<p>Good post, Jack.</p>
<p>I think that the whole GPA situation is different for everyone and has a lot to do with future plans and graduate work. Students planning on going on to study Law or Medicine do care A LOT about their GPA. They know their GPA, they take courses that help them raise their GPA, etc, etc. Certainly, anyone who is planning to go into most others fields may not be very interested because other graduate programs are not as competitive. I would venture to add that perhaps the U of C students that have been posting here fall in that category and that's why they do not keep track of their GPA, which certainly makes it a very relaxed educational experience.</p>
<p>I am not talking here about how it should not be this way or how there are other important factors in someone's application. The bottom line is that for Medicine and Law, students do obsess over and track their GPA, the minute they step into college. Just ask any of your classmates who are premed or prelaw.</p>
<p>"Students planning on going on to study Law or Medicine do care A LOT about their GPA. They know their GPA, they take courses that help them raise their GPA, etc, etc. Certainly, anyone who is planning to go into most others fields may not be very interested because other graduate programs are not as competitive."</p>
<p>Of my fourth-year friends...
... I have one accepted to UChicago Med, UMich, and Case Western, awaiting reply from Harvard and Yale...
... one accepted to Harvard Law...
... one accepted to a PhD program in physics in Princeton....
... one accepted to various law schools...
... one accepted to various MD/PhD programs, such as Ohio State's, and awaiting reply from Albert Einstein and Dartmouth...</p>
<p>... they are not grademongers.</p>
<p>I'm sure they did well in school; I could not give you their GPA for the life of me. As for the one going on to Princeton, he probably spends more time playing and watching sports than he does worrying about his future. As for the one accepted at three med school programs, he majored in Russian Lit, a definite GPA killer if there ever was one. Why? Because he wanted to.</p>
<p>If you're obsessed with GPA, you're missing the point. You won't enjoy your education, like my friends did, and you won't let life take you where it may take you. So my other friend didn't make the GPA cutoff for MIT's physics program. Instead of regretting all the time she spent not studying, she simply said, "Okay, so the program wasn't right for me."</p>
<p>^^^ Your post misses my point completely. For the life of me, I could not care less about anyone's GPA. I care about mine and I know mine. The OP posted the original thread for his own reasons. My point is that premeds and prelaws do care. That is all. Also, for the life of me, I do not know why the posters here from U of C have decided to make such a big deal about that true fact.
So premeds and prelaws enjoy their undergraduate education less than the average undergraduate majoring in music, architecture and whatever else... YES. It is true! As far as the rest of your comments you are purely speculating. Since you guys never talk about grades, then you have no idea what the dude majoring in Russian lit got.. or did u?? (I do not care to know by the way...just making a point here)</p>
<p>The question is simple. Everyone keeps going on tangents while offering the holy advice about undergrad happiness. Do premeds and prelaws care about their GPA? What do u think : YES or NO? That's it. Whether they should or not, whether it is healthy or sick , whether it is wise or unwise becomes a completely different subject more personal and subjective than anything else.</p>
<p>Believe it or not, there are people out there who like O-Chem enough so that their love for it translates into a remarkable GPA. They do not need to kill themselves for a higher grade: they do the work, and the high grades come to them. Do they care about their GPA? They care much more about the task at hand than whatever grade they are getting out of it. They put in the hours of study because they love the subject, not because they have a master plan to oust their peers.</p>
<p>These people exist all around the country, and a lot of them are at UChicago. These are the same people who end up going on to the top med schools.</p>
<p>I think we're arguing about semantics now. Really, I think the people who are prospectives need to just listen to the current students. I'm going to assume that, while these people aren't exactly a scientific cross-section, they understand the way things at Chicago get done a little better than us. Nobody is going to stop you from worrying about your GPA if you go there.</p>
<p>If you want to go to Chicago and also have a 3.8 GPA or something, then go ahead and give it a shot, nobody is going to stop you. What they are trying to say, however, is that you can get into those schools you think you need a 3.8+ for without having to focus on that. </p>
