<p>Hey guys. I am in a serous dilemma about what college I should attend. This is mainly a question of finances and the pay off from attending one college over another. Right now I am a Freshman studying Engineering at UVa. As many of you know, UVa is the second best public school in the country and 25th overall. I think UVa is great. If a graduate in four years, I will be $31,000 in debt and my parents $40,000. </p>
<p>Obviously this is a big number so i wa thinking of transferring. I live 40 minutes away form a college called George Mason. I did some research and figured out that if I go to mason, I can graduate in 3 years. I can also commute to college, saving money. If i go to Mason, I will be $10,000 in debt and my parent's $25,000.</p>
<p>So UVA Total debt- $71,000
George Mason total debt- $35,000.</p>
<p>Thats a $36,000 difference and an extra year. In that year I can get a job and essentially pay off all my debts i the same time i would off graduated at UVA. Also, I would graduate Mason at 20 years old, UVa at 21 year old.</p>
<p>SO my question is, what should i do. I like UVa alot and since its one of the top in the nation, should i stay. Will going to a tier 3 college like Mason hurt my chances of a job and long term future. I want to eventually get an MBA and a top Business School. This means that I'll accumulate more debt but have a better chance? Please provide me with some input!</p>
<p>@ash_godinho - According to me Undergraduate engineering does not matter much. Of course UVa will get you better interview’s but it is the student that matters. If you are a good student then George mason’s will get you a good job (as there are students who get good jobs after graduating from George mason). I’d say save that money for grad school when it really matters. </p>
<p>I would also like to share a story with you. In August 2001, my cousin was accepted to RPI and being the brilliant student that he was he got a 10,000$ scholarship. But that just brought the fees to about 35,000$+ . His parents asked him to go to a lower tier university as they could not afford it. HE ended up going to Minnesota state University - Mankato (which is a tier 3 or 4 university). He graduated top from his class and was elected the first Indian to be elected Student government President. He then moved to San Fransisco and worked at a firm for 70,000$ per year (which is amazing for a starting salary) and then his company sent him to University of California - Berkley for his graduate degree. When I asked him about spending over the limit for college (undergraduate) education he told me that today he is debt free and the guy working 2 cubicles away from him who graduated from Boston University is still paying off his loans and now I (my cousin) earn more than him. </p>
<p>I hate to say that all I can say is Good Luck! You’re in the same place that many many many kids are. The dollar figure might be different, and that is where everyone faces their problem. Some can’t afford an extra $10,000…others’ breaking point is in the hundreds of thousands. You already know it boils down to how good you feel the school’s VALUE is, versus what you’re paying. And that graduate school step comes VERY heavily into play because you won’t get much aid there AND they’re more expensive. And it’s too early to tell (probably) if you might earn any scholarships (and they’re not usually huge).</p>
<p>My D is in this boat. NYU, and probably at full cost…versus a nice in state school at $0 - $10,000 year. BIG cost difference. But, in our opinion, big quality of education difference too. WILL it ever pay off?</p>
<p>One thing to think about, that we’re mulling over, that will only add MORE problems to your decision is that you asked if a lesser respected school (MY words, not yours) will give you more trouble when applying for jobs. Think about it…“guy walks into a bar”…wait, I mean potential employer’s offce. He whips out a resume from Harvard. The interview is going to automatically, let’s face it, go ooooh-aaaah. And have an instantly different subliminal feeling about this applicant. Deserved or not. And, with SO many applicants for every spot…we need every edge we can get. These days, it’s not even about a BETTER job, just a job! Plus, I’ll assume both schools have job search/recruitment options. You can be sure that “bigger” (better??) companies will “work with” Harvard. HOWEVER…lots and lots of good/old/big/respectable companies are “going under” in this climate. And, will the MONEY actually be any better in that position? So, while my D (rightfully?) believes that WHICH graduate school she goes to is much more important than which undergrad…also remember that it will be harder to be ACCEPTED to an elite grad school from a lesser respected undergrad college as well. </p>
