<p>"being ahead in a CA public school system is probably below average at top preps. They are overwhelmed with kids who've been to the best school's in the Country since preschool and are highly accomplished. Art appreciation and psyc are not going to get you a lot of points. "</p>
<p>Suze - I think it depends on what public school you attend in CA. For example, our local public hs offers multiple sections of 12 different AP subjects and 5 foreign languages as well as sign language. Over 5% of the class of 2005 score at least one 800 on a section of the SATs, over 20 enrolled at UC Berkeley alone (more were accepted) and others enrolled at UCLA, Vanderbilt, Princeton, Harvard, MIT, GWU, Amherst, etc. This hs very good (in the top 10%), but not at the top of the public schools in CA.</p>
<p>"Suze - I think it depends on what public school you attend in CA. For example, our local public hs offers multiple sections of 12 different AP subjects and 5 foreign languages as well as sign language. Over 5% of the class of 2005 score at least one 800 on a section of the SATs, over 20 enrolled at UC Berkeley alone (more were accepted) and others enrolled at UCLA, Vanderbilt, Princeton, Harvard, MIT, GWU, Amherst, etc. This hs very good (in the top 10%), but not at the top of the public schools in CA."</p>
<p>um...12 APs; that's nothing.....</p>
<p>5%? That's not worth bragging</p>
<p>"over 20 enrolled at UC Berkeley alone (more were accepted) and others enrolled at UCLA"
knock knock, instate admissions man....</p>
<p>Most likely, it would be impossible to find a public school that met the standards at prep schools. Prep schools have so, so many advantages--a public school, right now, could not catch up.</p>
<p>bearcats - I don't think you need to be so negative about things you are not familiar with. "knock knock, instate admissions man...." FYI the minimum GPA to apply for out-of-state students is 3.6 and 3.2 for instate students, but most of the accepted students have 4.0 or better. Any student needs outstanding credentials to get accepted to Berkeley. I just spent last weekend participating in the UCB Leadership Scholar application reads so I am somewhat familiar with students currently applying to Berkeley.</p>
<p>"um...12 APs; that's nothing....." although Hotchkiss has listed 27, the public hs has all of those except the foreign literature courses, music theory, and human geography. Also I counted Calc AB/BC, CS A/AB, Macro/Microecon as 3single courses, but they are listed separately as 6 different AP classes on the Hotchkiss list.</p>
<p>prettyckitty is correct in that public schools in CA that receive approximately 8K per year per hs student will never be able to compete with a bs who gets $40K + endowment $$ per student per year.</p>
<p>Those who are lucky enough to experience a prep school education should be very thankful that they were offered that opportunity and should have no need to knock the many other ways to get a great education (including CA public schools.)</p>
<p>well these schools are selective, but I would think the teachers aren't as qualified as the teachers in Exeter or Andover. After all, public school teachers generally get paid less...</p>
<p>No, EuNixD, actually private school teachers are paid less. Public schol teachers are generally a member of the UNION, and therefore make whatever they want to make. Private school teachers choose to work where they work because they prefer the student body/facilities/benefits/etc.</p>
<p>Bearcats, seriously.. could you stop already? Hotchkiss is AMAZING!!!!! Goooo Hotchkiss! Hotchkiss is superior! We got it! Better than you! And you! And youuu! Please stop!</p>
<p>In CA, the top 5% of each graduating class is gaurenteed a spot and one in-state college. But not of their choosing. Therefore, Berkeley doesn't even admit the top 1%. It's not a bad school. Neither is Amherst. Harvard isn't bad either.</p>
<p>EuNixD - I think you may be wrong about the financial aspect - in many areas of CA the public school teachers make good salaries ($55-90K) with amazing benefits and are required to have complete a year long teaching credential program as well as other certifications. </p>
<p>BS teachers often get housing and paid sabbaticals as part of their package so their actual salaries may be deceptive.</p>
<p>The difference we saw is that the class size at bs was much smaller (often less than half the size of public school classes) and often were on a "block" schedule which varied from day to day over a two week period of single or double periods. Smaller class size is much more conducive to learning and the students and teachers enjoy full participation. Many public school teachers would do just as well as bs teachers if their students were hand-picked and their class sizes were cut in half. Although many of the bs teachers may not have teaching credentials, most have a love for their subject and sharing it with their students that more than make up for the lack of formal teachers' training. </p>
<p>Also BS teachers are hired "at will" by the school while most public school systems use the "tenure track" system. Similarly, BS students are enrolled "at will" and can be tossed out if they do not fit in or perform to standards. Public schools must accomodate students at all levels and there are laws in many states that prevent academic-level grouping (i.e. in most elementary schools there cannot be high, medium, and low classes at each grade level.)</p>
<p>Qualified teachers are everywhere in public schools, but many of these other conditions often hinder their ability to do their job to the best of their abilities.</p>
<p>creasmonkey never did anything to provoke you, bearcats. He was just making a point that not every single CA public school didn't have top student matriculate to some good colleges. My school is really rather s___ty, but out of the 75 seniors, there are a few who go to the top NE LAC's/Stanford, and more than a few who go to Berkeley/UCLA/UCSB/UCSD, etc. And these kids.. aren't overachievers in any way, rarely do SAT prep, and barely try in class.</p>
<p>Yeah, my teacher has her master's and vacations all around the world every other weekend. Not exactly underpaid/underqualified. And again, my school is one of the worst I've been to.. it's pretty bad.</p>
<p>They strike because they can. Teachers in CA get about 70,000 a year..almost twice the national household income. Yet CA has the 47th worst public school system in the country. Food for thought. It's not about money; we have enough money being wasted at our public schools. It's about administration and unions.</p>
<p>It's more about class size and the financial support of the infrastructure of our schools in CA. Funds that are set aside for capital improvements cannot be used for salaries and vice-versa. CA approved reduced class size for elementary schools and only funded the teachers' salaries. The districts have to scramble for $$ to pay for portable classrooms to house the students. CA also has one of the largest minority and ESL populations to educate as well.</p>
<p>As you move further away from the borders, the population is more English speaking and homogeneous.</p>
<p>from all borders, not just the south. only the middle.. san luis obispo to just under san jose is more white, homogeneous, etc. and bakersfield, sort of. the north has a huge migrant population, suprisingly... but wayyy up by oregon/wash, it starts to look like a lot of middle states.</p>
<p>but yeah, we have a lot to deal w/ here.</p>
<p>the CA public school system is the worst I have ever encountered (I've lived all over), but that doesn't mean there aren't exraordinary, challenging, schools (Whitney?)..this is, of course, taken into account in admissions, and opportunity for challenge is a huge factor (college and prep)</p>
<p>:) Actually I wasn't referring to CA borders - but rather US borders -- I was referring to states in the mid-west (i.e. Iowa, Nebraska) who have strong public schools, but a primarily white, English-speaking population, and less diversification to deal with.</p>
<p>um...i was just trying to explain suze point. CA public school system really isnt what california would be proud of, considering that they have the best public university system in the nation (i think this is pretty established with UCB UCLA UCSD and so on)... i just never get that. Considering that the UCs take more than 95% from instate, i really never understand it. How did the students all became "better" once they got into college??</p>