Transferred to Miami University for Electrical Engineering, but having second thoughts...

College Majors Engineering Majors
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<p>I'm an undergrad who transferred from the University of Washington (in Seattle) to Miami University in Oxford, Ohio for electrical engineering, and haven't started there yet. I chose Miami for its overall academic standing, nice location (college town not far from major city), beautiful campus, smaller school size (compared to other schools I got into), and because I wanted to try living in a different part of the country (I'm from the Pacific Northwest; I also lived in California when I was little). I assumed, based on the U.S. News Rankings and Miami's overall reputation, that it should also be a good place to study engineering.</p>

<p>However, I realized that Miami University is not as well-known for engineering (in the Great Lakes Region) after reading several posts here and a blog or two elsewhere. I also may have misjudged how good the schools in the "Engineering - No Doctorate" list are on the U.S. News college rankings. Not to say these schools are bad in engineering, but I'm starting to realize they may not stack up as well against some of the other engineering schools I got into (Arizona State U., University of Massachusetts, and University of Connecticut), which are in the main "Engineering with Doctorate" list.</p>

<p>Unfortunately, I already signed a 1-year lease on an apartment in Oxford and met with my adviser, so it's almost certainly too late to reasonably change my mind for this upcoming year. But, I'll be going to school for about 2 or 2.5 more years, and I'm wondering if it's worth transferring again after this first year to another (relatively) nearby public university, such as University of Cincinnati. It's hard for me to judge whether Miami's engineering school is mediocre enough to justify the hassle and expense of transferring again (although, it might be worth it if I find a school with significantly lower out-of-state tuition), or if it's decent enough to stay there until I get my Bachelor's degree. What are your thoughts?</p>

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<p>Since you’re there for a year, you might as well hold off on making a decision until you’ve gone through a semester (or quarter?) or two.</p>

<p>I can’t say Miami of Ohio is well known for engineering, at least out here in California. It’s ABET accredited, so it should be fine. Cincinnati’s engineering school has a good reputation.</p>

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<p>People break apartment leases all of the time when their circumstances change. In a college town like Oxford I am sure that it is not unheard of, and perhaps landlords in Oxford are flexible, knowing that they can readily find another tenant. A frank conversation with your landlord may reveal this.</p>

<p>Since you’re in Oxford, drive over to their rival, Ohio University in Athens, and check out the Russ School of Engineering. Perhaps Russ has what you’re looking for.</p>

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<p>Why did you transfer in the first place? What are your career goals?</p>

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<p>Pay no attention to the doctorate/no doctorate USNWR rankings. In general reputations, the bulk of the USNWR methodology, are made by graduate programs and have little to do with the quality of the undergraduate teaching. </p>

<p>This is much more difficult to tease out and not as simple as saying number 20 with PhD is better than number 15 with PhD or that number 50 with PhD is the same as number 2 without PhD. There just are no equivalencies, but rather very broad generalities. There’s no factor to adjust so that you can compare the ranking of a school with PhD programs to a school without. If a school has doctoral programs it MAY translate down as a benefit to UGs or it might not. Same with no PhD. It might mean all the focus is on UGs or it could be that they are just under resourced. There’s no easy way to know without digging deeper into every program.</p>

<p>Why did you leave “U Dub”? </p>

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<p>The OP may have chosen to transfer because he/she was an unsuccessful applicant to the Washington Electrical Engineering Department. UW College of Engineering admission is separate from university admission and is competitive, so moving on to another university for a seat in undergraduate engineering is a legitimate move. UW states that satisfactory completion of the university preliminary (i.e. Freshman) course work is no guarantee of admission to the College of Engineering.</p>

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<p>I was wondering if that might not be the case. That’s why I never recommend students apply to UW for engineering (especially if they aren’t from Washington). The significance of the risk is too high.</p>

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<p>By the way Waveguide, is there anything other than perceived ranking that you find objectionable about Miami Electrical Engineering? A quick look at the faculty CV reveals that professors in the department earned their PhDs from excellent departments at Penn State, Texas-Austin, U Rochester, Purdue and…the U of WASHINGTON!! A very good line-up of universities, indeed.</p>

