<p>" …try for a school where one can earn a double major in 4 years so the day job is profitable? "</p>
<p>“Survival jobs”, or “day jobs” usually are not during the day anyway because that’s when the auditions are… mon-fri 9-5.
Isn’t that why actors take jobs as waiters and bartenders, so they can earn a living at night and audition during the day?</p>
<p>@soozievt - In some ways your D has a skill set that resembles a double major with music. She is VERY (very very very very) talented, both as an MT performer AND as a pianist and composer!!</p>
<p>She has a unique and very salable skill set. Every MT graduate should be so lucky! ;-D</p>
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<p>Hahaha – guess I was being optimistically naive in hoping D would be PERFORMING at night and working during the day! ;-D</p>
<p>My D works during the day, at night and on weekends! One example of a survival job (of many she has)…on the weekend she is the Vocal Performance teacher and Musical Director (currently rehearsing Seussical) for a teen musical theater academy.</p>
<p>Her peforming jobs involve daytimes and nighttimes. For instance, she is currently taping episodes for a web series and that is done during the day but she also has to compose and rehearse the music at other times. She performs about 3 nights per week in NYC as well including tonight!</p>
<p>Part of me is worried for my daughter as she enters this exciting time in her life, and part of me is jealous. Worried because of the uncertainty of whether she gets a spot and if she does where it will be, worreid about the cost, worried about cutting the cord, worried about her finding her way in a demanding profession.</p>
<p>But I am jealous too, because I wish I would have had the courage she has in devoting herself to the one thing she knows in her heart she’s meant to do, and from all accounts does very well. Jealous becasue she has a plan she’s already constructed, where she wants to work for Disney at least for a while. And while I’ve done Ok in life, there were a lot of things I wish I had taken a chance on or had done while young and single that I never did. So I applaud my daughter, and for the other daughters listed here, for their talents, and for their courage in forging their way. Hard to see my little girl growing up I guess, but proud at the same time.</p>
<p>I believe pursuing one’s passion is a positive thing to do. I applaud the parents here who support their kids who are doing just that.</p>
<p>@jeffandpam: I had the same thought as we were crisscrossing the country looking at all these amazing schools. I so wish I had thought of going to school out of state and having the AMAZING adventures that lie ahead for my D. I am so excited for her and can’t wait to see where she end up, while at the same time so nervous about all the uncertainties that lie ahead.</p>
<p>Ultimately it is a tribute to all of us that we have raised courageous, committed young men and women of character who will make a tremendous impact on their world!</p>
<p>I’d like to bring this back to the original question. First, let me add Coastal Carolina at about $20,000/year tuition, as well as SUNY Purchase as both better ‘deals.’ Rutgers, if you are in-state, although I heard a rumor (don’t know if it’s true) that for that reason it’s much harder to get a spot in-state.</p>
<p>However, it seems that some parents call themselves ‘middle class’ when really they mean ‘upper middle class.’ I earn less than a median US salary. I will not let my child take a loan out in his/her name for undergraduate; that is my own belief system, and I don’t believe it is good business sense. However, after a certain size, loans are prohibitive for me as well.</p>
<p>And it is simply not true that all schools will meet your need. Some will, some won’t, some can, some can’t. To use one example, a few years back, RISD offered my D zero grants, only loans. So, yes, that would have been $55,000/year in loans, which is completely unsustainable. This is not a ‘personal value’ for me. This is financial fact. I cannot afford to borrow that amount of money, period, end of discussion, no matter how much I budgeted. I simply wouldn’t have the physical money to pay for this size of a college loan.</p>
