@yourmomma The stupid thing they did was have a camera recording. They shouldn’t be condemned to a life of misery and welfare because they did something dumb on camera. They should however suffer the consequences for the ritual which was cruel, heinous, and abominable. I don’t classify the ritual as stupid. It was evil.
It was not evil. It was just dumb.
This kind of hazing was supposed to have been banned from fraternities years ago, yet it continues. If you’re going to punish them for something, punish them for ignoring the rules.
No it is not . It is disgusting repulsive and racist. These students need to be thrown out of Syracuse immediately.
They said “fk black people” “I will always have hatred in my heart for niers” and “the fking Kes”
They have no place in a university. This is why Sarbucks and Charlottesville and Hitler happened. They need to be thrown out on their butts. They can then spend all their time with a white nationalist group.
@simba9 you are wrong . It was the worst type of evil.
And they were laughing as they said it, which tells me they knew it was stupid and didn’t take it seriously.
No it’s not. That’s an irrational, exaggerated statement which exemplifies the irrational, exaggerated view that some people have of the incident. A worse type of evil would be going out and looking for people to beat up because of their race or ethnicity. Or denying someone a job based on their race or ethnicity. Joking about race or ethnicity is rather mild on the scale of evil.
Mark Twain repeatedly used the N-word in “Huckleberry Finn.” Was he a vile, evil racist? A lot of people seem to think so. I don’t.
No…not evil. Stupid, immature, callous, uninformed and 30 other adjectives but not evil. Heck if we can’t differentiate evil these days we are in far worse shape as a society than I thought.
@collegedad13 I was being sarcastic. Just saying not surprised. I will be surprised when a group of black or Asian kids have this kind of ceremonial initiation against whites, laughing about it. I was involved in one or two group racial fights in HS with sticks, knives (not me) and stones, so I know what kind of dumb things leads to violence. Not surprised at all that some white kids think it’s funny. On that, Simba poster and I agree. Just saying these guys should repeat the performance in Compton, LA, and they won’t be laughing.
@collegedad13 Again, agree these kids should be expelled and I think they will be. However, I do not condemn all frats, and I do not condemn these kids. I think as a punishment, these kids should do the same act in front of a black frat brothers and see what happens. No condemnation but certain things have certain consequences. Kapish?
@simba9 Huckleberry Finn was published in 1884. Should we just go back to that year and shun all advances in life since then or just certain vocab you approve of?
Was Mark Twain a racist? I certainly don’t think so. He was a man of his day. Most of us are living in the present day with how we shape our lives.
It really IS possible for humans to change their behavior when they’re made aware of things. For some folks that has to be experienced. They don’t “get it” without actually feeling it. For others learning is possible by seeing what’s going on and being able to empathize. It has nothing to do with beliefs. It has everything to do with caring for fellow humans.
From the video, it seems that they are definitely not all white.
The bible tells us “faith without works is dead”. In a broader sense, a person’s beliefs and opinions are expressed or manifested in their words and actions and in how they live, otherwise they are irrelevant to the rest of society. These kids expressed something about themselves. They acted in accordance with their beliefs.
If the University chooses to distance itself from that expression by suspending the frat, or even by expelling the students, then they are taking action consistent with THEIR beliefs. Does that mean “everyone has to have the same attitude” as me? No, but we can all choose how to respond to the attitudes and beliefs of others, as manifested in their actions, in a way that is consistent with our own.
@collegedad13
You may be the most clueless and unAmerican person I have seen on these boards.
You want these kids to be summarily dismissed from college? Any trial? All of them? Just the ones who uttered the offensive words? Are you familiar with due process and the rule of law? You sound like a petulant child.
Then there is comparing some foolish frat boys to hitler. Really? You are aware that hitler killed over 10 million innocent people- right? Oh and started a world war that killed tens of millions more. I guess being a fool on tape and uttering hurtful racial slurs is a proportional crime.
Let me give you some unoriginal advice. Tis better to be quiet and thought a fool than to open one’s mouth and remove all doubt.
That is all.
Like others I found the video deeply disturbing. I refuse to write it off as harmless high jinks. I also refuse to characterize the participants as irredeemable delinquents. Incidents like this can serve to educate, not only those in attendance, but also the masses who view the video.
Perhaps it’s the high school teacher in me, but I’ve always viewed young people as a work in progress. The school needs to figure out a ‘punishment to fit the crime’, so to speak. A knee-jerk reaction may compund the problem rather than responsibly address it.
As a parent I tried to teach my children self control. It would be hypocritical of me to lash out without restraint. I viewed their bad behavior as something to be confronted (a teaching moment), but realized it did not make them a bad person.
When I wanted to modify their behavior, I not only tried to model the behavior I wanted, I also attempted to show the value in adopting my way of thinking. Persuasion requires patience and understanding.
Yet I acknowledge that the participants need to learn accountability. This incident was not a trivial matter done by children…these were young adults.
I can’t help but picture a pebble being dropped into a pond, with the ripples emanating out in all directions. My hope is that the ripples may represent positive attitude changes and not anger. If you are looking to maim these young adults for life, I think one should look into the mirror.
What did you see? Don’t mess up the narrative.
If these kids had a long history of doing what was presented in the video, or were in their 30’s, I’d be more concerned. What we have is one short clip of a handful of college students, some of whom are still teenagers with an unfinished set of morals, doing something stupid. Yet based off only that, some are convinced that those in the clip are hardened racists, sexists, bigots, and nothing short of modern-day Hitler youth.
Is a high school student who tips over a garbage can in an alley doomed to being a life-long vandal? Is someone who cheats on a school exam destined to lead a life of white collar crime? I don’t think so, but apparently some here would disagree. I did and said some incredibly dumb things in my youth, yet have somehow managed to stay out of jail. The students in the video have already apologized, so go ahead and suspend the fraternity for a year, and maybe suspend the students involved for a semester. View it as a teachable moment, stop with the naive belief that we can create a world where everyone loves and respects each other, and get off the holier-than-thou soapbox. I have absolutely no doubt that the people calling for the students’ heads have done plenty of things in the past that they’re not proud of, either. We all have.
^^ seems to me I saw a few Indian dudes.
^There’s an anti-Indian component as well. Missed that the first time through. Such lovely lads.
(Whether or not any of the following applies specifically to this incident…)
Non-white as well as white people can be racist and/or stupid. People (white or non-white) can also be racist against their own race.
I think that an appropriate discipline might be suspension of the frat until all of the current members have graduated and a ruling that none of the members can join any other frat. As for suspending any of the students, I don’t know that that is useful in the long run. It might be more of a teaching moment for them to have to continue on campus amongst fellow students who know who they are.
These are young people whose brains are still developing, BUT, at this stage in life, kids who are in college should be able to refrain from engaging in these stupid, stupid antics.
I think they will be expelled though.
They probably will and perhaps the ringleaders deserve it, but I still think having to walk around campus facing the African-American, Jewish and other students they insulted and defamed in the video is a more effective deterrent.