The Good Old College Dilemna: Any advice?

College Majors Music Major
1

<p>Hi guys! I've been lurking around this website for a while now, and I've finally decided to take the plunge and join in. </p>

<p>The main point of this is, college, of course! And the bigger issue is - what the heck am I going to do?</p>

<p>I guess I'll get down to the main point. As of now, I would love to study vocal performance/opera and pursue a career. Here's the problem. My family is well, financially unstable? My sister's currently in medical school, and the stupid gov't standard says that we're above the financial aid line, when there's seven people in my family and only one parent who earns a solid salary... (yikes... i could go on about it for hours, but I'm sure that you've heard it before. Sorry, it's a really touchy subject!) Most of the good schools my music director suggested (Manhattan School of Music as an example) are ridiculously expensive. In other words, I can't go to college without taking a loan out, and if I do, I'll have to pay it off myself afterwards. I know that a career in music is unstable, and how would I be able to pay off a loan as a starving artist? (hopefully, it never ends up that way!)</p>

<p>But wait - there's more! (I had too! :) ) I'm a sophomore in high school right now, and who knows - things might change. Anyways, I'm at the top of my class, and my guidance counsellor says that I have a decent chance of getting scholarships, grants, etc, because of all the stuff I've got on my resume.</p>

<p>to cut to the chase, I was considering studying nursing first and perhaps minoring in voice or taking private lessons at the same time, and then pursue further education afterwards in music. Why nursing? Everyone in my family is in the medical field, and it's kind of in my blood. I don't want to give up the academic side of my life, and I think it's a pretty good idea for a back-up degree since it's a stable job. My situation is weird because I basically have two different passions I want to pursue!</p>

<p>Here's the basic fantasy outline of how I really hope things end up as:
Go for a degree in nursing, whilst studying music as well. Graduate, work as a nurse, further my education, and then attempt to start working as a professional singer. Then maybe... just maybe... if my luck is turns out right... become a principal singer! (Wow... that really is a big dream, isn't it?)</p>

<p>I try not to set my goals on "I want to be an opera singer" because I know that if that day never comes, the disappointment would really be big. So my goal is, "I want to be a working professional singer and hopefully more." </p>

<p>I know this is ridiculously long, but I'm almost finished! </p>

<p>So.... would I be shooting myself in the foot if I don't study music in college? Do you really need a hardcore conservatory training? (I'm guessing the answer is yes). Is i tkilling my chances if I wait, don't study music in college, or get a back-up degree?</p>

<p>Alot of people have told me that a back-up degree is setting yourself up for failure, but I don't see it that way. I know if things don't work out, I want ot be able to support myself. Yes I know there's the teaching option, but I don't know how I feel about it now.</p>

<p>Has anyone been in the same situation or know someone who has?
Please post if you can!</p>

<p>Thanks</p>

<p>Phantomess</p>

2

<p>The best advice I can give is </p>

<p>-talent scholarship awards at auditioned based, conservatory/conservatory level programs are based on your audition in comparison to your audition pool peers; the best auditions yield the most "free" money. Academic prowess may or may not yield additional merit awards, and may or may not be a factor in gaining admissions as a music major. This varies widely by institution.</p>

<p>-Read the two threads here <a href="http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/music-major/258796-so-you-want-music-major-one-family-s-experience.html%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/music-major/258796-so-you-want-music-major-one-family-s-experience.html&lt;/a> and <a href="http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/music-major/460187-how-many-music-voice-performance-majors-find-jobs.html%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/music-major/460187-how-many-music-voice-performance-majors-find-jobs.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

<p>The first was written from an instrumentalist's standpoint, but is equally relevant for anyone considering high level collegiate music pursuit.</p>

<p>The second contains a number of personal stories, reflections, and opinions.</p>

<p>-Read the links here Peabody</a> Institute - Conservatory Admissions: Double Degree</p>