<p>The advice I would give however is to apply to ALL colleges but be aware that some will be impossible, particularly if you have to budget for other children and other expenses. Some colleges have ample resources and can give excellent need based loans. Others dont have those resources. Many colleges have a need/merit combo–that is, if they want you badly, AND you have a need, they will pay you more. For instance, several years ago, NYU Tisch gave my S an excellent grant/scholarship (need) so that at the time it cost us about a third of what SUNY Purchase would have. Yet NYU is ‘known’ for not giving grants. YOu just never know how much they will want you combined with your need and their ability to give, unless you apply. </p>
<p>There is no magic number that makes a college impossible–that is entirely individual. Just be aware that loans for colleges are non-dischargable. If you lose your job, tough. YOu will still have to pay. You could lose your house and everything you own before you are absolved from paying back those loans.</p>
<p>About $22K for in-state NY at SUNY Buffalo. An additional $10K for OOS. A nice $3500 arts grant for most BFA candidiates sweetens the pot a bit. A bonus is that off campus housing is plentiful and truly cheap in Buffalo, and transportation is readily available. So for upperclassmen, the cost can be far less. Lots of performance opportunities with a center that is a venue for the city as well as the university.</p>
<p>A lot of this talk of what is affordable comes down to you–the parents. Yes, it is possible a grant will appear the next year. It is also possible that it does not. If you, the parents have some money slabbed away or have some family money that grampa will cough up, you are not in the same circumstances as some people who have to earn every cent that comes into the family, and where financial security is shaky. My son has friends who supposedly are on their own, but they truly have family that can watch their backs. He also has some who are truly on their own, and they are often a hair’s breadth from being homeless and destitute. He’s really more in the first group and knows it. Yes, he’s on his own, but he has a pretty stable platform. No school loans, and if there is truly a problem, parents can cover. That’s a whole other story for a lot of kids. </p>
<p>Hoveringmom, great post. I agree fully.</p>
<p>Fortunately, I have a very “practical” first kid. We told her exactly how much we could afford each year (equal to my salary at a part-time job). She could attend any college with a COA equal to that + subsidized Stafford loans + her earnings. And, in the end, she had 4 offers that met that criteria (one BFA and 3 BA). Life is full of financial trade-offs (I can’t afford a BMW or a 4 bedroom house!) and the earlier kids realize that and start to live within their financial reality the better, IMO.</p>
<p>My second kid is currently a junior in HS and he has heard the same lecture about college affordability. We have already taken a couple schools off of his list (Northwestern, NYU, etc.) because the possibility of getting merit aid is low. Kind of sad since he is a 4X legacy at Northwestern, but he has moved on.</p>
<p>My D could have gone to Webster (a very good program) for just under $20K with a great academic scholarship!</p>
<p>Interesting thread…</p>
<p>Last year, during our D’s cycle, we expected University of Oklahoma to be the “bargain” in our pile. It was of the least expensive schools D was auditioning for. In the end, it could not hold a candle to the kinds of monies the private schools could offer in the way of academic scholarships. It ended up being one of the more expensive schools.</p>
<p>Our D is attending Webster for the same as it would cost for her to attend the University of Washington and live on campus…that would be in-state for her. </p>
<p>However, Oklahoma ended up being one of the bargains in the pile for a friend’s daughter this year…very similar grades, etc…which just makes me believe that the money-parsing is not all objective. Sure there are standards for need-based funds, but for “scholarships”, it seems its a bit more of a moving target.</p>
<p>One friend whose D had very good academic stats and did a mix of auditioned and non-auditioned school said she realized they should have done more “mid-range” schools…in other words “somewhat selective” schools academically with good artistic resources…when instead they tended to go to either end of the spectrum. The less academic ones gave her LOTS of money…the academic powerhouses, very little…she felt spending more time researching the “in-betweens” academically would have been better for them, overall…not a bad thought if we were doing it again…</p>