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<p>I completely agree with @eyemgh, the USNWR rankings are worth exactly what you pay for them and if you are in an ABET accredited program you will get a fine engineering education. The Doctorate, no Doctorate issue is also a red herring. You are getting an undergraduate degree, not at Ph.D. and all universities now have undergraduate research opportunities. As for being well-known on the West Coast, well I am sure you can find Miami alums there as well as all over the country but most universities have the bulk of their recruitment for first jobs coming from regional companies. The next job won’t depend on where you got your degree but your experience.</p>

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<p>Indeed, the reason I started to think about transferring was that I couldn’t get into UW’s electrical engineering program. I’ve lived in Washington state for 9 years, and went to UW because it was an unbeatable deal with in-state tuition. At the beginning of college, I was directly accepted as a chemical engineering major, but later I realized chemical engineering wasn’t for me. After I took a few introductory EE classes, I decided that I really liked it, and applied. However, my GPA (3.0) was about 0.2 or 0.3 grade points below being competitive enough, according to an adviser I talked to later. By that time, I had fulfilled all of my general education requirements and engineering prerequisites, and had also maxed out the limit of quarters I could be on “pre-engineering” status. The only way I could stay at UW was to switch to an open major, but that would mean taking classes for something I wasn’t committed to, and I couldn’t justify paying for that. Besides, I would have only been able to apply a few more times for EE since I had so many credits already, and would have breached UW’s credit limits if I got into EE there too late. </p>

<p>I did look at GIS (Geographic Information Systems) as an open-major alternative at UW, but the combination of my affinity for electrical engineering, and my desire to go someplace new, led me to turn down that option. Also, EE seems to have a much more diverse array of applications and possibilities than GIS.</p>

<p>My tentative career goals are to obtain at least a Bachelor’s in EE, and work in the sub-field of either RF and wireless communications (especially where large communications infrastructure is concerned), or power engineering (which also pertains to large infrastructure). Embedded systems, which mostly seems to consist of programming microcontrollers and the like, may be a good backup option if neither of the first two have enough jobs, since there are lots of programming jobs out there. I’m definitely planning on working a few years before going to Grad. School, if I decide to go there at all. I’ll cross that bridge when/if I come to it.</p>

<p>As for my doubts about Miami U., they don’t originate from the U.S. News Rankings. The U.S. News Rankings actually contributed to me considering Miami in the first place, since it’s ranked at about the same level as Portland University and Seattle University in engineering, which are both considered good schools here in the Northwest.</p>

<p>My doubts about Miami U. originated from the fact that, in every forum or blog I’ve looked at on the internet so far, people seem to think that Miami is only so-so in engineering. Only one person on a forum here disagreed, but they offered no explanation. If going to Miami makes it significantly harder to get an engineering job than if I had gone somewhere else where I was accepted, then it’s a waste. But, I don’t know that for sure since many of the people talking about engineering at Miami seem to only be comparing it to other schools in that region, not the rest of the country. Since the Great Lakes region seems to have a higher concentration of top-shelf engineering schools than places like the Southwest or Pacific Northwest, people commenting on Miami U. might have higher standards for engineering schools than I do.</p>

<p>I actually don’t live in Oxford yet; I signed the lease in advance because I found a great deal. I felt that my decision was effectively finalized after flying there to meet with my engineering adviser, discuss my transfer evaluation, and get the hold removed on my class registration (so I could register before orientation on August 20). I think it will be very difficult, if not impossible, to forfeit the lease without paying much or all of it. My landlady works for a large property management company, so that could make her/them harder to negotiate with. Subletting might be an option, but it also may be difficult or impossible without paying a large penalty. I think my lease doesn’t say anything about subletting. I might get it out and check sometime tomorrow or this weekend.</p>

<p>It was only after I got back that I started trying to find out more detailed information about Miami’s standing in engineering, since U.S. News only gave me a vague picture, and only compared it to programs at other no-doctorate engineering schools.</p>

<p>Thank you all for the commentary you’ve provided so far - it’s helped me put things in perspective a little better. Sorry to write a book.</p>

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<p>@eyemgh: Miami University is in the no-doctorate list because they explicitly and deliberately focus on undergraduates. They even say so in the on-hold messages during telephone calls at their admissions office. I’ve seen nothing to suggest they have funding problems, although I haven’t seen a whole lot yet aside from the campus (which is gorgeous).</p>

