<p>Has this been discussed on this forum? It was originally posted 4/8/14 but the comments section has more recent posts.<br>
Would love to know who created this list.
<a href="http://www.buzzfeed.com/musicaltheateranswers/top-collegiate-musical-theatre-programs-nxld">http://www.buzzfeed.com/musicaltheateranswers/top-collegiate-musical-theatre-programs-nxld</a></p>
<p>I don’t think it has been discussed on this forum, but I have been a part of a discussion on it elsewhere. I’ll proffer my opinion.</p>
<p>First…as BuzzFeed states:
</p>
<p>So, what we’ve got here is ONE person’s OPINION, and the person’s name is not even attached to it. Anyone could put up a list!</p>
<p>This list has no meaning or validity for me. I’d say that no matter what schools were on it and placed wherever. I say this because for one thing, there is no methodology given to any data collection. They mention three criteria but not how they gathered any data on that criteria. None. I am not into ANY types of rankings of colleges in the first place, but at least some rankings have a stated methodology to them, be it USNews or Princeton Review, etc. This one has NONE. It comes across as sheer opinion.</p>
<p>Next, the person’s credibility and knowledge about which he/she speaks comes into question when…
~calls Emerson College…Emerson University!
~lists UNSCA which doesn’t even have a MT program
~lists Emerson and Ball State’s MT programs as BAs when they offer a BFA
~missing some established programs such as Hartt
~grammatical errors
~would be hard pressed to say for example, that the number of alumni on Broadway from NYU/Tisch, Syracuse, Ithaca are on par with the number from University of Arizona, Millikin, and Shenandoah (using one of their stated criteria)
~would LOVE to see how they gathered the answers to: “what are alumni doing currently” (when many schools don’t keep tabs or publish that information), “what percentage find representation immediately following graduation” (doubtful they could gather this on every program, as well as finding representation a couple years after graduation is good too), “what connections have the students made by the time they graduate?” (you’d have to conduct a survey and I doubt this was done)
~As far as if they allow students to do professional work before they graduate…this is not necessarily the measure of a ‘better’ program and is more of a preference one way or the other
~As far as freshmen getting cast…I think this is also merely a preference rather than what makes a program great…some of the more well regarded programs don’t even let freshmen audition</p>
<p>Those are my thoughts.</p>
<p>I completely agree- the anonymity of the post, and lack empirical data make this list interesting - but far from reliable. The same site told me what city I should live in (San Francisco) made a guess at my middle name (Ruth - really?), and told me that the Disney Princess I most resemble is Mulan (I can dig it) </p>
<p>I would say any potential MT student should beware (actually avoid if possible!!) lists and rankings- figure out what YOU want in a program, what schools offer what you want, and go from there. There are too many examples of people being successful (and not successful) from SO many programs - there is no way to categorize and make a straight list.</p>
<p>Just my humble opinion… but I do agree with Buzzfeed that the cinema Icon I most resemble is Vivian Leigh…</p>
<p>I don’t necessarily agree with the tiers 100%, but I do think the list is quite accurate as far as top programs. There are one or two on there that I’m not sure about and a couple that I think should be on there that aren’t. But if you’re looking for a good starting place, I think its very useful. Just remember, the best school is the one that fits your needs and prepares you for your career goals whatever they may be. </p>
<p>~VT</p>
<p>What is useful as a starting point is a list of colleges that have a MT program. You could say that list as a whole offers that, but it would be better without the claim of “best” or the tiers which have no methodology used to arrive at that. So, if I wanted a starting point of schools that have MT, I would come to CC’s MT Forum and go to the Big List (pinned near the top), which lists all the schools that offer MT and the type of degree program and state. It is not a claim as to what schools are best, but rather a starting point for finding schools to explore to find the one that fits your personal criteria for selection and fit. </p>
<p>I agree @VoiceTeacher…</p>
<p>Looking at this again this morning. I think “26 Strong Programs” or “26 Competitive Programs” is a better title for this list. All of these programs are strong and competitive, whether or not they are “best” is very subjective and dependent on a combination of factors. However, even on that front I think it is incomplete. For instance I know that there are really good things happening at James Madison University, Illinois Wesleyan University, University of the Arts, and University of Northern Colorado yet none of those programs are listed here. All are competitive and all are strong. </p>
