Absolutely great advice on all points. I am going with all of your recs.
You may not need two outlets if only one car at a time will be charged. A strategically placed garage outlet can charge a car in the garage, or (with the cable running under a closed garage door) a car in the driveway. Some people have a small door cut into the garage wall to allow feeding the EVSE cable to the car through rather than closing the garage door onto it on the ground.
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That’s a thought. Right now, we are closing the garage door on to the cables, and I don’t like that idea at all. I need to speak to our handypersons to see how they could cut small opening in the garage door, but that won’t let varmints inside through the opening.
I should be getting the estimate today. If it is cost-prohibitive to have two outlets, I’ll explore the garage door opening.
Better to have the opening in the wall, not the movable garage door, and have a small door on it to keep the varmints out.
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Or you could just leave the garage door up for the hour it will take to charge the PHEV.
Well, I nearly fell out of my chair when I got the electrician’s estimate: nearly $10,000 for a 200 amp panel upgrade, plus an additional $3000+ for two 220v outlets.
Earlier, someone had given me a ballpark of around $5000, and I thought that was high!
Time to get more quotes!
That panel upgrade price seems to be about three times what I would have thought it would be.
Wiring for new 220V 50A outlets does depend on where the panel is and where the outlets will be. If the panel is on the side of the garage and the outlet will be on the inside of the same wall, that will cost less than if the panel is on the opposite side of the house as where the outlet will be.
Maybe you should hide the Tesla Model Y and borrow an old Nissan Leaf or Chevrolet Spark (electric version) to park in the driveway when you get other estimates.
Good one! Funny enough, the price we paid for the Model Y is just SLIGHTLY higher than the current average new car price in the US.
This estimate is insane. I have several other options (one of which was far cheaper, but that was a few years ago)…but, even with the passage of time and inflation, this price is beyond ridiculous.
a couple of years ago, I looked into a panel upgrade (from 100 amp to 200), and the quotes ran from $4k-$7k. (SoCal labor rates, but as my main electrician said, “it includes a fair amount of standing around time waiting for Edison to show up and do their thing”, i.e., approve the new meter and wiring setup to the street. He said, “they usually miss their appt window, or when they call in to throw the switch to power back up, the office is not ready”)
“…if the panel is on the opposite side of the house as where the outlet will be.”
That was us. ~$1600 for one 60 amp circuit and a sub-panel. But then I wanted the line be placed behind the garage drywall, and not just metal conduit running up and over. Took 2 guys about 5.5 hours each. They patched and seamed, & primed the drywall holes that they made.
Six years ago, we got estimates from three Tesla approved electricians before installing our 240 volt outlet. Needed to change out the old Federal Pacific Stab-Lok panel at the same time (house two doors down caught on fire after a breaker didn’t trip). Prices and advice varied wildly. Went with the low bid, about $2400, service was excellent.
Just upgraded to a 200amp panel to accommodate H’s new big spa. We don’t have AC (coastal SoCal) but it has room for that if we want it. I can’t imagine electrical needs beyond that.
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East Coaster here, we have two chargers installed now and our panel is maxed out. Our first charger (14-50) cost less than $800 to install as it was near the panel.
The electrical building code has changed since the old panel was installed so any service upgrade would have to replace all the old breakers which are no longer up to code. The estimate I got was $5000 for a heavy-up, and that was 6 years ago. Electrician said it would have been half that without the code change.
Well, my normal electrician came by this week, and I think I finally have a somewhat cost-effective solution for a home charging solution for the Tesla and the PHEV.
The bids for doing the electrical work have been wildly insane. Let me put it to you this way: we received one bid for $25,000!!! My normal electrician pointed out this involved several things that were unnecessary for a charger. I will have to do a main panel upgrade, as it turns out we have a very old 70 amp main panel. I actually had no idea we had so little juice coming into our home.
My electrician, whom I trust, is going to replace the old panel with a solar-ready 200 amp panel. After considering all the wisdom here, I think I am going to have the NEMA 14-50 outlet with a 50 amp circuit installed in the garage and then have him hardwire a charging station just outside of the garage, so the charger is easily accessible from the driveway. I hope he can install it in such a way that someone won’t steal the charger.
