<p>ok, the answer to my question:
he took chemical engineering.
will be going to UAB med school next year.</p>
<p>I know of a person at Penn State with a 4.0 gpa and a 42 on his MCATS! If this person doesn't get into his top choice...something is wrong with this world.</p>
<p>That person could easily not get in. If thats the only thing on his record and no EC's or medical related volunteering its extremely possible not to get in.</p>
<p>my cousin got a 40, but yeah he didn't have many ECs or volunteering, and he's at USF med school now</p>
<p>I know of 2, which are 2 of my relatives (cousins, to be more specific)</p>
<p>The first one went to MIT undergrad and has an excess of 4.0 GPA in Biomedical Engineering and she was also on the basketball team there. She had a 42 MCAT. She got into all the schools she applied to (e.g. Harvard, WUISL, etc.), but in the end, chose Stanford because she got a full ride.</p>
<p>My second one went to Harvard undergrad and had a 3.8/.9 GPA and just had the generic pre-med courses. He had a 39 MCAT. He got into a lot of the schools he applied to exept for the elites like Harvard, etc. I believe he is going to either Columbia or Cornell.</p>
<p>Yes, we know people like this get in easily. What I said before is, THEY WONT get in if they have absolutely no EC's or med experience. Thats it, not that people like this don't exist, or that they don't get in ever. Just simply that they won't get in if the don't do anything except study.</p>
<p>A simple perusal of competing website (can't post the site here or it will just get deleted) shows that a guy at Harvard with a 41 MCAT and a 3.91 GPA still got rejected from Harvard Med and Johns Hopkins.</p>
<p>sakky>>the person did get interviews at those places, though. so his stats were definitely enough to make it past the first cuts. (although i'm sure it wasnt JUST his stats that got him the interview...)</p>
<p>so yeah, even if he did get rejected at HMS and Johns Hopkins, i find it kind of hard to feel sorry for a guy that got in at upenn columbia and wustl...</p>
<p>Yeah, but the point still stands, you can go to a great school, get a great GPA and a great MCAT, and still not get into your first-choice med-school. So if a person like that can't get into Harvard Medical, think about what the odds are for a person of more modest accomplishments.</p>
<p>It is not just grades. Grades are important, but not everyone at Harvard has a 3.9/41. There are just so many applications for so few spots at the handful of top schools that there will always be plenty of highly qualified people who do not get in. The message is to look at a large number of schools, with a range of admissions difficulty. Do not fixate on Harvard and Hopkins. Where you go to medical school matters a lot less than some people think. Remember, that the 3.9/41 student is very likely to get into several schools and go on to practice medicine, whether or not she/he goes to one of the big name places.</p>
<p>ive seen the closest to the perfect pre-med student u can get...JHU pre-med, JHU med, amazing MCAT's but guess what...the doctor im friends with didnt hire him for his practice because he has no bedside manner and because he was arrogant. Grades arent everything, important, but not everything...being a good person in addition to good grades make a perfect med student.</p>
<p>Doogie, I think what we are referring to is the perfect premed student to get admitted to med-school, not necessariy who will make the best doctor. </p>
<p>I know several people who I would surmise would have had great bedside manner and are some of the most empathetic people in the world, but didn't get into any med-school. On the other hand, I can think of some arrogant jerks who did get in. I'd probably rather be cared for by the former than the latter, but I won't have that choice. If you want to be a doctor, you first have to get into med-school. And the simple fact of the matter is, you're more likely to get into med-school if you have top grades/scores but a bad personality, than if you have a great personality, but bad grades/scores. That's the "game" of med-school admissions.</p>
<p>I leave you with the word of Michael Crichton (yes, THAT Michael Crichton) who was premed at Harvard, and then went to Harvard Medical School, before he decided he wanted to be an author. </p>
<p>"In general, I found Harvard an exciting place, where people were genuinely focused on study and learning, and with no special emphasis on grades. But to take a premed course was to step into a different world -- nasty and competitive. The most critical course was organic chemistry, Chem 20, and it was widely known as a "screw your buddy" course. In lectures, if you didn't hear what the instructor had said and asked the person next to you, he'd give you the wrong information; thus you were better off leaning over to look at his notes, but in that case he was likely to cover his notes so you couldn't see. In the labs, if you asked the person at the next bench a question, he'd tell you the wrong answer in the hope that you would make a mistake or, even better, start a fire. We were marked down for starting fires. In my year, I had the dubious distinction of starting more lab fires than anyone else, including a spectacular ether fire that set the ceiling aflame and left large scorch marks, a stigmata of ineptitude hanging over my head for the rest of the year. I was uncomfortable with the hostile and paranoid attitude this course demanded for success. I thought that a humane profession like medicine ought to encourage other values in its candidates. But nobody was asking my opinion. I got through it as best I could. "</p>
