Stress in High School

Parents Forum
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<p>I am a junior in high school and I posted this in the High School Life forum as well, but i wanted the parents to hear about it too. It's something that makes me really sad...</p>

<p>At my school there is an inordinant amount of stress about getting into college.
a teacher asked me to join a "stress commitee" about targeting the key sources of stress and trying to find some type of a solution. we had a meeting the other day just to talk about stress and where it comes from, and why. we focused on 4 main sources of stress: the colleges/college ratings, students, administration/teachers, and parents. something that one english teacher said really stuck out and really upset me, because it just rang so true:</p>

<p>in the honors english class (the highest level at our school, since the english dept. rebelled against APs and english is already extremely difficult anyway), people were given a paper assignment to write about a catch-22 they'd experienced in their own lives. <em>15</em> people wrote about being in honors english when they didnt enjoy it, just to get into college: the catch-22 was that they were miserable in the english class because they had no passion for it, but they'd be miserable if they didn't take it, because they would feel like underachievers that would not get into a "good" college. they cited multiple sources of stress, and how it affects them. one kid said,</p>

<p>"i take all honors courses for my mother, i play sports for my father, and i'm applying to college for my grandfather (because he wants me to go to his alma mater)."</p>

<p>what is happening to us?
we're young... we only get 4 years of highschool... why can't we just enjoy our lives?</p>

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<p>"why can't we just enjoy our lives?"</p>

<p>Well, playing sports and taking honors level classes for others is one thing. What would YOU do if you could do anyhting you wanted without pressure?</p>

<p>The things is, if you don't take the time to plan a little now, you'll be under much more stress when it's summer after senior year and you don't have anyplace to go (or suddenly realize that you really DO love to learn and haven't placed yourself in a path to allow for further stimulation).</p>

<p>While I appreciate your desire for little stress, I think there has to be a balance......and a little stress now might save you more than you could imagine, down the line.</p>

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<p>I understand what you mean, hilary6. I remember when I was in high school--taking Calculus, even though I did not understand or care about it a bit, running for student government even though I would really prefer to spend time writing or drawing. I did take part in some activities I really liked and some classes I loved, but I did a lot just to get into a particular college. I think the pressure is even worse now. I didn't mind too much because I was doing it for ME. I was the one who wanted to go to that college, and I was willing to do what I felt was necessary. If I had it to do over again, however, I think I would have tried to find areas to excel in that also matched my interests, rather than doing what I thought the college wanted. I'm not sure that all the things I thought I HAD to do were really necessary.</p>

<p>If a student is doing those things just for others, then that is not right. That student should take time to think about what he or she wants. Perhaps going to a name brand college is NOT that important to the student. Then he or she can stop taking honors classes just for the sake of taking them and spend more time on what is really important to the student. Or maybe the student will discover that it is worth it to him/her to pursue top colleges, but might decide to put time into music rather than football, or swimming rather than student government, etc. </p>

<p>And yes, high school should be a time to have some fun, as well. It shouldn't be constant work and stress. That is not healthy or right. A balance must be found that works for each student. (And that can be difficult to do.)</p>

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<p>I feel for you kids, it is so competitive to get into a University now..... I hope my son is not too miserable in his english classes.....</p>

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<p>I have relatives who took it easy in high school, enjoying their time and just doing the minimum they thought they needed to do in order to get into a good college. No AP courses, no ECs, but good grades, good friends, and good test scores. Not the best, but OK. When they graduated, they did not get into the colleges they wanted to attend. Instead they got jobs at minimum wage and then attended community college so that they could try again the next year. And again. And finally they got into a school they previously thought was a safety for the last two years of college (as commuter students).</p>

<p>Later they consistently and vocally blamed their parents for not "forcing" them to take on more challenge in those critical high school years, when all the key milestones were missed that might have set them on the path they really desired when they were in their 20s and 30s.</p>

<p>But hey, they enjoyed high school.</p>

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<p>Remember, carbon under pressure becomes diamond. Carbon without pressure becomes ?</p>

