying I'm only going to go for a 70% on this test because I've calculated I can still get an A-minus in the class. That kind of stuff really got to me because I thought 'here's a kid with soooo much more potential intellectually than anyone in our families and he's not pushing himself." But I learned that he did push himself in the areas that he felt were important. And that's what he's doing now on his own. </p>
<p>I guess, looking back, I wouldn't change my expectations for him during high school, even though it would have been in some ways easier to just turn the whole thing over to him and stay out of it. </p>
<p>With my sophomore D, it's been a learning curve for me as a parent, as well. She is taking the same high school classes as S and is working three times as hard as him but struggles to get high B's. I can't hold the same expectations for her GPA and testing wise. Top Tier schools are not in her future, nor would they be appropriate for her even if she could somehow get in. She would be miserable, overwhelmed, overshadowed. But she, too, will likely be very happy at the college she chooses because not only is she adaptable like S, she is the type of kid who just brings the sunshine with her wherever she goes. High EQ and tons of friends. My concern is finding the right school for her athletically (swimming) and intellectually (not a place where she can coast for four years, but not a place where she'll be drowning either). It seems like you've found the perfect place for your D, so I know it's possible! :)</p>
<p>The key, of course, is balance. You really do have to know when to push and insist and when to back off and let them make their own way. >></p>
<p>Amen. Truer words were never spoken.</p>
<p>Hi from another lurker. </p>
<p>I did post a couple of times on the old forum when D1 was looking. As a foreigner totally unfamiliar with the US education system she was my guinea pig. I got some good suggestions and she's now a college freshman. I've learned a lot but am sure I will come across a whole bunch of new issues with D2</p>
<p>D2 is a sophomore at a moderately large public suburban high school which does not really push or even strongly encourage its students. In my experience guidance has been weak as the staff seem to spend all their time dealing with the kids with problems & with class scheduling - too many options but nothing ever fits together. They have just set up a new room which has plenty of materials on both colleges and other post high school options and may prove to be a useful resource. A low percentage of students go on to top ranked colleges, very few out of state. The majority go to local state schools or community college and the guidance counsellors' knowledge of out of state schools seems to be limited, especially regarding LACs</p>
<p>She's a good student - all As in honors classes, will take 2 or 3 AP classes next year. Participates in athletics fall and spring, but not a star athlete. Took PSATs in the fall - did very well but not the stellar stats I've seen posted by other people in this forum. I'm unlikely to be able to get her to do a SAT prep class. No ideas yet on what she is looking for in terms of a college - neither potential majors nor school size etc. All she has said is not rural, not too cold & not all female. She would not fit in anywhere too preppy. Willing to look outside the NE. We have not done any visits yet and she did not come along with D1 when she was looking. We're not really talking about it yet - it's early days. When the college brochures start to arrive it may trigger some discussion.</p>
<p>Expect some sibling effect as D1 was accepted to all the schools to which she applied and received offers of merit aid at most. They are really different personalities and D2 does not intend to apply to any of these schools Also don't know how much she's going to want my involvement - D1 was happy to hear my suggestions, asked me to review her applications etc (although in the end the decision was entirely hers), but I'm not convinced that will be the case this time around.</p>
<p>Looking forward to an interesting couple of years.</p>
<p>I am glad to see the circle is widening.</p>
<p>from another lurker...
I joined today- I have a senior D who got in the first one of her 12 college choices. My sophmore S is watching the whole process of his highly motivated competitive sister and we haven't talked about it much. When we visited Boston when he was in 8th grade, he said he wanted to go to MIT- but he doesn't have that competitve drive that she does. He's bright but second child and male- anxiety- he wants what she has without working as hard. He's doing well in school- 4.0 weighted and loves the hands on drafting, likes science and math. We'll just see where he looks. I'm not pushing it until next fall and he's not asking. The mail has been arriving, he looks at it but his sister is in the spotlight and waiting zone now, we'll be looking next fall.
It will be interesting going through this with fellow parents. And then I get to go through it again and again!</p>
<p>Welcome to my fellow lurkers ;) </p>
<p>I have been reading some of the old trip reports on cc and found a wonderful discussion about Earlham and Grinnel and their bent toward liberalism or conservativism. My son (sometimes short on drive and high on anxiety) is a moderate conservative. He is considering Beloit, but all that we've read suggests they're pretty liberal. I read one (very conservative) student's report on Beloit that he didn't feel like he fit in at all -- in fact felt attacked by the strong liberals there. Does anyone have any experience with Beloit? Do you think a moderate conservative could survive there?
