<p>This was a reply to a thread but I feel like it is a really a thread of its own, deserves more attention and don't want to hijack the other poster's thread. </p>
<hr>
<p>What if you have a low GPA (maybe a little higher than 3.7) and a decent ACT (33, which according to some chart is about a 2190)? Yet you have "Harvard-level" extracurricular. By that I mean, the kid who generally get into Harvard are really distinguished in what ever they are passionate about. They have state level and national level (and sometimes international level)</p>
<p>What if someone has the above academic stats but for instance:
Founded their non-profit - raised thousands of dollars
Did graduate level science research and becoming a physician is the primary interest. Founded a club relating to their science interest.
Top in the state in a competition (for instance, DECA, Debate, JCL, Acadec,etc.) and leadership. Top in country also for the same competition. Lots of awards from this.
Top in another activity in the state along with leadership and years of involvement.
Tons and tons of awards for community service and academics.
Serve on a national council.
Won many scholarships including big ones (e.g. Coca Cola, ELKS, Questbridge, etc.)
Amazing experiences during high school to talk about in essay; good writer.
Not a URM but first generation, low-income, come from bad neighborhood (something to talk about in essays)
Amazing recommendations from closer teacher/counselor.</p>
<p>On top of all that, there is a reason the student's GPA is such, as in, it would be a little higher.</p>
<p>Does the above student then stand a chance? I really think, aside from the GPA, this is exactly what schools like Harvard (which really represents the tree of Ivies) are looking for. The student is obviously interested and passionate about the things he or she does and has awards and leadership positions in whatever 3-4 things he is interested in. Does this make up for GPA? I figure most kids with this type of activities would have high GPA's but what happens in this case? Is it overlooked?</p>
<p>--</p>
<p>why is it so interesting? there doesn't seem to be any profiles of kids that do get into a school like Harvard with such low GPA AND high-level extracurriculars.</p>
<p>Most of the ECs you mentioned are good, but not “top level”. Making, say, math camp (top USAMO students) or publishing in Nature would be a more interesting comparison. Maybe developing a very large organization or business (say, with 1 million+ venture capital investment?) as well?</p>
<p>I respectfully disagree. I’ve lurked on these forums as long as any other heavy CC-user (this is just one of the few account I use to ask different types of questions.) </p>
<p>Like I said, from what I have seen, I don’t recall seeing students who are NOT 1) Athletes 2) URM and 3) Legacies who have gotten in with low GPA’s. Perhaps I could be wrong and if you show some chance threads where this is the case, I’ll take back my disagreement. </p>
<p>
</p>
<p>I actually agree but I don’t think the majority of Harvard’s pool falls into that category, especially for a student who might be classified as “well-rounded” (in a few subjects). I mean sure there are going to the USAMO, USABO, Siemens, Intel, etc. winners but not all of them can/will go to a single Ivy. From the kids who I personally know who go to Harvard right now, most are either exceptional people (low income, URM, math genius) or else they are just in general smart AND accomplished, which is perhaps what I am trying to go for. </p>
<p>Also, I think the examples of E.C’s you mentioned are like over the top, amazing beyond amazing examples, such that just one should get you in. That can be the case, or as I mentioned above, more typically, a student will have multiple “good” activities? Just my understanding, feel free to disagree.</p>
<p>Maybe there are some people accepted to Harvard who aren’t on CC who have lower grades and scores? That said, when I checked Naviance, the accepted kids to Harvard were ALL on the high end, no middle of the road scores at all.</p>
<p>of course but i think it just adds to the idea that this kid is really passionate about this field and so he went ahead and made a club at his school. if it was the only demonstrated leadership/extracurricular in that particular area, then it would almost be meaningless. but given the graduate level research, i think the club complements it, no?</p>
<p>Ohhhh I didn’t realize you were lumping the two together. I think it would help a lot, but if the applicant doesn’t have a good reason for their low grades, colleges still might wonder if he/she doesn’t care about school or has a problem with authority or something. If there’s a massive upward trend I think they would have a good shot though. Just my (uneducated) opinion.</p>
<p>Harvard’s average accepted SAT score was 2250ish last time I checked. Some students do get 2400s, but I bet much more kids have a 2200ish. IMO a lot of kids across the nation get accepted into top schools who are not on CC and have much lower SAT scores, but are very unique in their own ways.</p>
<p>this is all actually really amusing to me. it’s my fault for being so vague about my activities but I think if i provided details about my extracurricular, this chance thread would be much more interesting. </p>
<p>i don’t think a 33 is a “great” score but I don’t think it is a bad score. I think it can essentially be taken off the table, and whereas the GPA becomes a problem, something can offset that perhaps, which I believe would be the EC’s. </p>
<p>we’ll have to wait and see! I would list them but it would be wayyy too obvious because of the combination of activities and awards who I am.</p>
<p>Sorry to make this personal, but I was wondering what are the chances of someone (me) with a 3.7 UW (B’s in history and english alot, taken 9 AP’s so far). I’ve struggled through alot of depression (single parent, abuse, suicide things, randomly dgaf-ing at school because of this), but I’ve gotten things like USAJMO Honorable Mention (bad day during testing, could’ve made MOP), USAMO qualification (and possibly MOP this year), with random things like finishing some college courses, random extra curriculars such as academic team, etc. Probably 2250+ SAT as well. What would happen if I applied to schools such as MIT, Caltech? I’m asian male, by the way.</p>
<p>“there doesn’t seem to be any profiles of kids that do get into a school like Harvard with such low GPA AND high-level extracurriculars.”</p>
<p>I think that is because people with high academic extracurriculars (you mentioned graduate level research, top in a State competition) are likely to also be the ones with high GPA/SAT scores.</p>
<p>People who run a non-profit (and raise millions not thousands of dollars), sports stars, music stars, etc “may” have lower GPA due to the enormous time and travel commitment of those endeavors.</p>
<p>@tactics.
I think if you channel your “random extracurricular” activities into something less random then there is always a chance.
You are extremely talented in math and MIT and Caltech would appreciate that. If that is your interest, now is the time to double or triple down on that and work on something math related (research maybe?) over the next 9 months that will really distinguish you. Find a professor at a local college, or online, or leverage your connections from USAMO, talk to people on art of problem solving, etc. Channel your energy into that (but don’t let your grades slip because of it). Worse case, you may find out how your really feel about that type of work.</p>
<p>I don’t mean to derail this thread, but I think it is consistent with the idea of ok grades (for a top school) plus great ECs.</p>