<p>^ Hee hee! True.</p>
<p>If this is real, you have my sympathy, but move on.</p>
<p>You know, if you are a ■■■■■, then you have a calling writing fiction! This was a nicely written piece. Very entertaining, and you obviously held the interest of the other posters. But I don’t want to belittle your situation in the event this is true. You are obviously a bright kid. So I would like to make a small point.</p>
<p>I’ll start by writing that I am in no way judging you for what was done. Rather, I want to address the impact of moving forward.</p>
<p>At this point, the five of you wrote letters to the admissions offices of a number of schools, presumably, the same schools to which your classmates apply. These schools typically have one admissions officer assigned to your school or area, and they also cover a very large number of other schools. So here is the point: there is now a cloud lurking over your school in the eyes of the admissions officers at these schools, and that “cloud” may adversely affect your classmates who wish to apply to these same schools. But more importantly, from this point forward, more publicity on this issue will generate an even darker, more lasting cloud.</p>
<p>Is it supposed to work that way? No. But do things work that way in reality? Yes. Down the road, when the same admissions officer is reading an application from one of your classmates or someone a year or two behind, and he’s looking at a huge stack of applications on his desk, don’t you think he’s going to say, “Oh yeah, this kid is from that school with all the problems.” It’s simple human nature, and whether consciously or unconsciously, he or she will likely view the application in a different light. </p>
<p>Understand, I am not advocating doing nothing. And one should not be afraid to take a stand for what they believe is right. But you need to take measured steps in whichever direction you move. Have a strategy. Evaluate that strategy in terms of what will have the least impact on hurting your fellow students down the road.</p>
<p>Well, I’m sure you’ll do the right thing. Like I said, you’re a bright kid. But whatever you do, keep on writing! You do it well!</p>
<p>Please tell me you didn’t sign these letters with your real name? I fear that’s a real problem for YOU with admissions now.</p>
<p>Look, the kid is annoying and he’s a liar. But reporting that to colleges only makes you look pathetic. Karma will catch up with him some day. Surely you have bigger things to worry about?</p>
<p>Seems to me the appropriate thing would have been to report the misrepresentations on his application to the principal of your school. After all, if you and your friends are applying to the same schools, then his misrepresentations are unfairly diminishing your chances at these schools. Further, if you or one of your friends ACTUALLY held one of those leadership positions, wouldn’t the colleges perhaps pick up on the duplication which would put your app in question as well. So your high school principal would really be forced to do something to address the situation had you brought it to his attention. </p>
<p>Sending a letter to all the colleges unfortunately makes you and your friends look like “rabble rousers”. It was quite aggressive and impulsive in my opinion. I think you need to understand that there are proper channels to go through in situations like this that don’t include taking matters into your own hands. You could have put the principal in a position where he had no choice BUT to act on Dave’s dishonesty, since it could have potentially infringed on other students’ rights.</p>
<p>How do you know that the school(s) who called to inquire about said liar, did not fax or forward your school a copy of the email you sent? No hacking is required to request a copy of the email from the college. Inquiring minds want to know… This is a very JohnGrisham-esqe thread…</p>
<p>Is this the smart kid version of the “Witch stole my man” dramas that high school is famous for? Good grief…if you have this much time on your hands, find a soup kitchen to volunteer at or get a part-time job to help mum and dad pay for your notebooks for next year.</p>
<p>Wow, some of the comments on this thread. Other students might not care about what he does, but if this “Dave” kid gets accepted and graduates, and he ends up getting caught cheating or lying or doing some other unacceptable conduct in the professional world, the college is going to look bad.
It may not be of concern to you, but that doesn’t mean that this isn’t the right thing to do.
As clich</p>
<p>rolllingflash I agree with you but the course of action the OP took has most likely diminished his own chances at these schools. Further, it has obviously gotten him in a lot of hot water at school. The matter should have INITIALLY been turned over to the principal for review and appropriate action. The principal could never have justified doing nothing especially if parents got involved. He probably would have had “Dave” submit revisions to his original app. Now the principal is in a defensive mode because it looks like his school hasn’t done their job, and he is trying to make it all go way. Bypassing the appropriate channels has now put OP at a disadvantage. He and his friends did the dirty work for the Principal to their own detriment.</p>
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<p>Unfortunately, there are many examples (some posted in other threads, but some in the news) where someone who “did the ethical thing” got punished for it because the wrongdoer was in a position of power in the organization (or was protected by someone in a position of power). One example is where both the bully and victim are punished equally for “fighting” or something like that. Other examples would be where the other student who reports the bullying then gets bullied for being a “snitch”.</p>
<p>“Doing the ethical thing” often requires (a) being in a position of power, or (b) being willing to be a martyr for your cause.</p>
<p>I do have respect and even awe for those who pursue these things. However, in order to do it properly takes a lot of time, and is not something you will be rewarded for. Watch the movie “Serpico” and read up about him. This is very small time compared to the corruption that many whistle blowers have uncovered, but it is the rare one who get much reward other than the satisfaction of righting a wrong. </p>
<p>The problem with doing things half way, is that you create a huge stinking mess, and then, leave Nothing is changed, and you get some of the stench on you too, and it is even possible that Dave gets away smelling like a rose. When you make accusations of the kind you have, you had better be 100% sure of what you are saying and can prove it.</p>
