<p>The Texas Uniform GPA proposal has been repealed but our school district has decided to act on some of the guidelines that came from this. One of outcomes is to stop weighting pre-AP classes. Actually our superintendant has stated that he hopes the pre-AP program will die but in the meantime it will continue for incoming freshmen without weight. Among the reasons for this are that there are no real standards from pre-AP provided by Collegeboard or TEA. They also indicated that this is in line with what many Texas school districts are doing and finally that it is felt that pre-AP's pull the strongest students from the general classes and there is a need to bring up the students in these classes and studies show that students do better in a class with high level students in it. The answer to having multiple levels in classroom is differenciation, the answer to how this will hurt kids striving in the top 10% is that in the Texas state university system this will only affect them at UT Austin. All of this is really frustrating. Tell me if you have any experience, suggestions or thoughts about this. Several parents plan to discuss this at the next school board meeting this week.</p>
<p>I haven’t heard of any Texas school districts dropping preAP programs. Agreed that there are no standards for preAP (but I bet College Board is working on that now) and differentiation is the current hot educational concept. But I would worry about how the more advanced students are being served - is there a GT program in place? While the superintendent can propose these changes, it is the school board that would make the final decision. I suggest you get to know your school board.</p>
<p>They don’t seem to be dropping pre-AP programs, just changing how those classes impact the gpa/class rank.
When you argue this with the powers that be, make sure that people understand that class rank doesn’t just impact state school admissions. (I wish Texas had a uniform re-calculation like California does.) Class rank trumps GPA for most out of state schools becuase they have now idea what a certain GPA means from your school. If no preference for taking the harder classes, why wouldn’t kids take regular soph and jr year classes and then pile into AP’s later?</p>
<p>I thought the changes were to give only a half-point weight to pre-AP classes, not drop it entirely. There have been so many changes that I might be confused.</p>
<p>Differentiation is the word administrators love to throw out there, but it takes a very skilled teacher to be able to serve every kid’s needs in that kind of heterogeneous classroom. And, unfortunately, not every teacher has those skills.</p>
<p>To answer both of you the pre-Ap program has not been dropped they are just dropping the weight. The superintendant has been straight forward in saying that he hoped that over the years the program would die. He expects that kids won’t take the classes because of rank issues. Actually I sat in on meeting where the rank issue was discussed with relation to college admission and the superindentant’s reply was that it didn’t matter where kids went to school. At that point it seemed like we were from different planets and discussion just wasn’t possible. The vast majority of students from the HS even the top students, go the the state university but there are a few exceptions though. There is a GT program at the HS in name only. I expect that not dropping the pre-AP’s altogether is the district way of meeting the GT requirement. Aside from pre-AP, AP. D/C and independent study there really isn’t a GT program. I am told that teachers know who the GT kids are but from what I have seen this means nothing. This measure went to the school board for a vote with none of the community knowing this would happen and with no community input it passed along with a requirement for students to take and pay for a portion of AP tests or loose the weight awarded for the class. There were other components to this as well but the biggest worry comes from the pre-AP issue. Several parents will go to the next meet to see if a change can be made.</p>
<p>The last version of the the uniform GPA that I saw awarded 0.5 points until 2012 or 2013 and which time the weight would be dropped. Since then the whole thing was dropped</p>
<p>If there is anyway you can give me more input please do. The board meeting is Thursday. Are their other Texas districts also dropping pre AP weight or is this unique to ours? If weight has been dropped in your district how has it worked out?</p>
<p>Our district gives an extra point for pr-AP and 1.25 for AP. Haven’t heard any desire for it to be abandoned.</p>
<p>But back to the original post - are you saying that the whoel law requiring someone to come up with a uniform system has been totally repealed by the lege, not just delayed again?</p>
<p>I recently did a computer search to see where this was and that is what I saw in related ariticles. It was also confirmed by a member of our school board. I did not read it on a legislative site so I cannot give you a 100% confirmation but yes, that is what I was saying.</p>
<p>There were two bills repealing the uniform GPA - one originating in the House, the other in the Senate. The House bill was left pending in the Higher Education committee. The Senate bill passed the Senate and was referred to the House Public Education committee, where it is still pending.</p>
<p>Given the deadlock over voter identification, I don’t know how likely it is that many bills will be finalized. It may be possible that Perry will have to call a special session so the legislature can complete its business.</p>
<p>Thank you for clarifying that Fireflyscout. After Missypie asked I tried to do another search I found that it passed the senate but I didn’t find the house results. This explains it. </p>
<p>I am also really curious still if their are other districts in Texas that don’t weight pre-AP and why. I’m also wondering why the uniform GPA bill chose not to give weight to pre-AP’s. In our district it seems apparent that the administration would like to phase out pre-AP but surely this isn’t the case in other places. It all seems so wrong to me but I am trying to make sense of it if there is any sense to be made.</p>
<p>The reason, as I understand it, that the state doesn’t want to weight pre-APs is that there is no standard for what is taught, unlike AP courses.</p>