<p>I know I didn’t help. But I empathize, FWIW. You’ll get people vehemently suggesting BOTH options. Maybe something will ring true for you and help you decide. </p>
<p>FOR ME…with those dollar amounts you gave…I’d take UVA. FOR ME, that dollar difference would be well worth it. But…we’re all in different income brackets. And taking chances with debt in this economy is tough. Repaying college loans on an entry level income is… gosh, I have no CLUE how anyone does it. Best of luck to you.</p>
<p>Not necessarily. (S)he might shrug and go, “Harvard-shmarvard”. Or he might go, “Oh s**t, competition. Looks like another prima donna angling for MY job.” Or she might breeze right past your UG degree and focus on your MBA. Your interviewer might even be a pulled-himself-up-by-his-bootstraps kinda guy, who is impressed when you tell him you chose to save yourself and your family a lot of debt.</p>
<p>In some fields, a prestigious undergraduate degree does give you an edge or a foot in the door. I don’t know that engineering is one of them, or if it is, if even UVa would do for you what an MIT would. So, I’d take this out as a major factor in the decision. It’s more a matter of how much $36,000 means to you and your parents, and how close GM comes to matching what UVa has to offer for <em>you</em> (the courses you need, the quality of those courses, etc). </p>
<p>Your parents already have accepted the UVa-level debt. Has their financial situation greatly changed since then? If so, have you talked to FinAid people at UVa?</p>
<p>UVA is relatively weak in engineering compared to most top schools. If I were you I’d save my money and go to GMU. I wouldn’t go to Harvard for engineering either, too much money for mediocrity.</p>
<p>I’m going to go against what others have said, and say that I think you should stay at UVa not only for or its “better job prospects” or prestige, but because you love it! You said it yourself. You can’t get back your four years of college, and you should treasure you college experience. Clearly, you enjoy being at UVa and have formed relationships there. Would you be willing to give all that up to go to a school (with clearly less prestige and opportunities) to live at home and risk having a bad experience? I wouldn’t even if it put me an additional $40,000 in debt. Certainly money is important, but the experience and happiness during the four years of college is even more important. On top of that, I think it’s pretty clear that UVa is the better school and you will most likely have better job prospects coming out of it. Yes, you can succeed going to a lower tier school just fine. It certainly is more about the student than the school. But you currently attend a great school and love it, so I don’t see why you’d give that up to risk going to a commuter school, living at home, and risk being unhappy just to save some money. Loans can be re-paid. You can never get your four years of college back. Now if you had said you’re ambivalent about UVa (or were an incoming freshman instead of a transfer student), then I’d have a different opinion. But you’ve made you happiness clear, and because of that, I think the choice is clear - UVa all the way.</p>
<p>George Mason is a relatively new school and on the rise. I expect to become regarded to be much better in the coming years. $36,000 of debt is never worth it.</p>
<p>So are you for the transfer or not? I’m thinking that you’re for it.</p>
<p>Geo Mason is on the rise, but I’ve never thought of it as being “new” - it’s over 50 years old (independent from UVa for over 35 years). I know that’s not old, but it’s not really new. It has over 5500 students living on campus and has over 32,000 students. It sounds well established to me.</p>
<p>*I think UVa is great. If a graduate in four years, I will be $31,000 in debt and my parents $40,000. </p>
<p>Obviously this is a big number so i wa thinking of transferring. I live 40 minutes away form a college called George Mason. I did some research and figured out that if I go to mason, I can graduate in 3 years. I can also commute to college, saving money. If i go to Mason, I will be $10,000 in debt and my parent’s $25,000.</p>
<p>So UVA Total debt- $71,000
George Mason total debt- $35,000.