--Rhonda</p>
<p>I can't comment on Beloit, but am wondering if he is considering schools where a moderate conservative definitely would be comfortable socially. How about Davidson, Wake Forest, Claremont McKenna, for example? As someone who graduated from a college that was far more conservative than I am, I think that political fit is important. I think you are doing the right thing to look at this aspect.</p>
<p>Glad to join you all! I have a senior D who is waiting, anxiously, to hear from her schools (did not apply to any ED, EA or rolling, unfortunately). Oldest D really maximized her academic abilities with hard work and discipline. Had a host of ECs including four years as class president, three varsity sports, etc. Her scores were decent but not off the charts. She just worked hard at everything and was happy to have me as her administrative assistant and guide since she was so pressed for time. My sophomore D is very different. Sophomore D is naturally more intellectuallly curious, a quicker study and has quirky EC's that are interesting and have exposed her to interesting people. However, she has no study habits (having gotten by without them) and sees any question by me as an opportunity to "micromanage" her. Her sophomre PSAT scores were fine (much better than older sister) but with little effort I could see significant improvement, however, how to coax her to do that is another story. She is 16 going on 23 and has life figured out, so she thinks. Should be an intersting ride...for her and for me! Thank you Carolyn for bringing us together. Let the good times begin! For oldest D I turned to CC for information; for this D I will need support and a padded cell perhaps.</p>
<p>rgheitb,
My daughter will be attending Beloit next year, and also was very interested in Earlham at one time. She has a mix of political views - conservative on some things, liberal on others, but smack dab in the middle on most issues. She is, however, also not exactly passionate about political issues.</p>
<p>She loved Earlham for many reasons (she did their Explore-a-college program) but ultimately decided against applying. One of the reasons was because she felt the campus was too politicized for her personal preferences. She particularly felt that the curriculum was too liberal-leaning for her personally. She felt much more comfortable at Beloit, where, yes, there is a liberal slant, but also less political interest in general, a greater acceptance for moderate views, and definitely a less liberal bent to the curriculum. </p>
<p>She has talked with current students online through the Beloit admitted students website and the Beloit live journal community (<a href="http://community.livejournal.com/beloit_college/%5B/url%5D">http://community.livejournal.com/beloit_college/</a>) and has had this confirmed to her satisfaction. I would say that while Beloit isn't exactly a hot bed of political activism, it is definite a bit of quirky school, with lots of different personalities and perspectives, and a very welcoming community. For my daughter, that is an ideal mix, but it may not be for everyone. I'd recommend that your son visit next year when he's a junior and do an overnight --- that's the best way to see if he'd be comfortable at any school. If you do visit, you may want to add in visits to Lake Forest College and Lawrence University just for comparison's sake. Between the three, your son will get a good idea of what type of school he would feel most comfortable at.</p>
<p>Movinmom,
Oh gosh, your daughter sounds like a perfect match for my son. Especially the "mom, you're micromanaging me" part. :)</p>
<p>atlantamom,
Thanks for the ideas. I checked out Davidson, Wake Forest, and Claremont McKenna at their web sites. All three look like great schools. Davidson especially looks like a good match for my son except that their computer science studies don't look as strong as he might like (he wants to leave open the option to pursue a Masters in Comp Sci), and, interestingly enough, he doesn't want to attend a school in the South. Western Kentucky, where we live, is culturally very much like the Deep South. He said he wants to explore a new region of the country. He has also ruled out the Gulf Coast and part of the Alantic Seaboard, due to the frequency and severity of hurricanes (that's how Rice University and Florida Institute of Technology fell off of his list). </p>
<p>Since we live in Univ. of KY Wildcat basketball country, we have definitely heard of Wake Forest. Wake Forest looks like it has a strong Comp Sci Department and does offer a BS degree. However, their enrollment is over 4,000 and it is in the South. </p>
<p>Claremont McKenna looks like an excellent school. Again, concern about the strength of their Comp Sci program. Interestingly, Harvey Mudd (a very strong Comp Sci program) in the same Consortium is on my son's reach school list, along with Rose-Hulman; however, he's showing the most interest in Liberal Arts Colleges where the education is broader. He's talking about minoring or even double majoring in foreign languages or history. </p>
<p>My son has created a tough list to work with; he prefers:
Private Liberal Arts College; enrollment around 4,000 or less; preferably in the Northeast or Midwest; School's focus is on undergraduate education; Professors, not TA's teach; class discussions common; must offer a Bachelor of Science degree; strong Computer Science program, but with other strong Science majors available; preferably strong foreign languages and history departments; preferably as far away from a big city as possible [we're talking about way out in the sticks ;) That surprised me]; preferably little to no Greek scene; with a strong reputation for preparing students for grad school; a high freshmen retention rate (he prefers 90% or higher); able to have a car on campus; nice residential halls; high diversity; opportunities for study overseas; preferably not too liberal or conservative (moderates welcome); no compulsory religious affiliation; and preferably not a party school (his idea), with substance free housing available. Out of all the colleges available in all the books we bought, he only found five colleges he wanted to visit. We plan to visit Beloit, Denison, and Allegheny. He took Colgate and Hamilton off the list when he discovered they did not offer a B.S. degree. I really thought Hamilton would be a good fit politically for him. He's really got us boxed in.
--Rhonda</p>