<p>As another audition year come around I know many will have questions about specific programs. I have a wealth of information about the Opera Conservatory at SUNY Purchase, as I as a student there. If you have any questions, please send me a private message!</p>
<p>Weren’t you going to attend a school in Florida? Music Ed? Did you miss the terrible weather in NY?!!!
I was not aware that Purchase had an “Opera Conservatory”, per se. I know that they offer a VP degree within the Voice and Opera Studies Dept but that’s all under the umbrella of the Conservatory of Music and that their advanced degrees and certificates are in Opera Studies within the conservatory. Just don’t want younger students and parents to be confused…</p>
<p>My daughter is applying for dance, and I would be interested in any general comments you have about the Purchase programs in Performing Arts, or Purchase in general. Do you live on campus? How is dorm life? Do students from different disciplines mix? Do you go into NYC a lot? Etc. Thanks!</p>
<p>compmom…my dd looked at Purchase so we have been to the campus…can’t tell you anything about the dance department…but here is what I can tell you…</p>
<p>The school is in a fairly rural area, with nice homes surrounding it. The school has shuttles that will take you to a train station…train into Manhattan I think is around 30 minutes…so up to your child how often they make it into the city.</p>
<p>Seems to be a little bit of a commuter school…in that a lot of kids go home on weekends…but not all.</p>
<p>facilities are adequate (class rooms…dorms smallish so I’ve heard…did not see)…performance hall beautiful.</p>
<p>Mezzo…as far as what tiny was saying about “opera conservatory”… okay so that is not the specific degree a vp major would get but opera is very much what they are pushing there…if it’s not what you want to do…then it’s probably not the place for you… they have some good teachers…but… if you don’t live up to their expectations (one of the top students)…then you stand a good chance of getting pushed out…(as I’ve heard from more than one source). </p>
<p>I have many thoughts about the pushing a performance student out of a program…are they really doing that student a favor it said student has little chance in “making” it in the highly competitive environment that VP is?</p>
<p>Or </p>
<p>Is this a hurting the student who might never perform but would benefit just from the rigor of the program…self disipline…</p>
<p>My sister was a music ed major…never used it … but never regretted it either…said it prepared her for life in many important ways…she is a major in the airforce…has great foreign language skills (I’m sure learned from her time as a music major)…ability to work well with others (from singing in choirs)…etc</p>
<p>Do they still have the “musical chairs” procedure of changing teachers in the VP program after freshman year? There was some question of a certain teacher “choosing” students after they’d been there a while and thus uprooting them from the teacher they began with- I’ve heard this from more than one person, so I suspect that it’s based in truth as opposed to rumor.
Personally, I don’t find the campus nor the staff very welcoming. It’s cold and grey,although the same can be said for a great many schools in the northern climates, but it was the most difficult of any school we dealt with to get information or to attempt to speak to anyone in the VP department. Opera-mom, I know you had a positive experience with faculty because you were fortunate to have contact with someone via another venue, but Purchase gave a new meaning to the term, “cold-calling”! It’s been over a year, perhaps they’ve improved.
compmom- has your D looked at Hartt? They have a terrific new (within the past couple of years) dance facility with state of the art flooring. I’ve heard nothing but positives from moms who have girls there.</p>
<p>The program calls themselves a “conservatory” and it is just that. When it comes down to it, a conservatory is a program in which you are required to take VERY few general education courses. When the majority of your classes are major related.
If you do not live up to their expectations, you will be asked to be a music minor. They can only ask you to leave the program if you have not failed a jurries, or have below a certain GPA for a certain amount of time. However, they way it is presented, you will not want to stay.
As for the teacher thing. You get your teacher assignment freshman year. Certain teacher(s) like to have the “talented” students. Certain teachers are viwed to be the “top” teachers. This ends up being wrong, as many students leave and go to other teachers.
Mezzo-I’m actually a double major now, Music ed and Voice. It’s a wonderful program and I’m very very happy here. Much happier than I ever was there. Its a wonderful positive environment.
compmom-the dance program is AMAZING! everyone is very talented. its a bit cut throat, but what program isnt? I know lots and lots of students who get jobs upon graduating the dance program.
Dorm life isnt bad for the SUNY system. I spent 2 years in the dorms and got an off campus apartment the 3rd year. Conservatory program kids generally stick together. when you have classes 12 hours a day with the same people, those are the people you spend time with. The busy schedule doesn’t lend to meeting a lot of other people.