<p>i dont agree in the least bit and i understood the question fine sakky...upon ur interview with a medical school, they will not choose an arrogant jerk who has done nothing in pre-med other then score high on every test hes taken. They r gonna look for that well-rounded apathetic person who not only scores high but shows a genuine interest in medicine and who is a sincere and overall good human-being not mr. i-got-a-close-to-perfect-score-on-my-MCATs, and a 4.0 GPA but shows no activities which indiciate his interests...its common sense, read my previous post and try to understand the point of it...sakky</p>
<p>It's nice to think that the interviews would cull these people out, but I have seen with my own eyes guys in med-school right now who are basically arrogant jerks. That's the inherent problem with an interview process - how much can you really learn about a guy from just talking to him for a day or two, especially if that guy knows he's being interviewed? Is he really going to show you his true personality? Unlikely. He's just going to tell you what you want him to say. Some guys are really skilled at putting on a good face just for the interview. After going through a bunch of med-school interviews, you inevitably learn what you should and should not be saying. </p>
<p>Come on, you know what I'm talking about. You've seen these smooth political operators who are slimeball jerks in reality but can make themselves seem like saints when they need to. We both know that it happens.</p>
<p>Furthermore, you talk about those people who demonstrate a true interest in medicine. Well, I know one of these smooth political cats who was able to demonstrate glowing recommendations from a doctor who he worked with that displayed an passionate devotion to medicine. However, that doctor who wrote those rec's also happened to be a family member. Obviously somebody in your own family isn't going to write anything bad about you. However, naturally, that doctor conveniently neglected to mention the fact that they were related. Having different last names (because they were related by marriage) helped. </p>
<p>Look, the point of this is to show that med-school admissions is a game. Like it or not, that's the brutal truth. We'd all like to think that med-schools really are out to try to admit those people who will be the best and most empathetic doctors, and that they're really interviewing and drilling down into their candidates to find out who really will make the best doctor. </p>
<p>The reality is far different. The fact is, if you don't have a certain GPA and a certain MCAT score, you won't even make it to the interview stage. In fact, you won't even be invited to submit the secondary AMCAS app. Even if you do make it to the interview stage, you might be the greatest humanitarian in the world, but if you're not an articulate and cogent interviewee, your chances of getting admitted will be hurt. You might be the most devoted future doctor in the world, but if you don't have glowing rec's and strong EC's that attest to this fact, your chances of getting in will be impaired. </p>
<p>Look, I too would like to believe in a world where the truly most devoted people are going to get in, and those who are undevoted won't. In a perfect world, that's exactly what would happen. We don't live in a perfect world. In the real world, you have to get the mechanics down if you want to get into med-school, which means getting high scores and grades, developing your smooth interviewing skills, getting the EC "checkboxes", and getting those glowing rec's. Med-school adcoms have signalled through their actions that they don't really care how you get these things done, as long as you get them done. </p>
<p>The fact is, med-school adcoms are swamped with applications and are not going to spend a lot of time on each candidate. You have to self-market yourself if you want to maximize your chances of getting admitted. Presenting your strongest points to the adcoms while downplaying your weaknesses (not lying about them, just downplaying them) is important. That's how the med-school game is played. Like it or not, it is a game.</p>
<p>the national averages for MCAT scores have been remarkably consistent, fluctuating by a little over a half of a point over the past several years. in 2003, the highest MCAT score achieved in the entire country was a 41 out of a possible 45. and fewer than 100 test-takers achieved or exceeded a score of 40. considering the incredible consistency of the MCAT in regards to difficulty, i am confident that virtually just as few people achieved such high scores this year. and i bet that all your cousins and friends who've told you that they've tested at 40+ are liars, either that or you've fabricated their success. simply entertaining the notion that several posters on the first page of this thread are close friends or relatives with people who have managed a 40+ score is laughable.</p>
<p>i'm tired of medical school threads brimming with people who are apparently outright liars.</p>
<p>ppl get rejected with 40-43s just bc they dont have enough ecc's...</p>
<p>Was it necessary to bump a 4-year old thread for this?</p>
<p>I highly doubt that anyone with scores like those would actually have ZERO experience unless they really didnt want to become doctors. It's almost a given that you shadow doctors, do research, and volunteer (hospitals and elsewhere).</p>
<p>i agree with the previous post. I had a few good friends who had high MCAT scores (36+) and 4.0 GPAs with research experience who weren't accepted to the med school they wanted, and had to go to their second choice school in the state. </p>
<p>I am now a second year med student writing about my experiences in med school and undergrad.</p>
<p>Accepted med students run the gamut of experiences, and after wait-lists are taken into account, a lot of students end up making it to med school who originally might not have made the cut in the first round. Don't get me wrong, we have plenty of high MCAT scoring high GPA students in my med school class, but those scores are only a fraction of the big picture of what it means to be a great pre-med student.</p>
<p>
My friend took the MCAT as a high schooler and scored above 40. Good day to you.</p>