<p>The current thread here <a href="http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/music-major/527476-curtis-upenn.html%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/music-major/527476-curtis-upenn.html&lt;/a> also might be food for thought. Performance/applied health science could well be a tricky mix.</p>

<p>Can't tell, and it could be your prose style, but you seem a bit uncommitted to either path. It's not meant as an admonishment, just my observation. Many hs sophomores have far less idea of what they want to pursue than you do. :)</p>

<p>It might help the vocal gurus here if you post a bit about your vocal background, training, experience.</p>

3

<p>You have a lot to sort out and some time to do it. In the meantime, stick with private lessons and get as much experience as you can singing in front of people. I can answer one question - you don't need hard core conservatory training to be an opera singer. You will find successful singers from so many different backgrounds that there is hardly a clear cut path. What you need is a good teacher who works to bring out the best in you.</p>

4

<p>A vocal performance major is not the only way to a career as a singer, particularly for those voice types that tend to mature later than the college years. You might look for a school where you can pursue your academic interest while taking voice lessons either from a faculty member or from a private teacher in the area. Use your electives and core requirements to take some courses that will help the singing, like Italian and possibly French and German, plus some basic music theory, keyboard if you are not already a good pianist and music history. </p>

<p>The medical field may not be the best steady job to choose while attempting to launch a singing career. The long and varied hours, and the physically exhausting nature of the work may make it hard to get in the time you need for lessons, practice and auditions. Since you have a couple of years to think about it, I would suggest you consider if there are any less demanding fields than nursing that would interest you if you really want to have the time and energy to pursue music after you graduate. Medical jobs tend to work recent grads really hard.</p>

<p>As far as finances go, look for financial safeties where your stats and abilities are near the top of the student population. You can get some very good scholarship money in that situation.</p>

5

<p>Keep in mind that if you are looking at opera/classical -- that tends to be a long-term investment of time and money, because voice development/maturity is a long process. Not to be a wet blanket, but that needs to be part of your calculus.</p>

<p>I agree with the other posters who see medicine and music as mutually exclusive, if only because of the sheer time involved in the proper pursuit of each. My knee-jerk reaction from what I've read is to advise you to go for your nursing degree, but to do it at a school that has numerous ensemble performance opportunities. You don't need to be going to Manhattan School of Music or Oberlin to achieve that. </p>

<p>For our daughter (also vocal performance, but we're looking at a more jazz emphasis), we're looking at some state schools, and I would suggest that route for you, as well. If you have good academic stats, you can get some great scholarship assistance. </p>

<p>Where do you live? Where would you be willing to move to if it meant getting a good deal on tuition?</p>

6

<p>My degree is in nursing. We were not allowed to double major or minor. Our schedule was not "choice" - it was basically handed to us every semester, allowing us maybe one elective to squeeze into the small amount of time left over.</p>

<p>It is a science degree (BS), so it is difficult to mix it with arts courses (BA).</p>

<p>Your family will have an easier time with the nursing degree. Nurses get jobs. Your family already knows and understands medical stuff. There are lots of scholarships available because there is great need for nurses.</p>

<p>The opposite is true for music. It's unstable, no guarantees, harder to get jobs, fewer ops for money, etc. There are many bumps along the way, so your drive needs to be especially strong.</p>

<p>If you like nursing, and need money for school, it's a great way to go. But be prepared to put singing on a back burner for a few years. Perhaps you would be happy with private lessons on the side, and singing in a community chorus.</p>

7

<p>Thank you everyone, for you input! It's nice to get opinions from people who've been there and know what they're talking about. My parents and my guidance counsellor are completely lost on the issue!</p>

<p>As to my background with singing: I've been taking voices lessons for the past six years (started when I just turned 10), but didn't start any serious stuff until I was about thirteen. The director doesn't usually take people until they're eleven or twelve ,so I suppose that's a good thing? It's funny because I didn't want lessons, my parents put me in them at the encouragement of one of her friends who heard me sing one day. The school I go to is pretty intense, and I wanted to quit at first. </p>