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<p>@Waveguide‌, I have had an extremely positive experience with a small ABET engineering school that focuses on undergraduate students. Schools such as this really put the emphasis on the student learning and understanding, as a choice. I never had a TA for class or even lab class. TAs assisted the lab professor only in setting up the lab…Never in teaching or grading. We could walk into any teacher’s office, mostly without appointments, and get help with questions or problem sets. They were available and accessible, and very happy to help. Every teacher really did know everyone in our class by name.</p>

<p>This UG focus is a philosophy of which your school sounds very proud, if it is on its on-hold phone message. Although I’m not familiar with this geographic region, nor this school in particular, if that is its philosophy on which Miami U.'s EE department prides itself, then I would think you would get a super education and an thorough understanding of your subjects. As they mention upthread, it is ABET accredited, which is important.</p>

<p>Each school has its own style. They may have made a conscious effort to cultivate the UG education and not focus on a PhD program. It may not be because they can’t have a PhD, but rather they may have chosen not to have one. Having a PhD program tends to make the “style” of a department more focused on research and publishing. Consider looking at the university’s or COE’s mission statement. I have not looked up your school’s, but it should provide a window into the school’s mindset or style.</p>

<p>If your own focus is on learning and knowing the material, then such an UG focus is a great environment. If you are concerned about finding a job after graduation, call the Career office today to find out which companies recruit from there. Also call the EE department and ask the same question. If you love the beautiful region, and there are local companies that hire from the school, maybe it is an option to consider one of these companies and stay in the area after graduation.</p>

<p>Going to school and working are not all about the “name” of the school, or the prestige. When you are working on projects you enjoy, and with a team of engineers you enjoy, does it really matter what the name is on your diploma?</p>

<p>You sound very motivated, based on your journey investigating many engineering disciplines, applying to and transferring to a new school. If you are happy with the advisor, the department, the beautiful campus and friendly school environment, then your being happy at the school combined with your self-motivation will garner you a great education.</p>

<p>The other 3 schools you mention are much larger. You also mention you liked the smaller school size of Miami.</p>

<p>I always tell my children to trust their instincts. You selected this school for many reasons. It is natural to get cold feet right before the semester begins, especially with a cross-country move. Maybe review why you liked it and why you made the decision to choose it. </p>

<p>Best of luck to you. </p>

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<p>I am not surprised to learn of your roadblocks at UWashington. UW has its share of superlative departments but as northwesterners know, the place is the definition of bureaucracy.</p>

<p>Take heed of the positive advice from Busyperson. You might discover that Miami is the best port in a storm for you, and a place that you might enjoy quite a bit. Best wishes.</p>

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<p>I know a man who was the manager of one of the most well known NASA projects of all time. When he found out that my son was interested in engineering he said, “I’ll let you in on a little secret. It doesn’t matter where he goes to school.” He went on to explain that he could hire engineers from anywhere in the world. He was also a professor at Cal Tech. He told me that there was no correlation between the institution and the quality of work the engineer did. What did correlate was curiosity, passion and drive. He even mentioned that some of the better papered grads had more problems because they didn’t think outside of the box as well. So, would I go to Miami? Absolutely. It almost made my son’s list and we’re from Oregon. It will make your first job a little tougher to land if you want to came back west simply because you’ll have to seek rather than recruiters coming to you. After you land that job though and do well, it won’t matter where you went. Good luck!</p>

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<p>@eyemgh: Thank you. Barring unforeseen events, I’ll probably stay at Miami all the way through graduation. Also, just so you know, you live in one of my favorite states. I lived in Oregon for 6 years, during grades 2-7.</p>

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<p>Try not to have preconceived notions of the school before you’ve even tried it, especially if those preconceived notions are based on USNWR rankings! </p>

<p>You should embrace the UG-focus of Miami as there are many benefits to going to a school dedicated to undergraduates.</p>

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For a “busy person” this is certainly a thoughtful response :slight_smile:

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" “Engineering - No Doctorate” list" - There are some terrific schools on that list. DS is a senior at one of them (admittedly near the top of the list), and I’ve been impressed by his job opportunities.

I attended a STEM school (ABET accredited) that was at the time mostly undergrad. No regrets. I had a terrific education.

My advise for anybody considering engineering schools is to look at the job placement info, for co-ops as well as post-grad hiring. Good luck!