<p>You definitely should visit the two schools. See which one "feels" right. You can't go wrong either way, academically or socially, so why not see where you feel at home?</p>
<p>for those who go to USC:</p>
<p>is the environment academically challenging? do other things take precedent over academics? how do you feel academically about your students and your school overall?</p>
<p>"Their are more living UCLA alumni than USC so the whole alumni thing is probably is UCLA's favor overall."</p>
<p>Not to undermind here, but that conclusion is so not true. Yes, there are larger numbers in UCLA alumni, but they don't act as family with eachother as USC alums do. So, it is actually in USC's favor.</p>
<p>Also, at USC, since the school is smaller, you get a better chance to get to know your professers. My dad went there, became really good friends with one of his professors, and now our family and some other of my dad's classmates go up to his lake house every summer. So, go to UCLA is you want to have a cold and lonely experience, but if you want to go to college and live in a very family-like atmosphere, definately choose USC.</p>
<p>Fight On!</p>
<p>King:
UCLA's football sucks largely due to that coach Dorrell. He needs to be fired for UCLA's good. And he didnot bring in top recruits. Hope he can do well this year, otherwise all alumni will presure to fire him.</p>
<p>Also, I don't see UCLA's grads get placed well, at least not to my knowledge. It is due to other reasons than who is good or bad.</p>
<p>KFC4U:
Why USC is catching up? Because TheDad didn't work hard enough to bash USC:) Just kidding. But I do think one of the reasons is UCLA isn't doing well enough. Don't point me CotoDeCasa's posts to read the numbers. Combined with admission mess, UCLA may lose more ground in the future. </p>
<p>If you really think UCLA has that much better academics, you will find yourself fooled. The faculty quality equal, or at least in the same class. But that won't affect undergrads much anyway. Both are large schools, where you will find all kind of students interested in different stuff. That means you will find dead serious students, and students with other interests. One of my colleague goes to grad school at UCLA, and she is a straight "A" top student there. According to her, it is just ok.</p>
<p>If you really cant decide, one way of looking at things would be "which school would you be more comfortable hating".. because if you go to UCLA, you're going to have to hate USC... and vice versa. Personally, I'd be much more comfortable hating USC, seeing as they have a deserved reputation as the University of Spoiled Children, and being a taxpaying californian, I cant hate on my UC system.</p>
<p>That is one heck of way of thinking. Hatred should not be part of rivalry. Get some character!</p>
<p>UCLA hates USC. Berkeley hates USC. Even Pepperdine hates USC.</p>
<p>oh grow up, i meant "hate" in the lightest sense. I was half joking.</p>
<p>speaking of berkeley hating usc...</p>
<p>scroll down to the bottom right photo.</p>
<p>"re: "is ucla as liberal as berkeley?" under cons in the original post (was that a typo? wouldn't that be a positive attribute?). I think the liberalness of berkeley is over-stated. Yes, the city does have an international policy, but that is part of its charm. Berkeley is a unique phenomenon; and I don't think Westwood in LA is particularly forward-thinking." </p>
<p>LoL to avoidingwork: I've actually never been to Berkeley and didn't apply to UCB, but it does sound liek a funky and fun city. I am not doubting its charm, but I am super politically conservative person, and I've heard Berkeley is a mini liberal universe stuck in the 60s? maybe it is overstated who knows? anyways I'm used to being in the minority (living in a blue state, going to a feminist-minded all girls school,) but it'd be nice to go to school where even if the majority of students/faculty are liberal, that there'd still be a significant number of conservatives balancing the political environment out. </p>
<p>I do plan on visiting both schools of course. I've been to SC's campus a number of times, but I want to take a tour and even see what the classes are like while they're in session. I'm going to a visiting day thing at UCLA in three week so yeah I'll definitely get a feel for both schools. Thanks everyone for all your advice and keep them coming!!!</p>
<p>TheCity- the University of Spoiled Children stereotype is old, and outdated. Sorry to break it to you. I guess that means you can't hate USC! </p>
<p>And about the tax-paying part making you like UCLA, I would think that would make you NOT like it, because your hard-earned money goes there, while USC doesn't take a dime from you! :)</p>
<p>And kfc4u- answers to your two questions.</p>
<p>As for what the school has done to improve academics, you brush aside the fact that smarter students are coming in. With smarter, more academically-minded students comes classes with better discussions, etc. Less slouching in the chair, not paying attention to class.</p>
<p>Also, the school is putting the huge alumni donations (and donations from outside sources) to good use. The engineering school just got an amazing new building, that is really high-tech, and supposedly has everything you could need. They have something like 20 buildings slated to be built in the next few years. </p>
<p>The money is also going towards bringing in top notch professors from around the country. I've had a class with one of their new professors they brought in, and she was brilliant. She got us into amazing discussion, and worked us hard, but taught us a lot. And that was only for an Arts and Letters GE! </p>
<p>The school also makes students fill out surveys about classes (I've mainly only had it in GEs, but also a few in regular classes, I believe), at the middle and end of the semester. They ask us if we feel the class taught us what it said it would, how it could be improved, what was good or bad about the teacher, etc. My friend also participated in a discussion with other students that was put on to discuss GEs, and how they felt about classes they took. I think this is an important thing they do. </p>
<p>As far as the question about the atmosphere at USC, I find it to be very academically-challenging. Not that people don't enjoy a good social life, but what I love about USC, is that people REALLY care about both, and they find a balance that works for them. My classes always are filled with students that make me work harder, because they are so smart, and so on-time with their assignments (I'm an English major, and when I see my classmates analyze things so well, or when they have read every last word that they are assigned, I try harder). My friends in my major and I keep each other motivated. Not to say that we don't criticize a boring class, or a terrible book, but we work hard, and I see that all around me.</p>
<p>thanks uschicka for the insight. i was only brushing off the increasing quality of the students only because i wanted to find out WHY they are increasing in the first place.</p>
<p>
[quote]
mrtrojanman, im curious too. what changes has USC made? to me, everything seems to be the same... perhaps they hired more professors, but otherwise they're taking a page out of washU's strategy in boosting their USNWR ranking (from 41 to 30 in five years) and offering scholarships to top students. (i dont know the answer to this), but what real changes has USC made that would make it almost an academic equivalent of UCLA and also to be superior to UCSD, all within about 5 years?