This is a much better solution than having the garage door compress the charging cable or putting the outlet outside where someone can just take the cable when we aren’t there. Knowing me and my family, I am 100% sure we will not go through the effort of unplugging the cable and putting it in the car or garage each time we leave. So having the charging station on the outside that is somewhat secured is the easiest. In fact, rather than have him hardwire the station in, perhaps we will just plug into the NEMA 14-50 outlet inside the garage. That way, if we ever get into a position where our garage is clean enough to park car indoors, we can always unplug the charging station and plug in a cable for whatever car is inside the garage. However, I don’t see us cleaning up the garage until maybe the summer, at the earliest. This seems like the best option, and I believe the one to which several of you were trying to steer me.
My specific question is whether anyone has a recommendation on a car charging station? I am leaning towards the ChargePoint Home Flex EV Charger (up to 50 Amp, 240V, Level 2). One thing I don’t like about it is that it apparently needs a wi-fi connection to work, if I understand the specs correctly. While we have a strong wi-fi signal in the garage, I don’t want to be out of luck charging our cars if the internet goes down for whatever reason. [ETA: Apparently, it will still work without wi-fi, but it will drop down to the default 16amp charge as a safety measure.]
I also don’t want to get a Tesla charging station as I don’t want to be beholden to the Tesla brand (although we’re extremely happy with our Model Y), and my PHEV is not a Tesla.
Consumer Reports has a very nice and recent write-up on charging stations, and the ChargePoint is high on its list.
Also, does anyone know if there is still a federal tax rebate for installing a home station? There was for CY 2021, but I can’t tell whether it’s been continued for 2022.
If any CCers have thoughts on this, I would, as always, welcome them.
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We cleaned out our garage and had our electrician install a Blink charger. We’ve had it about 5 years. It’s been great. I wouldn’t worry about the garage door compressing the cable unless you have some massively heavy garage doors. They are pretty tough cables. I think installing it outside on the wall is fine too. Unlikely in my neighborhood that anyone would care or would try to steal it, but you know your neighborhood best.
Thank you, @Sweetgum.
I was reading some of the EV forums on the internet, and several folks have suggested the garage door coming down on the cable could pinch the cable and create a hazard. It’s probably being super-cautious, but I don’t like the fact that the garage door is coming down on the cable, and it leaves a tiny gap, potentially allowing bad critters access to our garage and my home office. The garage door isn’t heavy, at least IMHO.
The Blink is one of the CR recommended models: Best Home Wall Charger for Your Electric Vehicle - Consumer Reports . I’ll take a look at it too.
Our neighborhood is good, so theft is not a huge problem. But, the Bay Area has a lot of petty crime like thefts etc, so I want to make sure that anything accessible to the outside is secured in some way.
I really really really enjoy parking my car in my garage! I know y’all don’t have much weather to contend with out in the Bay Area, but it is awesome not to have to walk through rain or snow or whatever precipitation it decides to throw at us, or to walk through heat. Also keeps the car somewhat cleaner.
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Mount a large lockable box around where you will install the EVSE (and the outlet if the outlet is outside). The door should have a hole at the edge so that it can be closed with the cable coming out to plug into a car, while the main part of the EVSE is still locked inside.
Related threads elsewhere:
https://www.reddit.com/r/electricvehicles/comments/i7casj/evse_with_lock_box/
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No, you’re absolutely correct. We have a perfectly fine garage with good room for parking either car. It’s safer and more convenient.
Thus far, we’ve used the garage for storage. But that can be fixed with a few days of elbow grease and putting some overhead storage, and hauling our junk to the dump. My wife wants to make the garage into her studio, but I don’t think our city allows that, since a certain number of parking spaces are required (we technically have two: the garage, and the driveway.
I will undertake cleaning out the garage when I can take a full week off and have someone help me do it. That will, in many ways, solve many issues. That’s why I want to the 220/240 volt outlet inside the garage.
Thanks again for your insights and time!
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Note that your Tesla will come with a mobile connector EVSE that can do up to 32A charging with a $45 plug adapter to match your 14-50 outlet. It can charge a car with a J1772 port (like what your PHEV probably has) with an adapter that costs $160-200. If you will not need to keep the mobile connector in the Tesla, using that may be an option instead of buying another EVSE.
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That’s a great point. The idea of a lockable outlet (with a keypad rather than a key) was what I originally discussed with my electrician this week. I certainly don’t want to waste money if an outdoor lockable NEMA 14-50 outlet with a J1772 cable will suffice for both cars (knowing that the Tesla requires the adapter, but my PHEV won’t).
The one downside I see is that 32amps is a bit lower than what we can get with an EVSE like the ChargePoint charger. Won’t that make charging slower? I am particularly concerned about the Tesla since it’s all electric. The PHEV has the gas alternative.