<p>mybroadwaybaby’s U of Oklahoma example is another reminder that you don’t know the cost of any particular school until you are actually admitted and see what they offer you, since that answer can vary greatly student-to-student. As I say, a school like Northwestern can become the cheapest alternative for some kids (sadly not for mine)!</p>
<p>One thing that I don’t think has been said yet in this discussion is that this is not like buying an iPod, where you figure out exactly which model you want and then go out to do price comparison shopping.</p>
<p>For example, a degree from Evergreen State College is not the same product as a degree from Yale. Both are perfect schools for particular students, and each offers better value for people with different financial circumstances and life goals, but the fact is that they are two VERY different “products”. </p>
<p>While for most folks it is smart to have some schools with low sticker prices on your list, and I am a STRONG believer that an MT shouldn’t leave college deep in debt, it’s also important to remember that for each price one is buying a unique education and also (as has been pointed out earlier) often the sticker price bears no resemblance to the final asking price.</p>
<p>For those interested, are the costs of almost all of the BFA and BM programs on the “Big List” sorted by cost based on In-State Tuition. Costs for OOS Tuition are shown as the second number (if only one cost number is shown, then there is no difference in IS/OOS):</p>
<p>Southern Utah University-BFA $14,255/$22,833
University of South Alabama-BFA $14,256/$20,160
Western Carolina University-BFA $14,470/$24,067
University of Wisconsin-Stevens Point-BFA $14,851/$22,424
Wichita State University-BFA $15,051/$23,086
University of North Carolina at Pembroke-BM $15,199/$24,406
Minnesota State University-Mankato-BFA $15,601/$22,723
The University of West Florida-BFA $15,625/$26,790
Brigham Young University-BFA $15,830
University of Wyoming-BFA $16,020/$23,940
Western Kentucky University-BFA $16,151/$28,083
University of Florida-BFA $16,183/$38,460
North Dakota State University-Main Campus-BFA $16,323/$26,569
University of Southern Mississippi-BFA $16,412/$24,368
Southeast Missouri State University-BFA $16,435/$21,475
East Carolina University-BFA $16,502/$29,081
Missouri State University-BFA $16,628/$21,908
University of North Dakota-BFA $16,726/$25,845
University of South Dakota-BFA $16,732/$18,105
University of Nebraska at Kearney-BFA $16,970/$21,778
University of Central Oklahoma-BM $16,999/$23,428
Northern Kentucky University-BFA $17,509/$30,301
Sam Houston State University-BFA $17,870/$24,518
Florida State University-BFA $17,880/$33,006
University of Central Florida-BFA $18,100/$33,580
Texas State University-San Marcos-BFA $18,148/$24,796
Clarion University of Pennsylvania-BFA $18,210/$23,868
University of Idaho-BFA $18,480/$31,000
SUNY at Fredonia-BFA $18,801/$26,701
SUNY College at Buffalo-BFA $18,959/$26,859
University of Mississippi Main Campus-BFA $18,966/$26,910
Western Oregon University-BM $18,981/$30,036
Valdosta State University-BFA $19,024/$28,605
Central Washington University-BFA $19,070/$29,333
The University of Texas at El Paso-BFA $19,115/$27,475
The University of Texas at Arlington-BM $19,181/$25,829
California State University-Fullerton-BFA $19,182/$30,342
Oakland University-BFA $19,262/$32,514
University of Memphis-BFA $19,409/$32,129
University of Utah-BFA $19,455/$31,845
Ball State University-BFA $19,640/$33,620
University of Oklahoma Norman Campus-BFA $19,790/$29,771
Southern Oregon University-BFA $19,806/$33,468
Youngstown State University-BFA $20,057/$20,257
Indiana University-Bloomington-BFA $20,099/$40,115
University of Kansas-BFA $20,156/$33,542
Arizona State University-BM $20,290/$32,889
Central Michigan University-BFA $20,297/$43,967
Western Michigan University-BFA $20,298/$33,030
University of Arizona-BFA $20,519/$36,729
University of Wisconsin-Milwaukee-BFA $20,610/$30,339
Coastal Carolina University-BFA $21,686/$31,506
Western Illinois University-BFA $21,692/$25,516