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<p>Hilary, Reasonabledad's post prompts me to truthfully say:</p>

<p>I have a son who coasted through high school doing the bare minimum he could to get by, but got excellent grades and took the few (4) AP classes his public high school offered. However, he was an expert at talking his teachers into exempting him from homework assignments that he felt were repetitive, boring, or time-wasting. He convinced almost all of his teachers to grade him on the basis of exams alone. He spent much time out of school playing videogames. He scored well on the SATs and was a National Merit Finalist. He was accepted into 8 out of 9 colleges he applied to, including UC Berkeley and all of his top choices, waitlisted at the 9th (we were both disappointed because we wanted to see what a rejection letter would have looked like). He went off to college for 2 years, then dropped out. During the summer after he quit college, he got a job where he was originally paid on a commission basis but quickly promoted to a supervisorial position with a salary. (I think they promoted him because he was making too much on commissions). Now whenever I spend time with him he is on his cell phone all the time always directing people who work under him what to do. (Kind of annoying - we can't have a normal conversation without someone calling). Of course he earns well over minimum wage. </p>

<p>so much for Reasonabledad's little parable. </p>

<p>Reality: you have to keep your grades up to whatever is required to get into your state university if you seriously want to go to a 4-year college, and take whatever course load they require; if that doesn't happen, you might have to start at a community college, which means you miss out on all the fun of dorm life. Anything beyond "state university" is optional, and probably won't make all that much difference in your life - either way, you will probably end up with a college degree and be gainfully employed. However, you will never know "what might have been". If you meet the love of your life at the state U, however, you probably won't care. </p>

<p>If you spend effort in your life doing things that you enjoy - including focusing on academic endeavors that excite your passions -- it won't seem like "work". You may or may not feel stress, depending on what you are passionate about -- but you will probably not feel miserable. (Example: a singer who pursues her passion for musical theatre will probably feel anxious and stressed out every time she auditions, and even more stressed out every night before she steps on stage... but she will be loving it every step of the way. Sometimes stress is good). </p>

<p>AP English is nice. It isn't necessary. See part 2 below.</p>

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<p>Calmom ~ I am delighted that your son has enjoyed success. Good for him!</p>

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<p>hilary, there is a huge debate going on within our school system ( a highly competitive public hs ) about dropping the weighted GPA. The feeling by many is that there are too many students taking honors courses so that they can get the extra weight on their GPAs rather than because they truly want to be taking an honors level course. Level one courses, which are rigorous enough in our school system anyway, may be more appropriate for many students and a lot less stressful. This was one of the ideas that was introduced by the 'stress task force' at our school.</p>

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<p>Hilary, here's my part 2. </p>

<p>I understand where you are coming from, and I think it is just an impulse that needs to be resisted. But I definitely saw my daughter feel the pressure... though she went another path.</p>

<p>Last year, my daughter was accepted into AP English, but chose to take Honors English instead (liked the honors teacher better). Next year, she would like to take 4 AP classes, but due to a scheduling conflict can only take 3. She had to drop AP US history and take honors history instead. The "honors" classes have the same weighting for GPA, but they tend to be more about exploring topics in depth, less about practicing & preparing for a test. </p>

<p>But I'm replying here because I admit that some part of me felt disappointment when my d. revealed that she couldn't take APUSH. I'm not under the illusion that the AP history class is going to make much of a difference in college admissions but some little part of me felt that she "ought" to take the AP history class because all the smart kids do. </p>

<p>Many years ago I was a freshman in high school in an honors English class, and I detested my teacher. Despite dire warnings to the contrary, I ended up dropping the class in favor of "dummy" English, where I was assigned for the remainder of my abbreviated high school career. (I graduated a year early, so never got a 4th year of english). I was accepted as an out-of-stater into the UC system, ended up attending a top law school, and recently wrote a book. </p>

<p>So..there are many paths to a good end ... and probably as many to a bad end. You'll be better off in the long run if you are making choices that you feel good about; at least if things don't work out, you won't have been miserable every step of the way. </p>

