The End! (list wise)

Applying to College
1

<p>Reaches:
Dartmouth ED
Middlebury
Williams or Bowdoin (have already interviewed/finished the application for Bowdoin, but I think I may like Williams better...haven't decided which one yet)</p>

<p>Matches:
Vassar (tuition exchange?)
Wesleyan</p>

<p>Safeties:
American (NMF scholarship?)
Queen's</p>

<p>Anything I'm greatly lacking? Anything terribly unrealistic?</p>

<p>Stats post here : <a href="http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/showthread.php?t=94204%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/showthread.php?t=94204&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

2

<p>just that Wesleyan has very low admit rate and is not any easier than Middlebury or Bowdoin (likely harder) to get into.</p>

3

<p>I know it does...and Bowdoin's really more of a match (I just kept it under reach because Williams certainly is). Wesleyan's more of reachy match, but it's still easier to get into than Middlebury.</p>

4

<p>Admit rates at Middlebury, Wesleyan, Bowdoin, and Vassar are so similar they should be in the same catagory (I'd say reach/match) unless you are really comfortable with a 26% to 28% admit rate being a match (remember most applicants will have similar stats to yours.) Dart and Williams reaches. </p>

<p>I'm not familiar with your safety schools. Just be careful, there is the Andi's son story on this site where he was rejected by the safety schools since they thought they were 'backups' and he was also rejected by his reaches, as happens often.</p>

<p>Anyway, nice group of schools. I think you could find some LAC's that are less selective but more consistent with the culture at your reach schools, but maybe not.</p>

5

<p>Dartmouth and Wes are really different schools....</p>

6

<p>I know how different Dartmouth and Wesleyan are. In truth, Wesleyan is really more "me" (I actually had a friend visit and call me as soon as the tour ended to tell me how I absolutely had to visit), but Dartmouth is the only top school in the country with a really good skating team, and the language program is really appealing.</p>

<p>I know there's a chance I could get rejected from American for that reason, but since Queen's is a Canadian school (and they usually don't play into the American admissions politics and whatnot), I should be OK. Their decisions come out pretty early, too, so I'll know if I'm in trouble in time to fix it.</p>

<p>Statistically, though, with four schools with 25 percents acceptance rates, I should probably get into one of them....Someone last year got into Vassar RD from our school with signifactly lower stats than me. It's not that I want to be overly confident, but I'm at the point that, should I not get into any of them, I really can't fathom paying 40,000 dollars a year for a school I didn't really want to go to. If you have any other suggestions, though, I'd be happy to hear them.</p>

7

<p>Measuring Middlebury's selectivity relative to other colleges within their competitive range can be rather tricky; only half their matriculants bother to submit SAT scores in any given year since none are required. Obviously, the ones who do submit them are the very top scorers. Also, they have this mid-year admission policy whereby some unknown number of people are spared from the wait-list and voluntarily assigned a decimal pt. at the end of their class year (I kid you not!) It is not quite clear how these Class of 2010.5 members will figure in the final tally of apps vs. admittances.</p>

8

<p>tkb, I’m not clear why you feel you have to choose between applying to Williams and Bowdoin. They're culturally similar and you might as well apply to both. </p>

<p>Williams offers a lot of opportunities for musical performance. Just for that reason alone I wouldn’t eliminate it.</p>

<p>Williams and Dartmouth are reaches, followed by Wesleyan. I'd put Bowdoin, Middlebury and Vassar on about the same level of selectivity. Hamilton could fall in with that group as well.</p>

<p>I don't know anything about Queens College so I can't comment on whether it "fits" with the others. American's a fine school but it doesn't seem to jibe with your list. If you want a US sure-bet you might consider Skidmore, Conn College or one of the women's colleges like Smith or Holyoke.</p>

<p>Which ones have you visited? You seem to be going in two directions here in ambience: Dartmouth/Williams/Bowdoin and Wesleyan/Middlebury/Vassar. No problem with that as there are still major overlaps, but I wondered how you selected Dartmouth as your ED choice but at the same time say that Wesleyan is "more you." These are very different environments.</p>

9

<p>Again, Dartmouth is my ED choice because of the language program and skating. Skating is incrediby important to me, and Dartmouth is the only US school that can offer that to me. The students at Wesleyan seem to be more like me, but it's not as if I couldn't find a niche at Dartmouth.</p>

<p>American doesn't jibe with my list at all, I know. There are few schools, though, where I have a very good shot at free tuition, and since American has a full scholarship for NMF, and since I don't want to pay 40,000 dollars for an OK school, I'm picking money over love. It's not as if I would be terribly unhappy there; it's just not my first choice.</p>