<p>Some years ago, a mother with a strong sense of justice was so upset upon hearing about kids, in particular one kid who claimed a whole lot of things, really raised a ruckus, strong enough so that everything was brought onto the table, and it turned out that the kid in question lied about his lying. Said that he got huge scholarships he did not get, his gpa was really a lot higher than he said, and his test scores were also higher. Did he cheat on his SATs? Can’t prove it. Did he lie on his ECs, nope, not more than the usual exaggeration, and the teachers his parents supposedly paid for super recs…well, the recs were pretty typical for him and there was no proof there. In other words, there was a whole lot of nothing. </p>
<p>And yes, the kid in question was a chronic liar from years back. You just never knew when he was lying or lying about lying or lying about telling the truth, and there is no telling sometimes. It was a bad scene and some law suits occurred, were settled, and the mom in question has disappeared from the scene here. The kid who was so villified did go to a top university–he was legacy with very high stats and, yes, he had some great ECs and was a top student who lied about how poorly he did and how he cheated. He liked to portray himself as a scoundrel and did such a great job, that he got people over the top upset with what he was supposedly getting away with. </p>
<p>So accusations of that sort are very serious, and have to be backed up. And, yes, bypassing the school, was not a good move. Colleges are not detective agencies and they do not have the time or inclination to vet out these sort of things. They will ask the school if the accusations against the student are true, and if the GC and principal say, no, they will look at it as sour grapes. They do get anonymous and nasty letters about applicants, you know, and they will check only some of it out. Sometimes they do hit the jackpot when something is provably true. There was the situation of a young woman who was convicted of murder (of her mother) and falsely answered “no” to question of any felonies on the Harvard application, was accepted and the acceptance rescinded due to word of this getting to Harvard, who was easily able to check it out. But the kind of onerous proof that may go into some of these accusations which may not even make a dent in consideration of the applicant is not something that admissions is going to care about.</p>
<p>They are not going to quibble about co vs full captains, and the importance of certain honors. Those thing that are important are thing easily verified on a national basis, or they do not care. Not one bit. IT’s really stupid to lie about ECs because they don’ t make much if any difference unless they are so prestigious that they make national lists. </p>
<p>So, the OP has started something, that is commendable only if he and his friend sees it out. Maybe write an article on it, weather the storm of possible law suits, and get labeled a stool pigieon, a rat, etc. That is the price of this sort of thing. But starting a fight and then fleeing when the battle gets bloody, is not such a courageous thing. IT’s seeing it through that is.</p>
<p>Just wondering how you actually know what “Dave” wrote down on his college applications?</p>
<p>^I believe Dave told them. I do agree with you, HarvestMoon, going to the Principal would have been better than the letter writing. And OP mentioned one of his friends did have one of the leadership positions Dave claimed to have on his apps.</p>
<p>Reading this thread, several things come to mind
- The OP might not have as much privacy as he/she assumed if they sent the emails from school using school computers and servers. In our district students have been disciplined for Google searches done at school that they thought were anonymous. There may be a school policy and or acknowledgement signed by the students as to fair use by administration to access information sent over the computer. There is the Electronic Communications Privacy Act (ECPA) but the Patriot Act allowed more leeway so it may have been legal for school authorities to access the email. Lesson learned- don’t do it from school or work
- As I get older I look at the whole picture and the ramifications of any action. Of course we want to do the moral thing, but at what price? Is it worth putting a cloud over the school for years to come and potentially harming future innocent students from that school who might apply to those schools??? A better course of action would have gotten a better result without causing the fallout to others. How?
First, you better make sure that you are 100% correct and he’s not puffing/bluffing/blustering as you are interfering with his life and future. What if he was lying to you and he told the truth on his application?? By contacting the schools with false information (yours), you put yourself in a position to be a defendant in a lawsuit for a host of causes of action…Good luck with that… People have been known to lie to their friends. Unless you actually saw the submitted application, you don’t know what he told the schools, yet you chose to action that could damage his reputation and opportunities at that school.
Several things don’t make sense with your “story”. How do you know that several colleges called the school to verify his leadership positions? It is doubtful that the teachers or administrators would have told other students about such a call…
Bottom line- unless you are 100% sure that you are correct, before you go destroying another person’s life, you deserve the blowback based on your actions…</p>
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<p>Nope, this particular email that I sent to Kevin was sent from my home computer using my own wi-fi.</p>
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<p>The Fourth Amendment might disagree with you. Furthermore, I don’t believe I have engaged in possible illicit activities that might make the Patriot Act apply to me.</p>
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<p>Oh!.. but they did.</p>
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<p>However, a whistle blower needs to (a) make sure that s/he is correct, and (b) be ready to fight a larger political battle or become a martyr for the cause, with no guarantee of success. It looks like the OP may have acted without preparing for (b) (and perhaps not adequately verifying (a)).</p>
<p>The problem I have is with other posters’ comments about how “his cheating will catch up to him.” I honestly don’t think so. If he gets into a great college, he has won and that’ll be the end of it.</p>
<p>Most likely source of the “hack” into OP’s email is either the OP left a computer at school logged into g-mail, or one of the original co-conspirators has turned state’s evidence.</p>
<p>As a few posters have pointed out, Dave may have been BSing in the first place. How could OP be certain Dave really lied on apps? Best thing would have been to bring it to the Principal early on.</p>