<p>I mean, I've seen many students and parents on this board express disappointment when their kids were rejected from their top choices, always pointing to the fact that there was so much "hard work" along the way and nothing to show for it. Sometimes kids end up going to their state u., and express resentment -- realizing that they could have easily gotten there without all the stress. </p>

<p>Set your own goals, and figure out what you need to do to reach them. If it is too much stress in your mind to reach those goals, then reassess and set more reasonable goals.</p>

<p>Oh.. and get the heck out of Massachussetts and come to California. We are a lot more laid back out here..... ;)</p>

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<p>hilary: I don't think the fifteen students who used their AP English class as an example of a catch-22 had it right when they said if they don't take the class they'll feel like miserable underachievers, and if they do take it they'll be miserable because they don't have a passion for it. A true catch 22 would be something like "if I don't take this class, I won't get into college, but if I do take it I won't get into college (because I'll get a poor grade in the class)."</p>

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<p>I don't agree in the least with unweighing the GPA. If you don't want the added work and challenge, then don't take the honors and AP courses. Shouldn't the ones that choose to take the higher level get the rewards that they earned? It is totally the students choice to take the courses that they will enjoy and their own foolishness to take courses that will make them miserable just for their extra weight. I feel like you would be punishing kids for taking challenging courses.</p>

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<p>Hilary6- Interesting persperctive you've offered us parents. It's hard sometimes for us to remember that you deserve to live on your terms. I think for a parent one of the hardest things for us to see is a child who "isn't living up to their potential", when in fact the kid may be as happy as a clam.<br>
I've learned slowly, to accept my kids for who they truly are, not who I think they should be. My older d dropped out of her school play (she had a big part) because she was just under too much stress. Did my heart break because I wouldn't be able to see her in her final production in H.S., yes, of course it did. But I had to step aside and see how unhappy my d was and let her make her own decision. After all, the play lasts one weekend, her mental health was more important than that.</p>

<p>It's unfortunate that too many of us get caught up in "getting the kids into college" instead of guiding our kids along the path and then letting them make the decision. </p>

<p>I think part of the problem may be that my generation really never faced desparate hardships...no depression to live through, no WWII, we were truly blessed. As a result, perhaps as a generation we haven't been able to appreciate the things that have come our way and tend to want more and more and unfortunately for you kids, use college admissions as another notch on the belt of success. (I don't mean this as a slam to anyone on these boards - I just mean society in general.)</p>

<p>It's interesting, my kids go to a very mixed h.s. where many kids go to community colleges or state schools. Maybe I missed it, but there just doesn't seem to be that pressure placed on the kids about where they're going to college.. Or maybe it's because I told my kids that they could go anywhere they wanted as long as it's in state (that's what's in the family budget). As a result there wasn't alot of stress in our house. </p>

<p>Your school sounds like its on the right track. Maybe you are at the beginning of a new trend. Perhaps you can show your folks this thread and start a discussion.</p>

<p>Good luck to you and your friends.</p>

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<p>ABlestmom I'm not advocating weighted or unweighted and I'm not involved in the discussions at our school because s#2 is graduating and it won't affect him one way or the other. The OP has said that the kids in her school are stressed because of taking honors courses they don't wish to be in. The same problem exists in our town and this is one of the suggestions that has been introduced by a task force of students/teachers and parents. Many kids/parents feel compelled to take courses above where they may belong due to the perception that the higher weighted GPA will help them with college admissions and the fact is that colleges usually use their own systems for evaluating the degree of challenge and GPAs of the applicants. It appears, in fact, that this change will be passed. Obviously the OP can't make this change herself, but it might be something she could suggest to her student government and would give her the satisfaction of having done something to help out.</p>

