<p>@menloparkmom More Asians apply to these schools because they have the statistics to match them, not due to some explicable personal preference. I can confidently say that the number of Asian American students who applied with less than a 2200 is extremely low compared to those of other ethnicities. They wish to attend these top schools because they have the ability to excel there, just as most other applicants.</p>
<p>"Would you really claim that the OP’s chance of being rejected from a single school out of the 20 he applied to is the same as his chance of being rejected from all 20 of the schools he applied to? "
Yes. I am saying there is no correlation between the number of schools an applicant applies to and his “chances”. At any one school his application is going to be compared to other qualified applicants at that school, and that school only . Every year frustrated students try to derive meaning from unrelated admissions decisions. There are SO many factors that determine who is accepted and who is not, and at most “top” colleges, MOST STUDENTS ARE REJECTED. So if a student applies only to top colleges that REJECT 90% of applicants, then he is likely to be rejected by all of them.</p>
<p>“statistics to match them”
Statistics may get an application looked at, but they are not the determining factors when there are thousands more applicants with equivalent stats than a college can possibly accept, all applying to a college that looks at many other factors than just stats in determining who to accept…</p>
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<p>That is possible if the schools are of the similar characteristics. But the problem we are talking about is that the chances of the students with same statistics but different ethnicity is not same and that is what wrong.</p>
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<p>That’s tough and sorry to hear that. Sounds like lots of kids responded in this thread on the Parents Forum. </p>
<p>If you guys live in an Asian concentrated area, this may be less surprising. Your stats are by no means a small accomplishment, everyone knows that. However, there is a well-known, non-Asian, and 36 ACT/2400 SAT guy who got rejected from the some places you guys applied at. Hope that makes you feel a little better. </p>
<p>All of this shows that applicants need something else in addition to high stats. The value of that “something else” is highly subjective. All your siblings should learn from this is to do what they love and give it their best. The future is yours.</p>
<p>“They wish to attend these top schools because they have the ability to excel there.”
And they also have the ability to excel at MANY colleges and universities. But too many similar students trying to squeeze into too few colleges end up crowding each other out of acceptances at colleges that use many factors in admissions decisions.</p>
<p>“All of this shows that applicants need something else in addition to high stats. The value of that “something else” is highly subjective.”
EXACTLY. What is important is GOING to college, which is far easier in this country than anywhere else in the world. And making the most of your opportunities once you are there… Where you go to UG college is not the most important thing in life. Too many Asian students and parents in this country, and abroad , think it is.</p>
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<p>I really hate CC sometimes. What if I said: blacks are less likely to be intelligent enough to score high on the SAT or get good grades, let alone take Calculus III. I have more data to support my claim than you do yours.</p>
<p>I haven’t read through this thread, but I saw a mention of affirmative action, and doubts of its existence. Just read here: <a href=“http://opr.princeton.edu/faculty/Tje/EspenshadeSSQPtII.pdf[/url]”>http://opr.princeton.edu/faculty/Tje/EspenshadeSSQPtII.pdf</a></p>
<p>20 out of 20 rejections in those score ranges – I don’t care what the EC’s were, but it’s safe to assume they weren’t poor – is a travesty. I hope there were extenuating circumstances, like maybe a teacher that sabotaged your rec letters, because otherwise the situation is ridiculous. Excuse the parents being snide and presumptuous. It’s okay to be racist against Asians. It’s like a sport.</p>
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Yes, they look at more than statistics. But I repeat -
There are not “thousands more” students with SATs over 2350 (unless by “thousands” you mean around 2000).</p>
<p><a href=“http://professionals.collegeboard.com/profdownload/sat-percentile-ranks-composite-cr-m-w-2010.pdf[/url]”>Higher Education Professionals | College Board;
<p>For the record -
I am not a big fan of the SAT. I think it’s a stupid test, particularly in its present version. In the past, I have made similar statements myself about everybody getting stratospheric scores. But it just isn’t so. Scores over 2350, or even 2300 are extremely rare. Yes, I know there is superscoring. At this level I don’t believe it affects the total numbers than much.</p>
<p>Students A, B, C, D all have reasonable statistics to get into 20 good schools.</p>
<p>(Scenario I)</p>
<p>Student A applies to one school and gets rejected. </p>
<p>(Scenario II)</p>
<p>Students A, B, C, D each apply to 20 schools and all four get rejected from every single school.</p>
<p>@menloparkmom According to you, these two scenarios yield exactly the same probabilities of rejection. </p>
<p>(Scenario III)</p>
<p>I’m studying psychology and it is true that even after flipping a coin 19 times and getting heads every single time, the probabilitiy of getting heads on the 20th toss is still 50%. However, as preposterous as you deem my logic to be, the probability of getting 20 heads in a row (emphasis on all 20 consecutively) is still 0.000000964%. </p>
<p>@CollegeConfidential People out there, what do you think? Does applying to 20 schools rather than applying to merely a single school increase your chance of being admitted to at least one?</p>