*</p>
<p>Unless your parents are very affluent, I wouldn’t want to saddle them with $40k in debt. That’s a lot of extra debt for middle-aged people to take on. That may very negatively affect their retirement situation.</p>
<p>How are you and your parents splitting your college costs? You’d reduce your debt by about 66% by going to GW, but your parents would only reduce their debt by about 40% (numbers done in my head so aren’t perfect). Why is that?</p>
<p>UVa is a great school but GM has also been known to be a decent school to attend, especially if your looking at social sciences. I’m not sure how either rank for engineering. </p>
<p>Considering that you were able to balance a debt between you and your parents that definately helps your UVA debt but overall its a lot for a undergraduate degree.</p>
<p>Well do you think that attending GM and having the same stats you would at UVA would ruin your future outlook? I highly doubt that. Then to think of the even larger debt at UVa.</p>
<p>Well if I was in your situation I wouldn’t exactly be sure on my decision at this time either, good thing you have until May 1st.</p>
<p>All other things excluded, I just wanted to say that commuting ~40 minutes towards DC sucks. I have experience with it and I wouldn’t want to do it daily.</p>
<p>Commuting could be a problem if you don’t schedule your classes in a way where you could avoid some of the traffic. Either leaving for school very early or taking classes later in the day (after 10am)</p>
<p>Thanks for everyone input guys! Yes, the good thing is I have till May to fully decide, and i do like UVa alot. Thanks bluedog for your insightful view because that is ecatly how i really feel. It was just that the 3 years in debt free made Mason very enticing.</p>
<p>You’re comparing apples and oranges. If all you’re looking for from college are resume credentials, then a 40-minute commute to Mason will get you those. But you’re at one of the elite universities in the country right now, among high-achieving peers. You have the opportunity to develop as a person, not just as a prospective engineer. Four years at UVA will acculturate you to the goals and aspirations of other broadly-educated people and help build in you the confidence to seek future positions of leadership, if that’s what you value. Commuting to Mason will earn you 60 transcript hours over the next two years.</p>
<p>As an analogy, suppose you told me that you were excited about the five-star restaurant that you’re planning to attend tonight. The food is acclaimed, the service and atmosphere are top-notch, and the evening will be a cultural experience that you’ll remember fondly forever. And I might respond "Why go to all the trouble and expense? You can drive through at Burger King and be out in five minutes for five dollars. And we’d both be right. If you’re looking for a peak experience, the five-star restaurant will provide it. If you’re merely looking to avert hunger, BK is good for that.</p>
<p>If it was my choice or my son’s, I’d say that the extra 36K for a future engineer would be a great value. But I’d want him to come out of UVA with more than an engineering degree; I’d want him to have begun to develop a sense of what the well-rounded life is like and insight into what it takes to pursue a life of fulfillment both at and beyond the workplace.</p>
<p>Do your parents earn enough to comfortably pay back that debt before they retire? that would be a huge concern to me.</p>
<p>I don’t agree with gadad at all. UVa isn’t known to be an outstanding engineering school, and it won’t get you a higher salary. My H hires engineers all the time. He starts them all at $60k no matter where they graduated from. So, who do you think is better off…the engineer that he hires from UA-Huntsville with little/no debt or Georgia Tech with big debt? I think the one who can now start saving to buy a home is better off than the one who is struggling to pay rent while paying big student loans (and will have that big burden for 10 long years - til he’s in his 30’s).</p>
<p>If GMU is located in an area that is close to companies that hires engineers (and possibly has co-op opportunities), then that would be the better choice.</p>
<p>I do agree with Gadad. Leaving UVa (which you really like) and moving to GMU to be a commuter will be vastly different experiences. You will make good money out of UVa. Son who graduated in May was offered well above the 60,000 dollar figure that mom2collegekids mentions. UVa gets lots of top recruiters because the companies appreciate the kind of education a UVa engineer gets. The debt is something only you and your parents can decide about. If you did not like UVa, the decision would be clearer. GMU is an up and coming school and there is nothing wrong with it. Commuting and going there instead would just be a very different college experience than what you already have.</p>
<p>I agree that commuting is a very different experience. A commuter must make an effort to spend a lot of non-class time on campus to feel connected to the U. </p>
<p>As for the $60k salary. It’s irrelevant that someone from UVa was hired for more than $60k for a job in a DIFFERENT CITY. If my husband’s company were in Virginia or some other state/area with a high cost of living, it would pay a higher starting salary. The point was that in our city, a $60k starting salary is very good (low cost of living here), AND a person wouldn’t get more if they graduated from UVa (or GT as in my example). You have to compare apples with apples. </p>
<p>But, the point remains that there will be a difference between being a resident student at UVa and a commuter at GMU. You will have to decide how you’d manage that. Some commuters like to spend a lot of “non-class” time on campus - in the library or participating in clubs - to help give them more of a campus experience.</p>
<p>Even if the salaries may be comparable between schools, hiring opportunities sometimes are not. UVa and Virginia Tech have very strong alumni networks . My husband is also in a position to hire engineers(he went to neither of these schools) and he has remarked that hiring guys who went to these schools tend to give a resume a closer look if the candidate went to their alma mater. Doesn’t mean someone from another school doesn’t get hired, just that UVa or VT grad may get a closer look. I’m sure that is true in all states where alumni networks are stong. Some consulting firms primarily only recruit at top tier schools like UVa. And yes, UVa is not ranked super high for engineering but it is a well respected program because it is solid and many UVa grads can bring other qualities to the table (like intelligence,leadership,well roundedness, social skills,etc).</p>