<p>How can you have never heard of Weill Cornell… It has a joint hospital with the Columbia medical school right in the heart of NYC. Very famous.</p>
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<p>Um, are you really from Novi??? For SE Michigan, people know about Michigan and Michigan State. A lot of really smart kids apply there and go there. HYP are known because of their prestige but are often seen as kind of distant. Many Michiganders think U of M is just as good as Harvard.</p>
<p>People are extremely impressed by Stanford and Duke here. Maybe its because they are prestigious non-Ivy research Universities such as U of M. A lot of people don’t apply to Duke because its kinda far and they seem to think they won’t get in…I’d say a few more apply to Cornell from at least the people at my school and those I’ve spoken to and their schools…but on the whole, paticularly other kids around here hold the opinion that Duke is much harder to get into and more prestigious. A lot of kids who aren’t good enough students to get into Duke or Cornell also wear a lot of Duke apparel and openly praise the university, while many of them have never heard of Cornell. I don’t talk to academics on a regular basis, but I wouldn’t be surprised if they thought Cornell was better; otherwise the prevailing opinion is if you’re lucky enough to gain acceptance into both, most people would expect you to attend Duke.</p>
<p>I don’t dispute the fact that Cornell is more prestigious than Duke in Asia. I’ve even seen this written in the Duke forum. From reading this forum, I have heard many reports Duke enjoys a stellar reputation in Europe, particularly Britain. </p>
<p>Oh, I have one minor qualm. Cayuga, when you use quote marks for statements you attribute to me, could you actually quote me. Earlier you “quoted” me by rearranging my sentence and taking out the phrase “, if slightly” which was not what I said and made it sound like I was being much more forceful…which then, you proceeded to argue against my quote. If you are going to paraphrase what I say, at least don’t use quotation marks or state that you are doing so. Thank you.</p>
<p>Phead128 .. im really curious what college do you go/did go… every single one of your posts (almost) has either ‘jhu’ ‘johns hopkins’ or something like that in it. just for the record, thats a good thing</p>
<p>Nevermind you didn’t even change the phrasing, you just quoted me by taking stuff out of the middle…wow.
How am I arrogant and obnoxious by suggesting that Duke MAY be stronger for premed considering it has a 10% higher med applicant rate than Cornell…most of what EAD has posted seems to boost the case for Duke as well.</p>
<p>I’m a sophmore at Johns Hopkins. Art History and Cellular Molecular Biology double major. Premed. 
Any more questions you would like to ask about me?</p>
<p>nah , that was all. i am going to be applying to jhu(my first choice.. dream school… blah blah blah) next year ED. I hope for the best!</p>
<p>I’m pretty impressed, I guess fascinated is actually the right word, that this discussion is still continuing! It’s sorta interesting how hawkette likes to create these threads that people have really strong opinions on and will inevitably reach 10+pages yet she really doesn’t come back to them after awhile.</p>
<p>You Cornell supporters are ridiculous. You outnumber EAD and automatically reject his assertions with unsound logic. Some of them are not true, but most of them are backed up reasonably.</p>
<p>I don’t know why you would believe a WSJ survey over the Dean of the college himself. Like EAD has said, if these data were false, Cornell would never settle for it. </p>
<p>You make every single ASSUMPTIONS possible to rebuke the word of a DEAN of admissions. You guys are just students/alumni who have no idea what goes on in the actual admission room. </p>
<p>You make gross stereotypes about Duke based on the response of basically one student (EAD).</p>
<p>despite the fact that it was suppossed to be thread making a case for duke the vast majority of the posts have been making a case against duke, by students who are arguing for other colleges</p>
<p>These are some of the first few posts on this thread. No assertion of superioty etc. has been found. Then comes these posts.</p>
<p>"I want to vomit. If I wanted to read Duke promotional literature, I wouldn’t be on this forum.</p>
<p>Hawkette, you do realize that the same (or analogous) assertions can be made about virtually every top university in this country?" - Cayuga Red</p>
<p>"I want to puke. If I wanted to read Puke promotional literature, This forum would be a perfect place for me</p>
<p>Hawkette, you do realize that the same (or analogous) assertions are really the same sort of things we hear day in and day out about Duke minus the comparative literature, snootiness, and bashing of other schools? </p>
<p>Its definitely a great improvement though. You are right about Duke Pride, its very very strong and its stench is <em>sometimes</em> very obnoxious1"</p>
<p>"Duke is home to more strivers and future country-clubbers than probably any other school in the US. Has there ever been a significant new idea or movement out of Duke undergrads in the last 100 years? Not unless you count this:</p>
<p>Freshman Women at Duke University Battle 'Effortless Perfection" </p>
<pre><code> This thread was clearly meant to help reverse the “negative” image that Duke gets on college confidential. It was not meant to provoke anti-Dukers to start posting hate.