<p>My interpretation of this whole thing is that we have some students here who are a little too caught up on the importance of GPA. Kind of surprises me since we're on the UChicago forums... but whaever. </p>
<p>A cousin of mine is a Harvard Neurosurgeon, and as far as I've ever heard from him, the Ivy Leagues love Chicago. They get along great with eachother (IE accepting eachother applicants readily if they qualify). I even asked him about this subject because at the time I was considering some grad programs, and he just laughed and said don't worry. A respectable GPA at Chicago, regardless of the arbitrary number attached to it, is mightily respected elsewhere. </p>
<p>I defer to my cousin, then, on this issue, since he seems to know far more than I do about the particulars.</p>
<p>I believe somewhat mentioned earlier that Chicago's grade deflation is a well known fact. I believe that the OP may have been referring to that fact and the reason why he wanted to know people's GPAs.</p>
<p>It is certainly something that prospective students may be interested in. I have seen in other school's forums people talking about the opposite grade inflation. </p>
<p>I believe we already covered all about how grades are not important, just acquiring the knowledge is, the enjoyment of the undergrad experience and so on...Please, lets not get all judgemental now. But if someone wants to take the fact of grade deflation into consideration at the time of applying to a college, let it be known.</p>
<p>If GPA is important in deciding on a college, then the material posted on school averages is likely to satisfy that requirement. One way to get a fix on what to expect from different departments is to visit the particular departmental website and look at the GPA required for departmental honors. Some even post the percentage of students getting honors. A good guess would be that students in departments with honors of 3.5 will tend to have higher GPA's then students in departments where honors is 3.0. One can see how a likely concentration choice may affect one's overall GPA, if that is important. Chicago grades have not deflated over the years, they have just inflated a little less, as the article posted earlier describes.</p>
<p>Thanks, idad. I understand what you mean.</p>
<p>I would argue that a lot of pre-law folks don't think that much about GPA. Being one myself, with pretty high goals, I didn't even start paying attention to what my GPA was until about halfway through my second year. I know another person planning on law school who was considering a chemistry major because he thought it was interesting. I had a class last year in which the professor said, point-blank "If you want to go to law school, don't take this class because my average grade is a B-." Most of the people in the class were planning on law school, and most showed up the next day. I'm not saying that there aren't people who calculuate exactly what a grade in a particular class they will likely receive and what it will do to their GPA, but they aren't the majority. It may sound idealistic and perhaps delusional to not really pay attention to GPA and plan on law school (there is no pre-law program or track here other than "take classes where you think and write a lot"), but it's the case for a lot of people here. Pre-med is little less carefree, though it's not really competitive. A couple of people I know in taking O-Chem were just talking at lunch about how great it was that there was a whole group of people in there together who could provide moral and academic support.</p>
<p>Wow.... that is great! It goes to show that there are all sort of diffferent people with different attitudes about life, school and career. Sounds like an ideal environment to learn. You are talking about U of C, right? What a great plus for the college!</p>
<p>"Believe it or not, there are people out there who like O-Chem enough so that their love for it translates into a remarkable GPA. They do not need to kill themselves for a higher grade: they do the work, and the high grades come to them. Do they care about their GPA? They care much more about the task at hand than whatever grade they are getting out of it. They put in the hours of study because they love the subject, not because they have a master plan to oust their peers."</p>
<p>I never asked if anyone at Chicago cared about their GPA or not. I know that UChicago students have a reputation for being concerned more about the learning process than the grades. Nevertheless, I was still curious what GPA they're getting. You guys went on all kinds of unnecessary tangents.</p>
<p>I wasn't sure-- I thought that the article I posted a link to at the beginning of the thread answered the question, and since discussion continued, I thought that maybe there were misconceptions of typical student life here.</p>
<p>Important correction to post 39 in which I said:</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>so that <em>you</em> could answer....</p>
