<p>re: Maryland.<br>
Bethesda is not the South. The Eastern Shore is. Baltimore? It kind of depends where. I grew up in Maryland, and there really is a lot of variation in viewpoints and habits. In the 1968 election, there was a lot of support for Eugene McCarthy in the suburbs of D.C., and elsewhere there was a lot of support for George Wallace. (Not sure how Spiro Agnew fit with the Southern/non-Southern divide.)</p>
<p>I'm with marite now on the titling. Let's change it to:</p>
<p>"EXCELLENT COLLEGES SOUTH OF WASHINGTON, DC AND EAST OF THE RIO GRANDE"</p>
<p>:)</p>
<p>She's a rising Jr. marite....and not quite sure what she wants. She's undergone a dramatic change the past two years; physically, mentally, emotionally. Why all suggestions are greatly appreciated.</p>
<p>Before we leave the question of "Ivies" altogether -- It just occurred to me that no one has mentioned something obvious. There is one unquestionable "Ivy of the South": Princeton. Notwithstanding its location in (formerly rural) New Jersey (less than a four hour drive from much of Virginia), it has a long history of being especially attractive to Southern students, going back to the 1840s.</p>
<p>I think she will continue to change through the next couple of years, so it is a good idea to introduce her to a variety of schools: large, mid-size, small (and small can be anything from 1300 to nearly 3,000), in different types of location (urban, suburban, rural). If she likes certain sports or activities, think of where it might be easier for her to continue these (doing community service can be a little bit less easy when a student is in rural location than it would be in an urban environment, for instance).
You and she could discuss whether she would feel comfortable all four years (not just the first) in a small rural college, or whether she would feel overwhelmed by a large state university. You should also discuss your financial situation with her and look into possibilities of merit pay vs. need-based financial aid so that she does not become focused on an impossibly expensive dream school.
The schools already mentioned in this thread all sound excellent, so she would have a wide choice to begin with, but she needs to narrow her list down a bit.</p>
<p>East of Rio Grande includes half of New Mexico and cities like Denver. I don't think that is what OP meant. Curious on folks' notions of "the South." Certainly there exist continued anti-Southern (and anti-NY, anti-LA, etc.) prejudices. It is truly silly to say Florida is not in "the South." There is of course no more southern state in America, and it was a charter member of Confederacy. </p>
<p>One can only conclude that not considering Florida part of "the South" is in reaction to the emigration of many northerners and Latinos there, and an implicit commentary that "the South" is composed of rednecks and yahoos or, conversely, that a state with such a population does not merit the monicker as it does not adhere in the commentator's mind to the regimen of cornpone, corn whisky and slow-drawlin' of the "real South." </p>
<p>In case one has not noticed, Texas is no longer a majority caucasian state, and Maryland and Virginia are mostly, in population, suburban Washington. Where I grew up (in the Shenandoahs), Virginia is still largely rural and "backward," but I found that kind of thinking in the North as well. I don't believe it is a sound basis for false pride.</p>
<p>My jersey friends will greatly discount Princeton being in the south! (smiles) But it is closer than a school in Virginia that D1 applied. However, as Princeton was the ONLY rejection D1 received, D2 isn't looking their way!</p>
<p>"I'll bet they sweeten their iced tea in MD, therefore it's the South."</p>
<p>Actually it is untrue that the farther South you go they only drink sweet tea. I believe that may be true of the Carolinas but I've traveled through most of the Deep South and there are lots of areas where sweat tea is no prefered. In fact my mother-in-law was from Mississippi - and quite the cook too, and she hated sweat tea. The South is a huge region and there is more cultural diversity in it than most folks think and it isn't all just the recent blossoming of its major cities.</p>
<p>Florida is most certainly part of the south, but what (I think) people mean when they say it isn't, is that there are very real regional/cultural differences within the state. You go up into the panhandle, Tallahassee area...then go to Miami/South Beach...then go to the Keys...then Tampa...then Orlando, the east coast (Cocoa beach, Daytona, St. Augustine). There are so many differences, and most people who "visit" only see one or two places. So I can see that Florida does not seem like a southern state, depending on where you go.</p>