</code></pre>
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Now you’re just being silly. Why would you not fill out the data? It doesn’t take more than 30 seconds. Everyone knows it’s just to help the admissions officers gather some numbers. At any rate, it is far more accurate than the NYT survey which is a piece of garbage statistically speaking. Even if a few students who turned down Duke for Cornell didn’t fill out the Reply Cards, there’s no way there was enough who did to suggest that Duke and Cornell evenly split cross admits. Even if you look at the results from CC this year, admittedly a small sample, I only see one kid(xjis) who turned down Duke for Cornell. Also, he’s an engineer..and we know how much “better” Cornell Engineering is than Duke Engineering right? There’s no reason academically for a pre-law or pre-business student to turn down Duke.</p>
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Uhh, what top student doesn’t get into <em>a</em> law school? Even if you get a 150 LSAT and a 3.2 GPA, you will get into SOME law school. I’m more interested in which school sends the most grads to the TOP law schools. The WSJ Feeder survey and the profiles of top law schools suggest that Duke beats Cornell in this area.</p>
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Too bad no one cares how good an actual discipline is when deciding colleges but care more about the overall quality/prestige of the school. A friend of mine chose Columbia SEAS over Michigan Engineering and Cornell Engineering. He didn’t give a rat’s ass about the quality of his major; he just wants the Columbia brand name. This is justified in another sense because most people end up switching their majors and even fields of study in college. You could walk in wanting to be an Engineering major and end up going into Linguistics. That’s what college is all about. Discovering what you like the most after some trial and error.</p>
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Yeah, but Cornell shares it with Columbia so it’s more of a general New York Hospital. It’s not close at all for Cornell undergrads to shadow doctors and do medical research with professionals in it. Duke’s Medical Center is located right next to the campus.</p>
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Yes and Duke has more of these “individuals” than Cornell does just like how Harvard has more of these “individuals” than Duke does. You want to surround yourself with more of these kinds of people so you will be motivated to work hard and succeed.</p>
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<p>For one, I wasn’t 100% sure where I’d be going, but even if I were, I didn’t really care to put it down. (Not to mention there were a few whose reply cards I couldn’t find.) Lots of students don’t bother.</p>
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<p>But it’s still not accurate. So there’s no point parading the numbers about as though it’s proof that Duke is better (when we all know it isn’t).</p>
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<p>There are plenty of reasons–like, for example, that they like Cornell more. I know it’s a crazy suggestion, but some students really just like Cornell more.</p>
<p>Hallowarts, no one here is anti-Duke. We aren’t putting Duke down, we are simply correcting EAD’s misconceptions about Cornell.</p>
<p>EAD, the NYT college preference survey is flawed because it favors Cornell, but the WSJ feeder survey (which only looks at admission into a very limited number of programs) isn’t? I assume its because it favors Duke, no?</p>
<p>And you’d be surprised how many people don’t fill those surveys out. Who cares that the Dean of admissions says Duke wins cross-admits. The information he has access to to prove this is limited, and therefore flawed. People that get into Duke send in the card (and they may have chosen Duke over Cornell). But people that choose other colleges over Duke often don’t send in the card (and they may have chosen Cornell over Duke).</p>
<p>“Yes and Duke has more of these “individuals” than Cornell does just like how Harvard has more of these “individuals” than Duke does. You want to surround yourself with more of these kinds of people so you will be motivated to work hard and succeed.”</p>
<p>That’s a good point, EAD. Cornell has hardly any of these individuals, because most Cornellians are dumb (which is why they could never get into Duke). In fact, most Cornellians do so poorly in medical school admissions simply because they didn’t have that many of these “individuals” to surround themselves with. It’s a vicious cycle.</p>
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You have no proof to back up your claim that most students don’t bother to fill out the reply cards or anything else for that matter. Did you ever stop to think that maybe the Duke admissions people know through some other means about the cross admit information? Do you claim to be more knowledgeable than the Duke Admissions Director? He went out and PUBLICLY stated that 75-90% of cross admits chose Duke over Cornell, JHU and Northwestern. The only people that can challenge his claim are the JHU, Northwestern and Cornell admissions people, not high school or college kids. At the very least, 3 out of every 4 cross admits between Duke and Cornell choose Duke. Those are the facts. We might not have access to all of the data but the admissions people do.</p>