<p>I want to pick between Williams and Bowdoin because I want to limit the application fees. Dartmouth's is 70 dollars, Queen's is 120 dollars, and I can't ask my parents to pay 1000 some dollars in application fees. I may do the application for Williams and decide after I hear from Dartmouth. Momrath, I'm not really sure what you mean by the two different veins: with the eception of Dartmouth, my schools seems fairly similar. If anything, Middlebury is more like Dartmouth than anything else. Do you have any insight into those schools that changes this?</p>

<p>I've visited all but Queen's (which I'm not going to be able to), American (which I will visit on our next trip to DC), and Vassar/Williams (which we're trying to schedule a visit to). I'm less concerned with Vassar, since the possible free tuition is a major factor, but I'd really like to see Williams.</p>

<p>JohnWesley, do you think that admissions policy makes Middlebury significantly less selective?</p>

<p>I actually thought about Smith, but I'm really not sure about women's schools. It seems they might lack the diversty of a school with both sexes represented. Momrath, do you know any small LAC (preferably New England) that offer good merit aid? My parents make enough money that I'm not going to qualify for much need aid, and though they promised to pay for Dartmouth if I got in, I don't think I ask them to pay 40,000 dollars a year for something else.</p>

10

<p>You state that skating is important to you, Unless you are recruited for skating at Dartmouth (which is the only reason you should then apply ED) an plan on majoring in languages you should not apply ED with the expectation that you will get on to skate afterwards (as it would be very unlikely).</p>

<p>Williams and Dartmouth are most similar and it would not be unusual to find student having to choose between the 2 schools. </p>

<p>While most people think that Middlebury is pretty similar, I did not happen to think so (D could not stand middlebury as she did not find the same level of cohesiveness amongst the students that she found at Dartmouth and WIlliams. She though people seemed more pretentious whereas the Williams and Dartmouth people were more down to earth, ended up applying to Williams and Dartmouth and was accepted to both). </p>

<p>Given the capricious nature of admissions and the fact that you are from the midatlantic states (as a large # of applicants are fromthe NE and midatlantic states) I would place Wes as a reach because you will be in a very competitive pool. At the end of the day all of the colleges which you are applying to take great care in *crafting a class * so the process is more wholistic vs being numbers driven.</p>

11

<p>you actually have a very similar list of schools/stats that i had a few years back...i applied to conn college for my safety, and they gave me an amazing financial aid package that i couldnt turn down.</p>

12

<p>I think the OP is light in the match/safety dept., and Wesleyan belongs with the reaches.</p>

13

<p>Sybbie719, skating doesn't work like most sports. It's relatively new, and is run by the US Figure Skating Association, not the NCAA. Though it's gotten significantly more competitive in the last few years (a girl who is ranked 10th-12th in the country ended up 3rd at Collegiate Nationals this year, and last year's champion got a Grand Prix assignment out of it), it remains a club sport. Dartmouth, Miami of Ohio, and Univeristy of Delware are really the only US schools that give significant support to their skating teams. Because most competitive skaters choose between school and skating in high school (the sport demands a level of dedication that isn't found in many others), there is no recruitment process for skating. I skate at a level that is unusual in collegiate skating, and I've been in contact with the coach. There's really very little chance, barring injury, that I wouldn't be able to skate if I'm accepted.</p>

<p>Thanks for the feedback about Wesleyan. I'll move it to the reach category. Huskem55, that's really good to hear about Connecticut College -- financial aid is a huge draw. I really don't know much about it though...any insight? I'm really worried about adding schools to my list, since my school strongly discourages people from applying to more than 5 schools and I'm hesitant to pay so much in application fees, though.</p>

14

<p>huskem, I visited Conn College, and got the impression that it was a really really preppy school filled with people who drink to excess. However, I have heard that they offer some financial aid. If I may ask, where else did you apply, and then get accepted at. </p>

<p>I'm debating applying to Conn College, like you did, as a saftey, and see the financial aid they'd throw at me. Was it more then half of tutition covered for you?</p>

15

<p>i made the mistake of only applying to 4 schools- rejected from williams, waitlisted at dartmouth, accepted to uconn honors, and accepted to conn coll with a nice scholarship- about 60% of tuition paid for. it comes across as really preppy, but there really is a wide range of people there- from your free-spirited hippies to your Dubya lovers. i found the drinking scene to be pretty standard for any school. there is a decent size population who are totally substance free, and then there are the people who go to the bar every night of the week. i really think that there is a niche for everyone there.</p>