<p>why are there people in this thread denying affirmative action? really now. colleges freely admit that race affects admissions. to say that if he and his friends had all been black they would still have gotten rejected from every single one of them is delusional. just my opinion of course.</p>
<p>anyway, eh, i’m sure OP that you’ll be fine wherever you go. i would spend a day pitying myself and then get over it; there’s nothing you can do. when you’re happy at rice or uchicago (personally got waitlisted there) or wherever you’ll forget all about this and realize that you don’t care harvard or MIT is a little more prestigious. and besides, if you really really want to, you can apply as a transfer next year or apply to them for grad school</p>
<p>@influence: i say it does increase your chances of getting at least one acceptance. otherwise i’d have to say all of america is really stupid for forking over so much money for absolutely no benefit</p>
<p>the point is, other people worked even harder. if you had those stats as well as national achivments in athletics like MANY people have, you would have gotten in.</p>
<p>I disagree. If you are born white (I realize these young men are Asian) you cannot work harder to change that. A white male may be more qualified than another applicant but get rejected, not because of stats and hard work, but rather race.</p>
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<p>Why not ask QuantMech? He is prominently featured in a lengthy thread on this very subject somewhere on here.</p>
<p>“Statistics may get an application looked at, but they are not the determining factors when there are thousands more applicants with equivalent stats.”</p>
<p>@menloparkmom My post did not even address the issue of admittance so don’t try and draw an illogical comparison. I was replying to your complaint about the “herd mentality which is typical of Asian college applicants”. It’s not a herd mentality as you so simply put it - it’s called college rankings. Once again, Asians apply in greater numbers because they have the statistics to match, not by any trivial personal fancy though I do not deny the prestige factor associated with these top universities.</p>
<p>@CollegeConfidential People out there, what do you think? Does applying to 20 schools rather than applying to merely a single school increase your chance of being admitted to at least one?</p>
<p>Of course.
Just go to any ivy sight and see who is getting accepted and rejected and then observe the acceptances that the rejected already have.
it is there in black and white as we carry on this conversation.</p>
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<p>I guess the reference to Amy Chua’s book and opinion in the Wall Street Journal was too subtle. If an applicant matches the “tiger child” stereotype, s/he may be at a disadvantage in front of an admissions committee (especially if “tiger child” stereotype applicants were overrepresented among the applicant pool), even if the (e.g.) piano/violin happened to be something that s/he got into it out of his/her own desire, not because a “tiger parent” forced him/her to do it.</p>
<p>In a broader sense, Asian applicants (including those who are not “tiger children”) may be at a disadvantage in any kind of holistic admissions committee at a school that values diversity among the students. One, Asian students are usually an ORM, so more Asian students do not help racial or ethnic diversity (in many prestigious schools, white students are URM in a literal sense, even if not in a policy sense). Two, Asian people tend to be concentrated in specific geographic areas, so schools looking for geographic diversity may not want too many from any given area. This kind of thing (especially the racial or ethnic aspect) was rumored and widely believed for decades, not just now. Of course, university admissions committees denied it.</p>
<p>It is evident from the following report that the number of candidates are not too large with a score > 2350.</p>
<p><a href=“College Board - SAT, AP, College Search and Admission Tools”>College Board - SAT, AP, College Search and Admission Tools;
<p>In the above link the total number of students score >= 2350 were 1600. </p>
<p>Harvard itself give more acceptances, so the following statement just don’t make any sense.</p>
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<p>Please be ready to backup your posts with facts.</p>
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<p>It’s also a documented fact that the acceptance rate of students with SAT 1 > 2300 is not 5% but close to 25%. So the admission in that group of students is not a crap shot even at HMSPY, so not getting into any of Ivies + M + S is really heart breaking.</p>
<p><a href=“http://www.princeton.edu/admission/applyingforadmission/admission_statistics/[/url]”>http://www.princeton.edu/admission/applyingforadmission/admission_statistics/</a></p>
<p>I’ve followed admissions for long now and the acceptance rate prior to 2008 for SAT1 > 2300 was > 30%</p>
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<p>What I would like to see and would be more telling is how many times the >2350 group took the test. My D has several Asian friends that have been studying in one way or another for the SAT since middle school, and take it multiple times. Does that make the student smarter, or just more diligent in repetitive studying of test taking skills?</p>
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<p>[SAT</a> - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia](<a href=“http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SAT]SAT”>SAT - Wikipedia)</p>
<p>Look for the following:
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<p>@GA2012MOM</p>
<p>I did not take any prep course for SAT I, SAT IIs (3 subjects) or ACT.
All I had were some books from Barnes and Noble.</p>
<p>Also, I have never seen any kid preparing for SAT or ACT from middle school.</p>
<p>^
POIH, you KNOW that is not true. We see here on CC kids that make huge jumps in their scores, often via tutoring, or just by plain good ole luck and superscoring. If tutoring only resulted in a 20 pt. increase, Kaplan, PR, and others would not be in business, and students would do the “one and done.” How many times did your D take her tests?</p>