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Who’s “we”? Uninformed high schoolers and college kids? The Cornell and Duke admissions offices seem to be in consensus that Duke is better.</p>
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Haha the thing is, I never said that there weren’t some students who simply liked Cornell more than Duke. I just said there isn’t an “academic reason” for pre-law and pre-business students to turn down Duke for Cornell. If a cross admit is enamored by the natural beauty of Ithaca, the freezing cold winters and job prospects as a farmer/hotel worker, then by all means those are valid reasons to choose Cornell over Duke.</p>
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<p>Really? You wouldn’t be motivated to work hard and succeed unless every single person around you were also equally high-caliber? What, do people with lower SAT scores or GPA’s have cooties that you might catch? When you were in hs, did you just refuse to talk to people with (say) lower than a 3.5 GPA or certain SAT’s?</p>
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<p>Um… how about the fact that they might be interested in international agribusiness, sports management, hotel management, the food and beverage industry, human resources, organizational psychology, or conflict resolution?</p>
<p>And that’s just a start.</p>
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<p>Piece of garbage? It was written by one of the most prominent education economists in the country. You can quibble with the methodology, but you can’t call it a piece of garbage.</p>
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<p>The student who only applies to top law schools? Some of my friends at Cornell only allied to top-5 law schools to see if they could get in before doing other things (mostly academic pursuits). I’m sure there are similar students at Duke.</p>
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<p>Nothing could be further from the truth. Plenty of students go to JHU every year for the biology programs, not for the history programs. Likewise, plenty of students attend Georgetown for international relations, but not for their social science or hard science programs. And plenty of students attend Cornell for its esteemed ‘niche’ programs.</p>
<p>The fact that your friend turned down Cornell and Michigan for Columbia SEAS indicates that he is less interested in engineering than most true engineers. </p>
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<p>There are plenty of hospitals and clinics to shadow doctors in Ithaca. Trust me, at the undergraduate level it doesn’t make a difference. </p>
<p>Additionally, the top veterinary hospital in the world is located in the Ithaca campus, and a lot of medicine is applicable to both humans and animals. (For instance, reading x-rays or understanding blood tests.)</p>
<p>Lets be clear here. Nobody on the Cornell side is trying to say that Cornell is better than Duke. All we are saying is that Duke is no better than a bunch of other top schools across the country – including Cornell, Rice, Northwestern, JHU, Georgetown, etc. – and that each student should make their own individual choice in the matter and not be swayed by any silly arguments as to why Duke is better than XXX or YYY.</p>
<p>Did it ever occur to you that Guttentag took that into account when he gave a range? It wouldn’t surprise me if it was 90% going to Duke compared to some of those schools and he used 75% as an added error. I don’t believe there is a more reliable source for matriculating data concerning Duke than the Dean of its Admissions, and the fact that no other schools have argued against what he said seems to imply they have similar statistics as well. (Who is being secretive with the data now???)</p>
<p>This is a re-post from yesterday…but still relevant, and revised to include the bastion from cornell…</p>
<p>EAD (and other dookies and cornellians)…you can use any numbers you want and any arguments you want to try to proclaim duke or cornell as superior to any other university you wish…but, in reality, duke is what it is…a top 15 national university…and that aint bad. It is not ‘superior’ in any manner to any other top 15 or 20 university, just as I do not believe Princeton is really superior to MIT, despite being ranked 6 spots higher in USNWR, for example. Every school will have relative plusses and minuses, and every student will be looking for something different in a university. The fact that this thread and many similar others exist is mostly because of 1) rabid duke and cornell supporters with delusional and unwarranted superiority complexes trying to push their ‘agenda’ of promoting duke or cornell as a superior academic experience, and 2) the manner in which they do it. </p>
<p>My main issue is that there is no other peer schools that have so many people compelled to do this, and no other peer schools that have people that do so in such an aggrandizing (and annoying) manner. </p>
<p>In summary, duke and cornell are great schools…there are many great schools…there is nothing inherently ‘special’ about duke or cornell…please, for the love of god, drop your inferiority complexes and get on with your lives…</p>