<p>In terms of musical abilities: I can play the piano well, I've been trained in sight-singing, I'm just starting the sixth and last book of the "Master Theory" series, I've sung in Italian and this year started working on French. My current pieces are Gabriel Faure's "Chanson D'amour" (which is evil) and "Voi Che Sapete" from the Marriage of Figaro. Which, according to my teacher, I can sing, but not concert perfection yet. I'm not really sure what my voice type is. For years, it was soprano, but I'm more comfortable in the mezzo range. It's probably because my voice is still changing, so I don't try to categorize it. </p>

<p>My mother is a nurse, and I've talked about it too her. She said as long as you work one year full-time (three eight-twelve hour shifts a week or something like that) then you can work per diem, par-time, as a travelling nurse because of the demand putting on nurses. I know it's going to be hard, and I realized that these two fields are polar opposites, but hey, anything impossible hasn't been done yet! </p>

<p>I do like nursing, and I love music more, but if I have to sacrifce a few years to get to the latter for the sake of being able to support myself, then i'm willing to do it, and I'll work hard to get where I want to be. </p>

<p>I was talking to my parents last night, and they said that if I can find a good school and get financial aid of some sort, then studying voice won't be a problem. I guess the major goal is to come out of college debt free, since it's easier to work from the bottom up, then from the bottom up without a whole lot of debt to drag as well. So, the choice basically resides on what's better financially or not. Either way, I'll find a way! </p>

<p>I guess i don't want to live my life wondering if I could've had a career in music, but I don't want to miss out on that opportunity to really push the academic limits in college. It's pretty much up in the air, and as for now, I'll try to find as much financial aid as possible, and keep working hard.</p>

<p>I live in northern New Jersey about 40 minutes away from NYC. I think the farthest I'd be comfortable going was three hours away from home, but if I had to, five hours? Carnegie Mellon is about five to six hours away, and I think that's the farthest I would go. I definitely want to stay in the southern New York, New Jersey, Philadelphia area. I used to live in NYC (and would love to go to school there), and I can't stand being in the middle of no where! </p>

<p>Thanks again, everyone!</p>

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<p>I would then search for a nursing school within your range - All</a> Nursing Schools - A Complete Directory of U.S. Nursing Programs and Your #1 Resource for Nursing Programs Admissions Info - then either search/contact the schools to find ones that offer vocal music, or else concentrate on schools in big cities where you can find a vocal coach to work with apart from school.</p>

<p>For example, Temple in Philly has both nursing and voice performance. Don't know how they integrate. Also don't know what their financial aid/scholarship program is like.</p>

9

<p>How about combining your two interests into a degree in Music Therapy? There's supposed to be an excellent Music Therapy professor out of Montclair State University in NJ. And Montclair seems to have a solid music program, with lots of interaction between it and NYC musicians.</p>

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<p>Rutgers and The College of New Jersey come to mind. Both have nursing programs and I know some pretty good singers who have come out of both schools. You would get in-state rates at both and probably some decent merit scholarships if you remain at the top of your class. TCNJ might meet your definition of middle of nowhere, however.</p>

<p>In NYC, you have a bunch of CUNY schools which are reasonably priced, plus NYU and Pace, which are not.</p>

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<p>I understand the financial situation completely. But I also understand the passion for music, and it seems to me that your passion for music overshadows whatever passion--if any--you have for nursing. I know you want to go with your family's background, but there's a point where you have to do things for you and not your family. </p>