<p>You are probably right because this is one thing that adminstration mentioned. However in looking at the collegeboard website it looks like there are teacher education materials and courses geared toward a general standard. From my kid’s experiences with AP and D/C it seems that in the end the teachers of these classes are not really held to a rigid standard either and the quality of the class varies a lot from one teacher to another. Do you find that to be true?</p>
<p>Ds goes to a small school, so there’s not much of a chance to compare teachers. There’s only one BC Cal teacher, one AB Cal teacher, one Stats teacher, etc. It’s a rigorous program, and, thankfully, almost every teacher ds has had has been a winner. There are two teachers who teach a certain AP my son took this year, and I’m told he has the “good” teacher, that this is the other’s teacher’s first time teaching this particular AP and that it didn’t go well, so I know it must happen.</p>
<p>181818, are you advocating the position that preAP classes should be weighted, or trying to figure out what you think is best for your school district (weighted vs nonweighted preAP classes)?</p>
<p>If you are advocating for weighted preAP classes, I would make the argument that more kids would take preAP classes if they are weighted, which would presumably better prepare those kids for AP classes and AP tests. Not only is this “AP success” good for the students, but it’s also good for the high school if your super cares about bragging rights or the school’s rank (in Newsweek’s top 100 high schools, for example).</p>
<p>Your super probably also has a list of similar-caliber high schools or districts that he watches and compares policies with. If you know what those are, find out what their preAP policies are.</p>
<p>I believe some of the best high schools in Texas are Highland Park in the Dallas area, Westlake in the Austin area, Alamo Heights in the San Antonio area and I-don’t-know-what in the Houston area. Westlake DOES give weight to preAP classes, and I think many students who want/need an extra challenge would balk at the idea of not being rewarded with a GPA boost for taking a more challenging courseload. And I think that would eventually hurt them when it comes time for college admissions.</p>
<p>Austinhills,
Thank you for your reply. I am in favor of weighting but I have also been trying to understand the superindendant’s position. We have had a weak record with regard to AP testing which has also motivated the district to require that kids take AP tests because so many were not. Our administration is advocating developing the D/C program. He intends to maintain the AP program but would be happy to phase out pre-AP. I don’t know of any other district around us that has taken this stance both in terms of weight or desire to phase out. It seems that by not weighting they are working towards the program’s elimination. I along with virtually every parent I have spoken with has not seen the merit in this change. It seems that this is an unusual perspective and it was passed quickly without most people even knowing it was up for discussion. I was asking these questions to see if any other districts have had a similar experience and if any good had come out of it.</p>
<p>Here’s my suggestion - FIRE THE SUPERINTENDANT!</p>
<p>Our high school is adding more Pre-AP and AP classes for next year. All the school districts around us are adding more as well. The first question I’d ask him is to name specific districts which are dropping them and then demand concrete answers to why along with TEA statistics (bring popcorn and watch him squirm!). Our students are given 1 point for each. You can’t make a decent rank without these higher level classes. Rank is VERY important to colleges despite what your clueless superintendant might think. And of course, it matters which college your child attends.</p>
<p>As for his statement that the higher performing students help bring up the class - haha. If that were the case the US would be at the top of the world’s educationally instead of in the middle. The truth is, the teacher has to dumb down the curriculum and deal with behavioral problems in “regular” classes. I can’t tell you how many AP students, including mine, who have told me they appreciate their parents pushing to get them into AP classes because now they can see how much they are able to learn as opposed to constant interuptions in the regular classes.</p>
<p>Our students don’t test well on the AP tests either, but that’s no reason to drop them. It’s proof the quality of teacher is lacking so the school should make improvements in that area. </p>
<p>As for AP vs. DC, it’s hands down DC every time, imo. If you fail the AP test, then it’s a wasted year. OTOH, in a DC class you have college credit in your hands and it can’t be taken away. </p>
<p>BTW, we have GT in elementary. Middle school has honors classes and a couple hs level classes. Students get “credit” per say for those classes and can take the next level once they’re in hs but their middle school grades for those classes are not counted in their hs GPA. In hs, we have Pre-AP, AP, and DC and all three are given an extra whole point in GPA.</p>
<p>Consider contacting the southwest regional office of College Board ([Contact</a> Us](<a href=“Contact Us | College Board”>Contact Us | College Board)) - they may be able to help you with research reports and information about what other school districts in Texas are doing.</p>
<p>Thank you for the input:
Fireflyscout, I e-mailed CollegeBoard but I haven’t gotten a reply yet. I will call tomorrow. The following statement is excerpted from an e-mail written by a school board member to a constituent. Can anyone accept or refute its validity. Our school board meeting is tomorrow:
The Texas Education Agency, College Board, and Texas Higher Ed Coordinating Board do not recognize nor recommend that we label classes Pre-AP or give weighted credit for those classes.
I am also attaching our school board rep’s explanation for the decision:
“…there is a large inconsistency in the way that Pre-AP is taught. Basically, there is no standardized curriculum for Pre-AP. In fact, there is NO CURRICULUM for Pre-AP; it is the sole discretion of each Pre-AP teacher so we’re finding it to be highly inconsistent from campus to campus and even class to class. Based on the above information… the Board voted on April 23rd to revise the ranking scale for grades. The new scale weights AP and Dual Credit since they both require College level work. However, it no longer provides weighted points toward a student’s GPA for Pre-AP.”
This is so frustrating and so difficult to comprehend that at this point it seems that all but one board member supports this decision. By the way inconsistent teaching in our district is not limited to preAP’s.</p>