<p>It is amazing to see some of the arguments on this thread that are based on either very limited or almost no data or information. I see multiple references to the size of the WashU waitlist - yet I have never seen any official published numbers on the size of the waitlist. If someone actually has access to these - please publish a link. </p>
<p>As I read some of the above - the implication is that top students get rejected by WashU. If that is the case, I wonder where WashU obtains its top 25% of students from. The ones that score over 1520 on the old SAT.</p>
<p>Seems to be a lot of entitlement sentiment when it comes to WashU. If I can get into (Ivy or whatever) then I of course I should be a WashU admit. Don't think it works that way what fits for one school may or may not for another. Thank goodness it is not all about stats only - it really would be a dull campus then - believe me it is anything but. Vibrant, exciting, happy, intelectual, friendy - yes all those but not dull.</p>
<p>As for turning down so called "higher rated schools" - yes a lot of students at WashU do that. In our case almost a full ride at Duke. Know of quite a few that turned down Ivy schools. Not that one was better than the other, but it was a better fit for the student. As people have previously posted - the best way to decide - is go visit - spend an overnight in a dorm - get to know the students - profs and campus culture. </p>
<p>If you really want WashU stay on the waitlist - if it was truly not your first choice - the go for your dream school and be happy. Just be happy after choosing - bitterness and happiness feed on themselves. Now choose what you want and I am sure everything will work out for the best.</p>
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Oh no! MIT just posted their admit stats for this year. 12443 app, 1533 accepted, 500 waitlisted. Hmm, about same or greater waitlist ratio for accepted to applied then Wustl.
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MIT admitted 30 students off the waitlist by May 9 last year and notified the rejects at the same time, as well as keeping them updated through their blog. How many did WUStL accept off the waitlist last year? Did they give them updates?</p>
<p>warblersrule86 - It seems you don't read previous posts. Due to a higher than expected conversion rate, WashU over enroled by more than 150 students in last year's freshman class. Due to that situation - nobody was taken from the waitlist last year.</p>
Ah, but that's my point. If they didn't take anyone from the waitlist last year, why would they waitlist so many this year? They're predicting a bigger yield than last year's (32%). The most they've admitted from the waitlist in the last five years (in 2003) is 23.</p>
<p>A dramatic one year change in conversion percentage is not a reliable predictor for the following year. It can only be a small part of historical data. From what I understand their plan was to initially admit less students this year, to prevent the same situation they had last year. As a result of this, I would expect a more extensive use of the waitlist this year. This at least gives those who choose to accept the waitlist a shot at admission.</p>
<p>As for time of decision, from the way I read the article and my knowledge of the WashU process - the class is monitored from mid May through the end of June. It does not say that all decisions are made at the end of June. Waitlist decisions are made and spots offered as space becomes available. Even in June there are accepted students that for one reason or another decide not to attend. As this happens, available spaces are offered to people on the waitlist.</p>
<p>We do have information and that is the limited sample on CC. People make inference out of limited data all the time. If you always have all the data, there's no need for statistics then. While I agree with you we can't say with 100% confidence what the distribution is really like based on what we see on CC, you can't deny the fact that WashU board has much larger fraction of waitlists than others. To believe WashU isn't atypical is to believe the sample on WashU board is somehow extremely skewed.</p>
<p>Why is washu silly? Is Washu really obligated to give your friend one prize for his where-I-was-admitted trophy case? Your friend got into MIT and is going to MIT. Perhaps there was something about his application that had this inevitable outcome written all over it. Washu saved its acceptance for a different highly qualified student who, if you read the gleeful comments on the acceptances thread, will be happy to attend. Happy students make a happy campus. Sounds smart to me.</p>
<p>i have a 2250, 33, siemens-westinghouse, JSHS, IMSA
i have been accepted to two straight medical programs</p>
<p>i was waitlisted by wash U and was wondering why... I found out from my CAC that</p>
<p>Wash U wait lists people who they feel won't go to their school because 1) the students have better schools on their list 2) the students stats are too good</p>
<p>Wash U pays attention to race and financial status as well. If there is a rich white kid and a poor Asian kid with the same stats, the rich white kid will probably get in</p>
<p>Sam Lee - I agree with "we can't say with 100% confidence what the distribution is really like based on what we see on CC". I also believe that making any general inference based on the very limited sampling on CC makes no sense. That is the same as me asking a few dozen people "who will win the next election" and then believing the result has any validity. Out of more than 22,000 applicants - there are possibly a few hundred (at most) on this board. Probably less than 1% of total applicants. But at least it is a good place for people to vent during/after a very stressful time. I just wonder, for someone no longer involved with WashU, why you are so bitter concerning WashU.</p>
<p>
[quote]
Ah, but that's my point. If they didn't take anyone from the waitlist last year, why would they waitlist so many this year? They're predicting a bigger yield than last year's (32%). The most they've admitted from the waitlist in the last five years (in 2003) is 23.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>An excellent point. If the school is aware that it will not be pulling many at all from the waitlist, why make the waitlist so large? A previous comment, that maybe WashU just doesn't want to hurt the kids' feelings, is a nice thought but in the end as a student I would rather let go of the school through a rejection than be given false hope. </p>