<p>I kind of agree with the idea of setting yourself up, not for failure necessarily, but for a different mindset by choosing a different major as "backup." I think that if music is where your heart is, that's where you should go. And I know you don't want to come out of school with debt, but honestly, the chances of that are very slim in any situation. No, a conservatory education does definitely not guarantee you success in the professional arena, but if that's the kind of education you want, you have to recognize that you get out from it what you put in. If you work hard and you put yourself in the position to get jobs by attending a school that might offer you connections, you will also be making money to pay off those loans. Think of the loans and the money that you put into your education as an investment. I am taking out loans to pay for a conservatory education next year and for several years afterwards. And yes, at times it seems ridiculous to picture paying all of those off at the end of however long my education lasts, but I know that I chose the school I chose because that was where I felt right.</p>

<p>I applied to several major universities as well as several conservatories, and in the end it was the conservatories that offered me the biggest portion of the cost, even with my--at the risk of sounding pompous--outstanding academics (valedictorian, National Merit Finalist, etc.). </p>

<p>You are probably best off applying to some of the big universities strong in music (Michigan, Indiana, even U of Miami, etc.) where you can continue to explore your academic interests while keeping your main focus on music. But I think you will be "shooting yourself in the foot" if you don't study music at all in college. Your voice changes drastically throughout those years, and you would be doing yourself a great disservice if you let your voice go for 4 years while you concentrated on something you considered secondary to your true passion. </p>

<p>The bottom line being: you are still a sophomore and, believe me, you will change a great deal in the next three years. Your passions take different turns, you become more certain about some things while more uncertain about others. I didn't decide on pursuing voice definitely until the end of the summer before senior year, and then I wasn't even quite sure what kind of school I wanted to attend. But your parents, I think, would understand that you need to do what's best for your happiness and your career--whichever one you end up choosing. They love you and they want to see you end up in the right place for you. They probably understand that the investment is definitely worth it for the right place--that doesn't necessarily mean Juilliard and it doesn't necessarily mean Michigan, or whatever. It means the place that you find has the right balance for you. Remember, where there's a will, there's a way. </p>

<p>(P.S. I'm sorry for the long rant, but if there's one thing I feel strongly about, it's about pursuing your dreams and following your heart whatever the odds against you are. You need to be happy, but it will probably take these next few years for you to figure out what exactly is going to do that for you. There are always lots of odd scholarships and funds out there you should work for throughout the rest of high school.)</p>

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<p>Montclair State University would definitely be a great choice for you. The Cali School of Music there is top-notch with a great faculty in performance, education, and therapy. You should definitely check it out!</p>

13

<p>Someone had mentioned Temple University earlier. They are very widely known for their program in health professions and their music school is very competitive. I know of a few people who are double majoring in performance on various instruments and a polar opposite field. I don't know how easy it would be for nursing and voice performance because those two fields are very time consuming, but its worth looking into!</p>

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<p>As a moment of levity, consider that in the freelance music world, the joke is that a musician needs to marry a nurse!</p>

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<p>Opera is such a long term concentration and your voice needs years to develop that I would totally advise you to seriously consider pursuing a second interest. My daughter was in this exact dilemma last year - she loves science and she got into all her favorite top conservatories and deliberated hours over her decision. There was not one professional that we talked with (and there were many) that told her to go to a conservatory for undergraduate. She ended up picking neuroscience with a nice scholarship and studying privately with her voice teacher and vocal coach. She finished her year on the dean's list, performing/working as a singer alot and she just returned from a top summer vocal program and was told that she sounded like she spent a year at the best conservatory in the world. It can be done! The key to all of this is a fabulous voice teacher and coach. She will need to make a decision - but not until she graduates from college and she will be in a much better place to make that choice! Science is especially hard and time consuming with all the labs and I'm sure with chemistry, neurosciene and genetics this fall, she will be feeling the pinch more than freshman year, but given that you are top in your class, I'm confident that you can handle it all.</p>

<p>The best advice I got on this board is that your college decision is only a 1 year commitment - not a 4 year one! </p>

<p>Let me add that this is certainly not the advise I would give to an instrumentalist who can and must practice for hours a day!</p>

<p>Best of luck on your decision - you are very smart to be thinking about your choices so early!</p>