<p>I honestly think we’ve reached the point where it is more difficult to navigate the musical theatre audition process than it is to apply for medical or law school. Everyone seems to want easy answers and unfortunately they do not exist.</p>
<p>~VT</p>
<p>
I think part of the reason that it’s impossible to objectively rank MT programs is that unlike a top medical or law school it’s difficult to make the case that any particular program makes its graduates vastly more employable. Yes, a higher percentage of grads of certain programs will work, but a compelling argument could be made that those same kids would have worked if they’d spent 4 years working at McDonalds instead of going to college, as most of them were talented, beautiful, very well trained, and often quite well-connected before they ever applied to college. </p>
<p>It could be argued that the only thing a degree from a prestigious MT program ultimately buys you is the prospect of showing up at auditions along with a slew of other talented people. Of course a solid education ultimately gives you far more than employment, but long term income is the thing that’s easiest to quantify and also the one thing no MT program can guarantee. </p>
<p>All of this said, I do think the contacts kids make in school, and the reputation of their program, can give kids a leg up when they are starting out.</p>
<p>VoiceTeacher…University of the Arts is on the list. Yes, it would be better to just list them as competitive programs in MT without ranking them. This particular ranking has no substance or method. I don’t even think it is possible to rank the schools. Yes, some schools are more well known for MT than others or more competitive to get into (though this ranking surely doesn’t reflect that last aspect). Also, there are some fine, established programs missing from the list. </p>
<p>MomCares, you make some good points. There is much value in the training and in gaining an education. As you say, certain people are very talented no matter what program they attended, and some had that going into college. College helped refine that and of course, contacts were made and so on. </p>
<p>I completely agree with comments made such as this is ranking has no substance, it’s unreliable, many schools were left off, others were put into tiers that I and others wouldn’t agree with, etc. Besides this, as we often say here, what’s top for one person isn’t top for another. </p>
<p>A FB friend posted it on his/her wall as a brag for the program his/her child attends, and I debated whether or not to comment on it and what exactly to say. I just left it alone.</p>
<p>I have a d who performs mt but is getting her bm in vocal performance so i check out both the mt and the music forums on cc. </p>
<p>Here is the definitive music school ranking as posted on the music forum… and with the exception of julliard not having an mt program (thank you glee for letting us know that one) I think the top schools are pretty similar.</p>
<p>Top Ten Music School Rankings
10. The school where you did your undergrad.</p>
<ol>
<li><p>The school where you got your Master’s, and to which you are indebted for the gigs it helped you get to pay off the student loans for the school where you did your undergrad.</p></li>
<li><p>The place where you wrote your DMA dissertation on your teacher’s teacher’s teacher’s pedagogical methods (or lack thereof).</p></li>
<li><p>Juellerd. Julleard? Julliard. Jewelyard? Whatever.</p></li>
<li><p>Harvard.</p></li>
<li><p>The place you wanted to go for undergrad, but you fracked one single note in one single excerpt and then you panicked and broke down and called the professor “Dad” and then Dave got in even though he couldn’t play Petrushka in time and he’s always been kind of a (jerk) about it and now he’s subbing like every weekend in the **** BSO.</p></li>
<li><p>Royal Something of Great British Academy I think? I hear they never let Americans in. Or maybe that’s the other one?</p></li>
<li><p>The school that everybody knows isn’t as good as the school where you did your undergrad, but is “up-and coming.” Featuring a lauded entrepreneurship initiative that trains barista skills at one of the three coffee shops housed in its new state-of-the-art building, named for an alumnus of the university’s business school currently facing indictment for fraud.</p></li>
<li><p>University of Phoenix.</p></li>
<li><p>The school that has paid to have this list promoted on Facebook.</p></li>
</ol>
<p>those music guys can be really funny:)</p>
<p>^^^That is great! =D> </p>
<p>I saw the list on social media too - as hard evidence for a young person who seems to be having a sour grapes response to the BFA process from last year. Like myloves, I pondered- then decided to leave it alone.</p>
<p>I’m sure there will be a new “Top” list tomorrow ;)</p>
<p>And the day after, and the day after, and the day after. And (almost) every one will have some validity- but none will be the end all be all, b/c the factors that create success cannot be definitely listed either</p>
<p>The list is total BS…</p>