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<p>Andi: we have the complete opposite problem. Our HS doesn't weight grades so a lot of kids do not take AP classes because they don't want their GPA to go down. We have valedictorians (usually multiple - one year there were 10!) with 4.0's who have never taken a single honors or AP class. The school is trying to change that and encouraging kids to take AP classes (playing up the financial angle i.e. pre-paid college credits). They refuse to look at weighted grades - and we still rank, which is what I think is the bigger problem. </p>

<p>But I'm beginning to think that just encouraging kids to take AP classes may backfire. My son might be a prime example. He's a soph is AP euro - he likes history and his friends were taking the class so he thought he'd go for it. It has been a struggle for him all year (he doesn't like to read or write - very bad combo) even though he's a pretty bright kid. But the work required, especially all that reading and writing, has been hard. He's struggled to be in the B/B- range and he's hoping for a 3 on the exam - and he'd be thrilled with that. But he gets no extra points on his GPA for the B and that's too bad.</p>

<p>As to the stress issue, I have always been a grade "fretter." That's because I know the long term effects of not putting in effort. If my son puts in the effort and tries and the best he can get is a C, that's perfectly ok. It's the lack of effort that drives me nuts. I know I put too much stress on him about that - and keep telling him that somewhere down the road this will hurt him. We just had the same discussion again the other day. It's a constant struggle for me to not be riding him all the time and just let him be. And he is one of the most laid back people I know. He's such a "let it be" person and in the long run in life, he's going to have a happier life because of it.</p>

<p>It's a very thin line we parents walk between letting our kids be themselves and go at their own pace and pushing them along because we know the potential they have. We don't push and nag and shove because we want to have some trophy kid (at least most of us don't), we do it because of how much we love you and want you to have the best and be the best we know is in each one of you.</p>

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<p>Andi:
I purely meant it to be a opinion about unweighing the GPA - so sorry it came across that I was directing it to you personally!!!</p>

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<p>Fredo
WOW - 10 valedictorians! I know at our public h.s. where GPA are weighted, the last two years, the valedictorians took no AP's and few honors but got A+'s in all the college prep.</p>

<p>I guess it comes down to the whole purpose of the AP's and honors tracking -> to provide enrichment for kids who would be bored in a college prep class - not a means to boost your GPA. I know in our private h.s., unless you maintained an A (not an A-) in an honors class in the area of study the year prior, you are not eligible to take AP. I don't know if this is a common rule?</p>

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<p>gosh! we live in such a pendulum world! when our hs closed APs to only kids w/ A's, all the kids clamoured to get in! angry parents/angry students/frustrated teachers... when the hs said ok A & B students will be allowed in all of the (at the time) collegebound kids signed up ... then it was too hard and they dropped. it cost our tiny school district a ton of $$ and completely screwed up the schedule... so then the hs said ok, you can take an AP course, but both kids & parents have to sign a contract and when kids weren't allowed out after that, there was a threatened lawsuit! so now when some kids want to take more than 2 AP classes, regardless of whether or not they capable, some of the teachers spend the month before schedules come out discouraging the students... and AP classes are only offered to jrs & srs, which in california can actually hurt your chances at a UC.<br>
isn't it crazy?</p>

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<p>klc, except for the possibility of a lower grade, how would AP classes hurt a California kid's chances of admission to a UC? The UC system does weight the grades, also there is a limit to how many they will weight.</p>

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<p>so hilary - i tell my kids that everyone is going to have to work and there will be stress, so yep, you may have to play 10 less videogames or 10 less phonecalls/emails ... oh well! doing well in hs will keep your options open and otherwise, what's the point? if you want to be a sanitation engineer (gainfully employed & a completely helpful service to mankind!) that's great, but having As & Bs in hs wont prevent you from attaining that dream.... whereas if you want to be a college prof, you'll have to overcome those C's & D's and start getting As & Bs eventually, so why wait?<br>
also, a lot of AP courses are only necessary for some of the more elite colleges, you'll be fine w/out them.... when you become an attorney, few people ask you where you rec'd your undergraduate degree....
kids are spending 6-8 hrs each day in school, do you really want to look back and regret all that waisted time?</p>