Southern Illinois University Carbondale-BFA $21,913/$33,604
Kent State University Kent Campus-BFA $21,920/$29,342
University of Southern Maine-BM $23,446/$35,806
Wright State University-Main Campus-BFA $23,640/$30,702
University of Michigan-Ann Arbor-BFA $23,721/$48,869
University of Colorado at Boulder-BFA $24,757/$45,011
University of California-Irvine-BFA $25,473/$48,351
Montclair State University-BFA $25,774/$33,785
University of Cincinnati-Main Campus-BFA $26,346/$40,869
Missouri Valley College-BFA $26,800
University of Mobile-BM $26,950
Howard University-BFA $27,985
Shorter College-BFA $28,000
Ouachita Baptist University-BM $28,100
Pennsylvania State University-Main Campus-BFA $28,520/$40,050
Hardin-Simmons University-BFA $28,952
Viterbo University-BFA $30,220
Avila University-BFA $31,600
Mars Hill College-BFA $31,754
Abilene Christian University-BFA $32,300
Brenau University-BFA $32,428
Lipscomb University-BFA $32,535
Nebraska Wesleyan University-BFA $32,742
Virginia Intermont College-BFA $32,797
Lees-McRae College-BFA $33,445
Ferrum College-BFA $33,660
Culver-Stockton College-BFA $33,730
Five Towns College-BM $33,750
Baldwin-Wallace College-BM $34,340
Point Park University-BFA $35,000
Catawba College-BFA $35,340
Belmont University-BFA $35,600
Rockford College-BFA $35,660
Lindenwood University-BFA $35,700
Webster University-BFA $36,070
Roosevelt University-BFA $36,194
Millikin University-BFA $36,870
Marietta College-BFA $37,052
Peace College-BFA $37,108
Shenandoah University-BFA $37,150
Elon University-BFA $37,225
Oklahoma City University-BM $37,450
Jacksonville University-BFA $37,693
Drake University-BFA $37,882
Stephens College-BFA $38,000
Otterbein College-BFA $38,008
College of Santa Fe-BFA $39,158
American Musical and Dramatic Academy-BFA $39,250
Capital University-BM $39,280
Texas Christian University-BFA $41,028
Southwestern University-BFA $41,240
Cornish College of the Arts-BFA $41,450
Creighton University-BFA $42,158
University of Hartford-BFA $42,428
Illinois Wesleyan University-BFA $43,188
Rider University-BFA $43,280
Ohio Northern University-BFA $43,566
Notre Dame de Namur University-BFA $43,876
Long Island University-C W Post Campus-BFA $44,033
Emerson College-BFA $44,574
The University of the Arts-BFA $44,683
Hofstra University-BFA $45,282
Ithaca College-BFA $46,562
Pace University-New York-BFA $47,024
Catholic University of America-BM $47,524
Syracuse University-BFA $50,098
Tulane University of Louisiana-BFA $52,240
The Boston Conservatory-BFA $53,521
University of Miami-BFA $53,544
University of Southern California-BFA $53,617
New York University: Tisch School of the Arts-BFA $53,943
Carnegie Mellon University-BFA $54,160</p>
<p>If a school does not appear, then the costs could not be determined using ■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■. In keeping with the OP, I only included the BFA’s and the BM’s (I included the BM’s because there were not very many and some, like OCU and Baldwin-Wallace, are usually regarded in the same vein as BFA programs by many applicants; some BA programs are also regarded as very similar to BFA programs but I did not attempt to go through the 100+ BA programs and attempt to judge them).</p>
<p>Wow, Em’s Dad, this list will be so helpful! I think you need to copy it onto a thread of it’s own that we can keep toward’s the top, or copy it and add it to several strands, like the “Preparing to Apply” Big list, etc! Amazing job and great assistance to everyone!</p>
<p>Unfortunately this list is outdated already. I paid $53K for Syracuse last year and of course it’s going up again this year! Ugh!!!</p>
<p>While this list is extremely helpful, could have used this last year, I believe ■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■ is only updated through 2010. This still gives us an excellent idea on overall costs by schools though. Thanks EmsDad for taking the time to put this together.</p>
<p>Yup, the numbers are most useful on a comparative basis, since costs go up all the time, the source websites are usually a year behind, not all fees for all schools (and majors) are included, etc.</p>
<p>It’s still a great list!</p>
<p>Yow! Unless there are some significant scholarships available, my D will be staying in Canada for her training. Sheridan is expensive at $8000 CAD (ballpark estimate).
My entire degree 20 years ago didn’t cost what one year is today.</p>