As for the staff? If you have any specific questions I would feel more comfortable answering questions in a private message :)</p>
<p>I didn’t think Purchase offered a degree in Music Ed.</p>
<p>We’ve been debating the term “conservatory” for a while now, it seems! A major difference between a school like SUNY Purchase or say, CIM,Julliard or SF, is that is you don’t live up to the expectation at one of the latter types of school, you are asked to leave, there IS NO music minor. So the state schools(and perhaps other music schools within LACs or Unis) have that “back door” option and students who find that the intensive study of music may not be for them are still able to take classes or ‘minor’ in it. Others, and I know Ithaca is one, offer what’s called an “undeclared music major”, where students who are not up to expected levels for performance areas spend some time catching up and then attempt to be admitted to a performance-based major.
xsingerx (sorry, had to shorten it to avoid getting it wrong!), I’m so glad that you’ve found a major in which your’re happy.</p>
<p>Let me be clear. The option of a music minor is not for the benefit of the student. The only students this is offered to are students who members of the faculty simply don’t like or haven’t seen enough “progress” in. They have no ground to dismiss a student from the program based solely on “progress”.
Which begs the question; can you dismiss a students who gets A’s and B’s, has been cast, and passed all juries? And why would you when the student has only been in the program for 2 years? Who’s to put a time line on progress?</p>
<p>It may not be fair, or kind, but it’s routine for Musical Theatre majors and some drama/theatre majors as well. The student has an option not to attend a school that participates in such a practice, which is called “voting with one’s feet”. Most conservatories I am familiar with will allow a student a fifth year to complete the requirements.
Personally, if all that you say is true, then it’s not right, and the best way to combat that is to make it known. If the school doesn’t list “cut policies” up front, then they aren’t being honest with their potential students and an option is to file a complaint with the official accreditation agency overseeing the school. It’s taking a risk, but there is a lot of money and time invested.</p>
<p>sagiter…I don’t think tiny is still at Purchase…I think she was commenting on being happy in the music ed/voice program at the new school she is at</p>
<p>Purchase has no music ed, it is purely performance based. xoxtinysingerxox indicated in past posts she was trying to transfer into UCF, although there I saw nothing posted that confirmed that as her current school.</p>
<p>tiny, if your willing, let the board know where you are.</p>
<p>Oh sure no problem violadad. I am now a happy double major at UCF in voice and music education. I would like to be in a more intense program. I was extended offers from other programs that are more reputable voice programs. But due to my… situation I am completely financially independent. I need to work to pay for rent, bills and school. I’d rather take longer to finish school, then have tens of thousands of dollars in debt. I’m not only going to school but I’m learning to be an adult. Will I graduate on time? Not a chance, but I’m not putting myself on a time line for…life. My year off between programs proved good time for me to… solidify my goals. With the economy the way it is, it seemed irresponsible to graduate with only a voice degree. It offers no security. While the goal of being a successful performer is a respectable one, I do not want to be 40 and wondering where my next paycheck will be. It simply isn’t the life I envision for myself. But I don’t plan on using teaching as a backup plan. I cannot tell you how many freshman I hear say “oh if It doesn’t work out, I’ll just teach”. This is how we end up with bad, bitter teachers in the school system. I don’t know what I will be when I “grow up”. Right now I have my own voice studio (mostly children and high school aged kids who just like to sing), I attend as many classes as I can afford every semester and I work 30 hours a week.
Who knows what will happen.
