<p>dwincho, thanks. That's one for the USMA.</p>
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I won't even get into how you people are saying that people at the academies are almost always better than people are civilian schools (in leadership and stuff)...oy (don't start making points about this...because I do know that they are leaders and such, but so are lots of other people at tippity top schools [not talking about secluded engineering people lol])
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<p>Fair enough. Just don't try and pass off that non-academy types are almost always better in engineering, business, etc. ;)</p>
<p>Zapoid, I admire your spirit!</p>
<p>Zapoid? :confused:</p>
<p>Damn, man! That's not even in the same area of the keyboard! :eek:</p>
<p>Of course, the rivalry ends as soon as some non-SA type starts taking potshots at a SA. Then we all close ranks and throw down together. :D</p>
<p>And just a little more history.</p>
<p>John Paul Jones was a Merchant Marine officer before he was the father of the US Navy. And the first US naval victory was, of course, a victory by merchant mariners:</p>
<p>News of the April 1775 battles at Concord and Lexington reached Machias, Maine just as citizens were anxiously awaiting long-needed supplies from Boston. When the Unity and Polly carrying these supplies arrived, they were accompanied by the British armed schooner Margaretta, under the command of Lieutenant Moore. The escort's job was to see that in exchange for supplies, lumber was taken back to Boston to build barracks for British soldiers.</p>
<p>The British demanded all citizens sign a petition promising to protect British property at all times in exchange for the right to buy supplies. Since many citizens were opposed to aiding the British war effort, they were angered by this.</p>
<p>They decided to strip the two sloops of the supplies and at the same time to capture Captain Ichabod Jones, Lieutenant Moore and his officers after they attended church services. The British fled on the Margaretta as patriots lined the shore demanding she "Surrender to America!" The reply they heard was, "Fire and be damned!"</p>
<p>Forty men, armed with guns, swords, axes, and pitchforks, headed by Jeremiah O'Brien, on the sloop Unity and twenty men under the command of Benjamin Foster on a small schooner pursued the Margaretta. During the chase they put up planks and other objects to defend themselves against the Margaretta's cannon.</p>
<p>On June 12, 1775, near Round Island on Machias Bay the patriots crashed into the Margaretta and engaged in hand to hand combat. The British crew was disheartened when their captain was mortally wounded and lost the one hour long battle. 25 of the combatants were killed or wounded. The victors claimed "four double fortifyed three pounders and fourteen swivels" and some smaller guns.</p>
<p>This was considered the first sea engagement of the Revolution and the start of the merchant marine's war role.</p>
<p>As captain of the privateer Machias Liberty, Jeremiah O'Brien later captured two armed British schooners and delivered his prisoners to George Washington. On the General's recommendation, the government of Massachusetts appointed O'Brien to command his two prizes.</p>
<p>And here comes the upstart! :D</p>
<p>Beeblebrox?</p>
<p>Correct. Don't let the one head and two arms fool you. ;)</p>
<p>Come on Zaphod, you forgot some alumni....
-John Phillips (the Papa from Mamas and the Papas)... from the class of no class
Montel Williams
-James Webb (author, former secretary of the Navy, and the so unpolitically correct candidate for senator in 2008
-And finally, what about John McCain (I'm still waiting to see if they put secret service on his son at USNA if he gets the nomination)</p>
<p>oh yeah, one more thing.... 4 of the 6 members of the Joint Chiefs of staff
Thats right, all Naval Academy Grads
GEN Pace, USMC, Chairman of the Joint Chiefs
ADM Giambastiani, USN, Vice Chairman of the Joint Chiefs
GEN Hagee, USMC, Commandant of the Marine Corps
ADM Mullen, USN, Chief of Naval Operations</p>
<p>Well, I didn't want to pile on the poor Woop too badly... ;)</p>
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John Phillips (the Papa from Mamas and the Papas)... from the class of no class
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<p>Yep. There is a rumor that "California Dreamin'" is actually about a Mid walking through the Yard during winter. Dunno if it's true, but it sure does fit.</p>
<p>My company sang California Dreamin in three part harmony. The seniors taught it to us and loved it, the Class of '76 who are still dear to my heart (not) as juniors just hated it. I believe there was animousity between the two classes. I read years later that the song was not about the Naval Academy but only Phillips would know for sure.</p>
<p>My Plebe summer roommate attended the Naval Academy for 1.5 years and then left for MIT. He was at the 25th reunion but I wasn't. I will try and get a hold of him and ask him which is academically more stressful in his opinion. </p>