<p>We must think - what is the ultimate point of the waitlist? Consider its purpose and then consider, without bias, why a school would place so many on a waitlist. Perhaps WashU isn't so bad with the waitlist, but we will never know for sure until the numbers are revealed (and given WashU's treatment of privacy concerning the CDS, we may never know). MIT certainly waitlisted a lot, but in the grand scheme of things, they rejected the vast majority of applicants and if it is a selective, great school, that is how it should be.</p>
<p>brand_182 -As to the statement "If the school is aware that it will not be pulling many at all from the waitlist, why make the waitlist so large? A school does not know how many it will be pulling from its waitlist at the time that the initial waitlist is offered. They do not know what their conversion percentage will be for that year. As previously stated - The conversion percentage last year was higher than expected resulting in over enrolment. Obviously not a situation that WashU was happy with, since they had to scramble with their housing situation.</p>
<p>Again people have a choice to either accept or not accept the waitlist. If WashU is not that important then just refuse the wait list offer. If it is then give it a shot, knowing the potential accepted numbers as stated in the above post. Admission is not a right it is a privelege. It is the right of any given school to choose the people that they feel gives them the best freshman class. Is it perfect - NO, but based on what I have seen of the campus atmosphere and mix at WashU - it seems to work well for them.</p>
<p>
[quote]
The conversion percentage last year was higher than expected resulting in over enrolment.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>But my point was that the school expects the yield to be higher this year and even if it is not, it is still dealing with the burden of previous over-enrollment. Why then, if the school expects more students to accept the offer of admission and if it ultimately needs to keep its numbers down, is it offering so many a place on the waitlist that will hardly be utilized? Of course, that last part is speculation, but judging from previous data, it is logical to say that very few will get off of the waitlist. </p>
<p>Warbersrule's post is very informative and people are missing the main point - if the greatest number of students taken off the WL in the last five years is 23, why do they need to waitlist a thousand or more students? Especially given the current limitations on the size of the student body, I would argue that the school really only needs a small number on its WL. Where are all of the rejections and why is everyone being waitlisted?</p>
<p>
[quote]
there are possibly a few hundred (at most) on this board. Probably less than 1% of total applicants. But at least it is a good place for people to vent during/after a very stressful time. I just wonder, for someone no longer involved with WashU, why you are so bitter concerning WashU.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>You can't deny, however, what you see about the waitlist is <em>very</em> different from those on other boards. I don't see a particular reason why WashU board would somehow draw a particularly bitter crowd to vent while others have a more "normal" crowd. This isn't the first year. It was like that last year or the year before. :)</p>
<p>As I previously stated - to speculate on the size of a waitlist - with no actual data - except from a very limited CC sampling makes no sense. People mentioning a waitlist of a thousand plus is based on pure speculation. To predict a higher conversion percentage for this year based on only last year and not historical numbers is not a valid decision. </p>
<p>As you stated "possibly very few will get off the waitlist". Knowing that information, people then have a choice of either accepting or not accepting the waitlist. If deciding to not accept, treat WashU as a rejection and move on to the next choice. The kids that decide to attend seem to be quite happy when they become part of the student body. Just as I am sure that the students that decide to attend another school are also happy.</p>
<p>Sam Lee - You are right about the WashU board drawing a particularly bitter crowd to vent. For whatever reason it seems that WashU appliants seem to have a strong sense of entitlement. If I or someone got into blank school(Ivy - Stanford etc.) they should automatically be entitled to WashU admission. Based on my experience, WashU students are a pretty amazing group. But again it has to be a good fit for a particular student. It was the right school for us - it may not be the right school for others. I believe that there is no right or best school for everyone - what works for one may not work for another. The same goes from a school point of view - what could be a great student for one school may not be the right student for another school. Just my opinion for what it is worth.</p>
<p>I really think this post made by a parent in another thread captures how some of us feel and why it seems wrong to have so many on a waitlist:</p>
<p>
[quote]
</p>
<p>Originally posted by kjofkw:</p>
<p>I don't know about everyone else, and I certainly don't feel my daughter was entitiled to Wash U. admission. All I know is that it was her dream school. Her stats. put her clearly in the middle mid-50%. She was definitely not one of the overqualified. It was truly a fantastic "fit" for her. She had numerous reasons why the school was a great match. Knowing that the level of interest was important, she visited twice from a distance, went to any information session offered, interviewed, and applied for the numerous scholarships (all with separate applications), and applied early (but not ED). It was in no way a safety or a back-up. WE forced her to apply to other schools, knowing the reputation of Wash U. She was admitted everywhere (except WUSL), including one school we never thought she had the chance. But her heart is not anywhere else. And to be honest, none of the other schools provide as good a match with her interests!</p>
<p>Like nearly everyone else, she was waitlisted. I don't know how to advise her. Based on many more years of life's experience, I want to say move on. But she cannot. She doesn't know if she has even a slight chance, or if, like the lottery, she would be throwing her dreams away, for no chance at all. Just like the lottery, we know that she has NO chance if she does not include her name on the waitlist. But we don't know how to steer her heart in another direction when there still is a glimmer of hope. A simply deny would have been so much clearer of course. </p>
<p>But I don't know if it is a soft deny, or if there is any chance for her. The shear number of students on the waitlist is intimidating! That's our biggest gripe. It truly seems like a lottery to me, and with most lotteries, I believe it is a waste of your time, effort, dollars, and worst of all hope.</p>