<p>This is quite frankly unbelievable. Every single current student is dodging the main question.</p>
<p>
[quote]
I would argue that a lot of pre-law folks don't think that much about GPA. Being one myself, with pretty high goals, I didn't even start paying attention to what my GPA was until about halfway through my second year.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Are you kidding me? I'll repeat that again, are you kidding me? Pre-med and Pre-law are universally known as the most cutthroat undergraduate requirements, and are very intense GPA wise. Ever heard of Organic Chemistry and how many people fret over doing well in that class? Why don't you visit the Pre-Med/Pre-Law forum and realize how much people care of their GPAs.</p>
<p>For all the current students at Chicago who visit CC, yes, YOU may not care about your GPA. YOU may not have grandiose graduate school plans. But, believe it or not, there are highly motivated students who want to achieve these goals, and it is a well known fact that GPA IS A PREREQUISITE FOR TOP LAW SCHOOLS AND MEDICAL SCHOOLS. Yes, a Prerequisite. If you don't have a high enough GPA, you won't even get an interview.</p>
<p>I'm here for the education, the liberal arts experience, and the wonderful opprotunities offered at Chicago. I'm also here to become successful and achieve my goals in life.</p>
<p>It would be very nice if the current Chicago students would cooperate and post actual GPAs so we as prospective students can get a feel if Chicago is the right place for us. Don't be stringent to teach us a lesson - you won't change our minds. GPA doesn't matter for life, but it does matter in the game of competitive graduate schools.</p>
<p>
As a person in the midst of the study abroad process, I found this quite interesting. Many of the programs I've considered or applied to have non-negotiable GPA cutoffs. Oxford requires at least a 3.5, and they note that most successful applicants have at least a 3.8 at prestigious colleges. Cambridge won't consider any applicant with a GPA less than 3.7. Even Chicago's own Cambridge fellowship program requires at least a 3.5. As idad said, a GPA above 3.5 is hard to get at Chicago (or peer schools). The problem is that some colleges really don't care.</p>
<p>"I'm here for the education, the liberal arts experience, and the wonderful opprotunities offered at Chicago. I'm also here to become successful and achieve my goals in life."</p>
<p>Are you currently at UChicago?</p>
<p>Cardene: If you read all the arguments people have been making, I'm sure you'll understand why the current students on this board aren't posting their GPAs. You already have their grades. You have the average GPA. You have a general idea of the competitiveness in getting into grad school coming out of Chicago. I'm not a student yet, so I guess I don't have much authority in contributing to this discussion, but what is with this fixation on getting an individual's GPA? Even if someone posts their GPA on this board, it won't even help, since they haven't applied to grad school yet.</p>
<p>Sorry if I sound rude. The posts everyone has been making have been incredibly helpful and informative, and I just don't understand why it's not enough for you.</p>
<p>geez cardene, way to be demanding and patronizing. do you really think there aren't uchicago students who plan on attending grad/professional school?</p>
<p>maybe im being a silly idealist here (prolly am).... but Chicago is a fine school, top 10 in america, but regardless of rank, its a damn good and well respected institution. I don't think it would have all that it does if the kids who went there were not capable of/ the school didn't help kids get into the best professional and grad schools out there. Just sort of logically thinking it out there.</p>
<p>I think most people are posting, asking about gpa stuff because they themselves are super nervous about college in general. I have been resisting the urge of posting stuff like that, because personally, I am really insecure about my intelligence when I read other people's stats, and read more about the school etc. Every day I just ask myself if I am smart enough to do well in any college, much less one that has chicago's rep for rigor.</p>
<p>I sort of assure myself that things tend to work themselves out like this, like in Harold and Kumar Go to White Castle (cowritten by a U of C grad) a character says "things in the Universe tend to unfold as they are meant to". I know I got accepted for a good reason. Other prospies who got in should think they are capable of the work too.</p>
<p>And I think people should not single out U of C. Regardless of grades or any of that, none of the schools we keep mentioning on these forums are anywhere close to a walk in the park. Any of the schools we are naming are freaking hard too. I just think these threads are indirectly about the poster's insecurities. Hey guys im right there with you.</p>