<p>My daughter attends GA Tech and academically it seems to be pretty stressful Sunday-Thursday night. Friday and Saturday it doesn't seem like anyone is under any stress but drinking way too much even for a Navy guy who very much enjoys that warm British beer (no headaches even after one too many). My son who had higher SAT scores and stood higher in his class academically attends Annapolis. My daughter actually has more leadership skills and he more athletic skills. </p>
<p>Stress is also internal. That is why getting through the academies is so difficult with the external academic pressures and once you do, you can more easily adapt to perhaps "harder" academics at other schools. I remember reading newspaper articles during Chemistry because for some reason I disliked getting yelled out during lunch by 2/c while passing food and holding up milk cartons vs. not listening to a Chem lecture. The stress of Plebe year is incredible and even ROTC can't come close. Now if I didn't have four straight classes that Plebe semester I would have had the time to know my rates and could have payed attention in Chem. Was Chemistry more important, yes. But who the heck wants to get yelled out during lunch every day so its a trade off you make. I believe that is why I enjoyed Wharton so much, good academics, great professors, I could wear jeans and a sweatshirt, the girls were pretty and smiled, and there were no external pressures except for a full time job. I didn't have to know the movies in town, the officers of the watch, the starting football team, the next three or four meals, the days till we BEAT ARMY, 2/c ring dance, graduation, leave period, remember the 10, 5, 4, 3, 2, and 1 minute chow calls, shine my leather shoes so they could reflect the moon on a dark night, and a uniform tuck, and be able to discuss the current events of the day and the Redskins along with the historical significance the battleships played in our nation's history. On a side note, if the Israeli's had 16 inch guns off the coast of Lebanon, Hezbollah would have headed for Syria and Iran by now.</p>
<p>This has been an interesting thread and valid points made on both sides. Let's face it...each school has its difficulties and graduating from the service academies, Ivys, Harvey Mudd, Cal Tech, MIT, UVA, etc. all have their own stress but what I will assure you is that for the most part, getting through Plebe year is more stressful than any other school no matter what the academic load is....now, the next three years at the academy is definitely, easier stress wise but perhaps not academically. So let's agree that the freshman year at a service academy is the most stressful year there is and now everyone can argue for the other 3+ years. Out of 45 or so Plebes we only graduated 17 and it wasn't always academics that got to them, it was the stress.</p>
<p>I hope everyone has a Great day and I off to visit that son in Annapolis for the first time in 7 weeks.</p>
<p>Don't forget Vice Admiral Joseph Stewart, USNA '64</p>
<p>Superintendent US Merchant Marine Academy</p>
<p>"And finally, what about John McCain (I'm still waiting to see if they put secret service on his son at USNA if he gets the nomination)"</p>
<p>god I went to h.s. with his son...the kid is the biggest slacker/druggie in the world. He actually was forced to go to USNA by dad, he wanted to go to ASU. I believe he is last or second to last in his class at USNA? Nice to see President Bush wasting his nominations on pieces of crap like Jack. Well it's not like his father was any better I think that Senator McCain graduated in the bottom 5 of his class.</p>
<p>Don't all Harvard freshmen go to Beast?</p>
<p>Yeah; they call it rush week.</p>
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god I went to h.s. with his son...the kid is the biggest slacker/druggie in the world. He actually was forced to go to USNA by dad, he wanted to go to ASU. I believe he is last or second to last in his class at USNA? Nice to see President Bush wasting his nominations on pieces of crap like Jack. Well it's not like his father was any better I think that Senator McCain graduated in the bottom 5 of his class.
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<p>Well, like I've always said: I've seen diamonds AND turds graduate from my beloved Alma Mater. More's the pity, but that's life, unfortunately. :(</p>
<p>Politics. GAG!! :mad:</p>
<p>Woohoo, Harvard Beast, huh? - does all the Harvard freshmen beer drinking during that transitional period cause an excessive number of hangovers?</p>
<p>I don't remember my USMA buddy saying anything about beer his first year or really any year, for that matter. He could have been shy, though. He did comment once or twice about Beast. He was never very boisterous. </p>
<p>Maybe it was after his tour as a tank commander in the Fulda Gap that he talked about beer. Could it have been after that Korean tour? I don't remember. Maybe it was after jump school at Ft. Benning? It's all a mix by now.</p>
<p>No comparison, in my opinion. The national military academies are the toughest schools, considering the totality of the circumstances, of all universities. They demand total commitment: academically, physically and morally - the pure student; ready to sacrifice all for an ideal. </p>
<p>I stand in awe of those fine people.</p>
<p>1.Chicago
2.CALTech
3.MIT
4.Cornell
5.Berkley
6.Princeton
7.Harvard
8.Yale
9.Swatty
10. Your local State U. :rolleyes:</p>
<p>bumppppppppppppp</p>