<p>Add to that, that most people have only lived here for one or two generations, so they're really "culturally" from elsewhere (the Northeast, the Caribbean...)</p>
<p>I'm a 4th gen Floridian, and believe me, people who have deep roots here definitely believe Florida is a southern state. But it is QUIRKY. And we're proud of it!</p>
<p>I wasn't suggesting that Princeton was in the South, only that it is the Ivy League university that has something of a Southern identification -- certainly compared to the other Ivy League universities.</p>
<p>Florida: I don't think anyone doubts that most of Florida is indeed in the South. Just not South Beach. Or the parts that are effectively in South America. (It can get confusing.)</p>
<p>If anyone does doubt that Florida is in the South, he should read Their Eyes Were Watching God and Killing Mister Watson.</p>
<p>On the other hand, huge chunks of Maryland are in the South, too (but maybe not the Johns Hopkins Medical Center or the Bethesda metro stop). Anyone doubting that should read The Chaneysville Incident, which shows that southern Pennsylvania along the Maryland border was pretty much the South, too.</p>
<p>"If anyone does doubt that Florida is in the South, he should read Their Eyes Were Watching God and Killing Mister Watson."</p>
<p>Also, if anyone wants a real look at Florida and a great read- "Land Remembered" by Patrick Smith. My all time favorite. It's great reading for anyone 10 to 100. Required reading for our middle school students.</p>
<p>Hadn't I read somewhere that parts of Florida were an extension of NYC? Or is it just the Miami area? j/k</p>
<p>AAAAAACKCKKCKCKCK^^^
Spoken like a native Floridian. :)</p>
<p>I just don't think the term IVY will ever go away.....just read in another thread..."public ivies". Guess that is the UVA's, W&M's and UNC's. Sorry.......not too familar with schools outside the VA/NC area.</p>
<p>Momray, If I had the great universities surrounding me that you do (UNC, UVA, William and Mary, Davidson, Emory, Duke, Washington and Lee, Wake Forest, ect) I would not be as familiar with other schools either! :)
GO WAKE!</p>
<p>As far as Florida goes, I doubt people in Miami think of themselves as Southern but I may be wrong. (so many New Yorkers) but in Northern Florida (ie Jacksonville) it might as well be Southern Georgia culturally.</p>
<p>Forgetting geography, Baltimore feels way more southern than its southern neighbor, Washington, DC.</p>
<p>And UVA feels more southern than UNC...</p>
<p>"Washington is a city of Northern charm and Southern efficiency." (or words to that effect)
--John F. Kennedy</p>
<p>momray</p>
<p>I helped my son generate a list by reading descriptions of the schools in guidebooks such as the Fiske and Insider's guides. They are good at describing the personality of the schools, what the students tend to be like, the sports emphasis, Greek or no-Greek social scene. My son wanted intellectually curious students who didn't take themselves too seriously, a geeky-not-Greeky social scene, low sports emphasis, not preppy. With those descriptors and a lot of free time, I combed through those guides--they are very similar--one would have been enough-- and came up with about 30 small LACs my son narrowed to 20 by reading the descriptions. We visited the 20 and he picked 10 to apply to. This is one way to do it, though most people probably wouldn't visit that many. I feel the guides are more objective than the websites in describing the student body and the social life, also the dorms and food. The Fiske is alphabetical and the Insider's is organized by state.</p>
<p>Everythime anyone recommended a school for him that wasn't on his list, I ran back to the guides and could always find a clear reason why we hadn't considered it. Not that my son couldn't adapt to a wide variety of campus cultures, but he's had to do so much adapting in hs and I felt it was worth looking for places where he could really thrive, not just survive. Especially at today's prices!!</p>
<p>In generations past Princeton was known as the "Northern School for Southern Gentlemen," because of its preferences for WASP students and white privilege. In particular, southerners prefered Princeton over Harvard in the early 20th century because they believed Harvard wasn't sufficiently 'Jim Crow.' The late New York judge and author Bruce Wright told audiences about his rejection letter from Princeton undergrad in the 1950s. His grades were excellent, but Princeton admissions officials opined that he would be more comfortable on a campus with a greater number of 'negro' students.</p>