Sorry for the long and seemly unrelated post!</p>
<p>tiny, thanks for sharing.</p>
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<p>opera-mom, I don’t know your definition of rural, but a bit of clarification: it’s in suburban Westchester county, a stone’s throw from Westchester airport (HPN) and the major arteries into metro NYC. It’s a suburban bedroom community. Been years since anything grazed on any greenery (except maybe the deer). When I was a wee tyke, maybe. ;)</p>
<p>Congratulations, tiny. Sounds like you are well on your way to a satisfying career. Good for you!</p>
<p>LOL Violadad…I guess there just wasn’t much directly surrounding the school…Nice homes…on very large lots and the street where you entered the school grounds was quite a drive before you got to the buildings…guess that gave me the impression of Rural…but I had just driven up from Manahttan…so that could have clouded my impression!</p>
<p>While I was out today…thought of something and just wanted to clarify…the two possible thoughts I had thrown out about why a school might choose to cut kids loose…was just something I have wondered about…but…I want to make sure Tinysinger didn’t think I was directing that to her situation…I’ve seen some of your stuff and I think you are talented…so?? anybodies guess…</p>
<p>Glad things are working out for you…sounds like you’ve made some hard choices and have come out with some maturity in doing so…</p>
<p>There are some homes a bit down the road where the driveways are longer than the way into SUNY Purchase. </p>
<p>As for cutting a student loose, it is typically a lack of progress, either artisically or academically. How a school defines progress really is up to them, and is usually defined (often not specifically) within the undergrad handbook or music school supplement.</p>
<p>For music students, it’s typically the jury that decides if satisfactory progress is being made. </p>
<p>If you spend some time in the musical theater forum, you’ll see some threads where “cut” programs are discussed. Even if a student passes a jury, there is the possibility they will be dismissed based on institution specific criteria. I’m not aware of any instrumental or vocal program that operates under a “cut” system.</p>
<p>Sorry for the hijack.</p>
<p>opera-mom: I didn’t think any thing was directed at me 
In the handbook that the voice program operates by, it basically says you must be on probation for a semester before any formal action can be taken. You can be put on probation for grade purposes, or behavior (not attending classes, and such).
The “option” will be presented in at the end of your sophomore year in your midpoint meeting.
For example, Student X walked into the room for their meeting. They sat down and a box of tissues was pushed in her direction (really? melodramatic much?). She had never been on academic probation in her time here. She had been cast as a lead in an opera, and participated in the large scale main state opera. She had passed all but one class. That particular year in one of the teachers had not given out a syllabus at the start of classes. Student X attended every class but one, (due to illness and turned in a doctors note) turned in all homework assignments, passed the midterm, but lost composure on the sight reading final and did badly. Student X received an F as an overall grade for this class. The lack of syllabus gave the teacher the power to weigh grades as she pleased. Ok I’ll drop the facade, because I’m sick of writing in third person. Final grades had not yet been released and when the failing grade was brought to my attention I was shocked. I didn’t put the pieces together until later on. My vocal progress was brought up, and it was “not what they had hoped for”. I asked why my own teacher had not said anything to me as I had asked her if I had anything to worry about going into the meeting and she said I didn’t. They were elusive and never really answered my question. In retrospect I wish I had stuck up for myself more. Then I was presented with the option of being a music minor and asked to sign a piece of paper saying it had been presented to me. I was also told that with my vocal progress not being “what they’d hoped for”, they would “not be able” to cast me. All of this coming as a shock to me I didn’t really have anything much to say. I was attempting to keep it together, and said “thank you but that program is not for me” and I left.
Looking at the casting choices for their recent operas have shed some light upon their actions. They chose to do opera’s that maybe should not be done by college aged students. They bring in ringers (older performers who may have already graduated, or are just better) to fill parts that could be played by students already in the program. They want a good name for their program and like to put forth only the best, as any program. But to use performers who aren’t students anymore seems wrong to me.
Please don’t get me wrong, I’m not some bitter student who got axed. There were benefit’s to being in the program. I could have stayed and would have graduated with skills. But in the end when I sat down to make the pro’s and con’s list. The con’s drastically outweighed the pro’s.</p>
<p>tinysinger: I remember your struggle and your posts from last year and am so glad you have landed in a place that is right for you. You seem like a very mature, thoughtful young woman- and I bet the kids in your studio love you and are having a wonderful experience!</p>
<p>Applause, Applause! I am so glad to hear you come forth with this story.I know it’s not easy, but just maybe, you’ll save someone else the heartbreak you endured. You are a wise young lady to pick up your dignity and find a place better suited to your needs. College is supposed to be a time of growth and learning in a nurturing environment and although the pre-professional level programs at top schools are extremely selective and competitive, there should be room for students who may need a bit more time. I find your story particularly disturbing in light of the school being part of the SUNY system- which I pay for with my taxes! Yes, I can hear that Purchase considers itself a “conservatory” and assumes to operate as one, but even the top-tier of schools are able to accommodate those who may develop a bit slower(especially in voice, where it’s a “living instrument”) or who encounter something which causes a minor set back, and I would think that a Purchase should have been able to do the same. Compassion is a skill which those who lack it seldom appreciate until they are on the other end of the arrangement.
The best of luck to you. You sound happy now, and that’s what life’s about!</p>