[/quote]
</p>
<p>If I may, I'd like to take a stab at your questions...</p>
<p>The reason why I think so many kids are choosing USC over the top UC's is:</p>
<ol>
<li> USC's recent historic push towards academic excellence.</li>
<li><p>Let's be real, the UC's have been stagnant over the past 5 years and a lot of that had to do with funding. USC has been raking in donations, alumni support, etc and have been attracting top faculty and resources during that time. </p></li>
<li><p>Disenchantment with UC's</p></li>
<li><p>The UC system has imploded. It used to be that every top HS senior in CA wanted to go to a top 3 UC without question, but with the overload of students and rising tuition that really isn't the case anymore. A lot of kids can go to USC for nearly the same price (or marginally different), receive more attention, and have access to top career resources. </p></li>
<li><p>USC's tradition, Trojan Family, and Job Prospects</p></li>
<li><p>I think it's different from the perspective from a Trojan, but there is a huge disparity between post-graduation preparation for USC versus many of the UC's. I have countless friends that attended top UC's that have never attended or even heard of a Industry night or Networking event. At USC, you have these things shoved down your throat.</p></li>
<li><p>Class Size</p></li>
<li><p>I personally think top students, for the most part, are drawn to smaller classes. USC is a pretty big private but still offers considerably smaller classes versus UC's. If the kids can afford it, why wouldn't they want to receive more attention? One of the most consistent complaints I hear about UCs is the whole, "I feel like a number" and "I feel like I've been tossed in a machine and spit out after 4 years". </p></li>
</ol>
<p>Basically USC is making a VERY strong push towards being an elite university and for USC haters (there are many) it's scary cause they are just beginning. They've had close to 10 state of the art buildings pop up in the span of about 5 years. The Pres. plans to build over 10 more in next 10 years. They just completed major hiring initiative to strengthen their weakest college (LAS). They are completely revamping the neighborhood around the school to make it more like a college town. Downtown LA is one of the hottest areas in the world right now for property investment.</p>
<p>UC's are great schools, but I think USC has done an excellent job marketing themselves and making known that they are a serious university. They've broken down old stereotypes and have leveraged themselves using tradition and resources.</p>
<p>gosh this is a hard decision.</p>
<p>Sorry pixiedanzer! I've been there before (except not with UCLA), so I understand!</p>
<p>First of all you can't loose. Having said that my son and I visited UCLA and USC when he was in high school. We both liked the look of UCLA's campus and the diversity of stduents. We didn't like how big it was, how far away the dorms were from the center of the campus, and how congested it felt. Now we didn't have to make the decision you do because my son wasn't accepted (out-of-state.) </p>
<p>WMy son is now in his second year. He likes his courses, film (critical studies) and a minor in peace in conflict studies. He ius very politically actuive and is one of the originators of the upcomiong protest agianst the war in Iraq. He has a small group of friends and a girlfriend. He is ver</p>
<p>i would prefer UCLA on non biased Undergrad programs are much better. USC is better known for grad school but UCLA is at the same leve for grad schools. UCLA go for it.</p>
<p>Sorry my message got sent by accident before I finished. </p>
<p>What I was going to say was that he is very pleased to be at USC.</p>
<p>i already posted this somewhere else but ill do it again:
in comparing the two schools, how about location?
USC is in the craphole of LA, surrounded by uglies such as macarthur park, East LA (such a gangster area, such as Watts), monterey park/alhambra (<---primarily dirty asian citys, eugh), chinatown, and south LA (Compton) surrounding it. (and ofcourse, its in Downtown LA - eugh)</p>
<p>ucla has beverly hills/west hollywood (east of it), burbank/bel-air/brentwood (north of it), and santa monica southwest of it.</p>
<p>ucla is also in the westwood village which is always highly esteemed for its college life. ucla is also next to other great LA sites like universal city , the entire hollywood scene, the intersection of hollywood and highland where the kodak theater and graumann's chinese theater (among other things) are located. hmm what else...wouldnt you like to be walking along rodeo drive and celebrity-hunting =)</p>