<p>"regarding rehearsal time, thumper,fiddlefrog and chedva are all correct that top level conservatory musicians don't need lots of rehearsal time for ensembles because the musicians are also spending lots of practice time on their own preparing"</p>
<p>Certainly not true. You will be amazed how little time or not at all conservatory musicians spend on ensemble music practicing unless their top ambition is being a orchestral player. All they want to do is practicing solo repertoire. D had a bad experience with an accompanist assigned to her last semester. He only squeezed in rehearsal at the last minute before his accompaniment class. Once D called home and said that they had nothing to play for his accompaniment class next day because he had not learned the piece yet. Her piano major friend also has the same mentality. Once she played in a accompaniment masterclass and just wasn't well prepared. D has a hard time finding good freelance and well-prepared accompanist unless it is a graduate accompaniment major who may charge a bundle. She ended up recording all her summer audition pieces back home during holidays.</p>
<p>If you son in interest in UPenn, the Philadelphia Youth Orchestra accepts students up to 22 years old. There are some UPenn students and Temple U. music major in the orchestra. The rehearsal is on Saturday morning 9-12 one block from Ritten House Square. Many high school members ended up going to conservatories. They give at least 5 concerts each year. The big one is at the Verizon Hall in Kimmel Center in May. College students have no problems finding rides to the concerts. PYO used to be very good. But the quality has declined in the past couple of years due to some reasons that I don't feel comfortable to reveal in this forum. Still, it is a good youth orchestra and many musicians there are top notch.</p>
<p>"accompanying" is not the same for a pianist as being in an ensemble as an equal player, so you can understand why a pianist might not be as interested in preparing or rehearsing with an "assigned" student who regards him/her as a mere accompanist. Also, even among accompanists, of course, some are better sight readers (and better able to "count") than others, so need less rehearsal time to get up to speed.</p>
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<p>don't need lots of rehearsal time for ensembles because the musicians are also spending lots of practice time on their own preparing>></p>
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<p>I'll clarify my comment by saying that at my son's school, the students are given the music and are expected to know it when they come to the first ensemble rehearsal. SO they DO practice it. DS also practices solo pieces as well...but he will not show up at an ensemble rehearsal without knowing his part...and sometimes the other parts on his instrument (as he has been asked to switch seats on occasion). The point being that at most conservatories and upper level orchestras, there is no rehearsal time used for learning the notes.</p>
<p>I've personally heard Berkeley's symphony, Stanford's symphony, San Francisco Youth, Princeton's symphony, Yale's symphony and Pomona's symphony (which has some professional players). It REALLY depends on the year...some years are better than others depending on the strength of the players. However, all of the conductors of these groups are really fabulous musicians and very committed to excellence. To me, that is the most important criteria. If you go on the symphony websites, you can often get an audio clip, as well as a good idea of repertoire. SF Youth is an oddity in that many of the string players are high school musicians, while the rest of the group is mixed with SF Conservatory and college players. It meets all afternoon on Saturday, for marathon weekends every now and then, as well as for evening rehearsals during the week, which can be challenging for students who live more than half and hour from SF. I do think many colleges are getting more excellent musicians who are choosing to do an academic degree before going for an advanced degree in performance.</p>
<p>pointegirl, it's really a question of what instruments you're talking about. What you say is true of the string players at many, perhaps most schools, except for those on the first stand or two of each section, who practice out of fear.
However, the level of accountability is much greater among wind, brass, and percussion players who don't have 15 section-mates to hide behind.</p>
<p>The New York Youth Symphony also includes high school and college players, and provides good opportunities for Columbia and Barnard students. Now I am realizing that this may be true in other places as well (Philadelphia and San Francisco have already been mentioned by other posters) Any other suggestions? How many youth orchestras include players up to ages 22 -25 (ie. college students)</p>
<p>nycm- I did a quick Google search on youth symphonies/college age, and came up with quite a few including the Boulder and Pittsburgh youth symphonies. However, in checking age limits within the specific orchestras, I found none beyond the age of 21.</p>
<p>There could well be exceptions. It's a starting point.</p>
<p>When DS auditioned at Duquesne, we also went to see the Pittsburgh Symphony. Prior to the concert, a youth group was in the lobby performing and they were quite good. For some odd reason we began chatting with a woman who turned out to be their personnel manager. She was VERY interested in DS...and mentioned that the group would need trumpet players in the fall. They took performers up to 21. IF DS had gone there, he would have auditioned for this group in addition to his school ensembles. There is a parent who posts here from time to time who has a child at Duquesne. Perhaps that person can "fill in the blanks" on this one.</p>
<p>San Francisco Symphony Youth Orchestra also has a lot of string players from Cal, especially during tour years (this year is one of them; they tour every 3-4 years), but it is true that a lot of the string players are high school students from the greater Bay Area (the current concertmaster has been in that position for years, starting at 13); but the wind players are sometimes over 21, even though that is the official age limit. The conductor, Benny Shwartz, is only in his mid-20's but incredibly talented, a protege of MTT. The conductor of the UC Symphony, David Milnes, was formerly assistant conductor at SF Symphony and is an excellent and creative conductor who selects ambitious repertoire -- but they do not tour.
Also: SFSYO is cost-free; coachings are by members of the SFS; concerts are in Davies Hall, sometimes sold out; tours are heavily subsidized and luxurious (they stay in 4 star hotels and play in top venues).</p>
<p>Pittsburgh Youth Symphony is excellent and takes "advanced students up tp and including college age". This year, they list students from Carnegie Mellon, Duquesne, Youngstown State, West Virginia University and University of Pittsburgh. They rehearse in Heinz Hall, home of the Pittsburgh Symphony, and perform there among other places. This year, they're traveling to China (not likely to happen again soon--it's a big project)
Music Director is Daniel Meyer, who also is resident conductor of the Pittsburgh Symphony, Music Director of the Asheville (NC) Symphony and the Erie Symphony.</p>