16

<p>I hated Trinity though (WAY to much like my high school), and Connecticut College does seem to attract a similar crowd... Any other ideas? Am I really risking not getting in anywhere with my current list?</p>

17

<p>You are kind of top heavy especially for a student that lives in the part of the country that you are going to find students with similar stats. Since skating is still a club sport at Dartmouth, you remain unhoooked in the admissions process so you need to build a list of match schools.</p>

<p>I am really suprised that you did not add UMiami of ohio and Udel to your list as safeties since they do have the skating which you are looking for in addtion you would probably be in line for some merit money</p>

18

<p>With the exception of Americn, I'm really looking more for NE schools, so Miami of Ohio doesn't really fit in. As for Delaware, I spent a few summers training there, and, while the skating team is well supported, the focus is much more on the skating than school. I'm not a huge fan of the location, either.</p>

<p>The one thing about Dartmouth: the coach of the team used to be VP of Alumni Affairs or something and is still actively involved in admissions. He ranks each skater by number (1-9 -- I'll be a 9) and, if he's met them, writes a recommendation. Any idea if this will help?</p>

19

<p>By skating being a club sport (and a small one at that) it is not going to get the pull from the admissions committee that hockey, football, skiing etc. will get. You can essentially join skating as a club sport to fulfill your PE requriement (number of my daughters friends did it last winter). So nothing is close to being a sure thing.</p>

<p>
[quote]
Some speculate that athletes -- particularly those for big sports -- are given the highest preference of all. This does not appear to be the case at Dartmouth, although athletes do benefit from having a lobbyist in their coach. Coaches submit ranked lists of their recruited athletes to the admissions office. The admissions office then reviews the applications, taking into account the applicant's athletic talent and coach's recommendation.</p>

<p>"Athletic talent works in the same way other kinds of talent do. The only difference is it's a much more organized and structured recruiting process and that's a function of the NCAA and the Ivy League rules," Furstenberg said. "They tell us who they want, but there are no guaranteed number of slots."</p>

<p>But even with the ability to submit a list, some coaches expressed frustration with how little say they really have.</p>

<p>"How much clout do I have? Minimal," men's swimming coach Jim Wilson said. "If you look at my SAT scores and compare to the average SAT scores, my kids may be getting in with a 1450 instead of a 1460."</p>

<p>Wilson did, however, speculate that some of the "higher-profile sports like football may be getting a little more help."</p>

<p>Coaches are given little feedback from the admissions office before submitting their lists, according to Wilson. "I'm shooting blind," he said, adding that other schools, even in the Ivy League, are actually more lenient with athletic admissions.</p>

<p>"Some schools will say 'if he has this GPA and this SAT score were going to let him in.' Our admissions doesn't do that," Wilson said.</p>

<p>Michele Hernandez '89, who worked in the Dartmouth admissions office in the mid-1990s and is currently a private college counselor, concurred.</p>

<p>"Dartmouth actually has higher standards for athletes than most schools," she said. "Many athletes that are walking straight into Harvard couldn't get into Dartmouth."</p>

<p>While athletic talent can bolster an application, it does not replace other criteria for admission, according to Furstenberg. If coaches do not find well qualified applicants to put on their list, they risk not getting enough players that year.</p>

<p>"If the coaches say we need nine soccer players this year, but we only think six of them are qualified, that's what they get," he said. "All of the decisions are made here; the only person at the institution who can admit someone is me."

[/quote]
</p>

<p><a href="http://www.thedartmouth.com/article.php?aid=2004051301040&sheadline=admissions&sauthor=&stext=%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.thedartmouth.com/article.php?aid=2004051301040&sheadline=admissions&sauthor=&stext=&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

20

<p>I was hoping though, that the coach's ranking could help portray to the admissions officers the immense time commitment that skating is. I've been doing it for 11 years, 15-30 hours a week (depending on school and health), and I've had less time to excel in other things because of it. Skating means waking up at 4:15 on days when I may not have gotten to sleep until 1AM because of homework. Though I can list numerous awards and honors showing this, some of them would probably mean very little to someone outside the sport who does not understand how it works. For example, I'm a double gold medallist in field moves and dance and could easily be a triple gold medallist in freestyle if I weren't staying junior to compete. To someone outside the sport this sounds like I've won two competitions when in reality, it is a reflection of passing 40-some incredibly difficult tests. Hence, I was hoping the numerical system might help adcoms understand the level I've achieved in it.</p>