<p>I’m pretty sure mine was on short notice as well :). good luck!</p>
<p>
Sounds like time to start using those lawyerly negotiating skills and try to get 'em to show you the money if the love is still mutual after her remaining visits. 
I don’t know about CalArts per se, but some of the others will come off with a bit more than they first offer if it looks like they’re going to lose a valued prospective student because of it. Definitely worth a try.<br>
Wow … Have they really gone up that much?! There was around a $12,000 per year difference in ‘sticker price’ last time I looked in detail, but that was over three years ago. </p>
<p>That’s funny about the car … One of the Machiavellian carrots my Mom dangled before my big bro and I growing up was that we’d get cars if we got full scholarships to college. I never thought it was fair since my brother was always obviously going to get a full athletic scholarship barring serious injury … So, I made my 'A’s, blew up the tests, got my little Honda-car and … transferred! That sibling rivalry bought some mad ‘special skills’ for my resume, too. I guess all those ‘moral victories’ were good for something … ;)</p>
<p>Well, I work full time, as does my hubby, so in this neighborhood (no mass transportation) we need the kids to drive and have their own vehicles or we will be driving them all over!</p>
<p>ChrissyBlu - I have to laugh, my d is going back east so her cute little silver Prius will be sitting in our garage waiting for her to come home at Christmas and Summer. You have one car too few, and us one car too many. She does love her hybrid so I can understand your desire to get one for your younger d.</p>
<p>ChrissyBlu,
My D and I will be at UCLA on the 17th. She has made UCLA her final choice. We’re coming down from San Francisco.</p>
<p>Hi. This is ChrissyBlu’s D.<br>
I am so confused now. CalArts costs so much money. I really like the program and I hear it is very highly ranked in the performing arts world. I just can’t get my head around the cost. What if I am a starving actor and I need my parents to help me out financially when I’m younger? What if I want to get an MFA because things aren’t working out - my parents said they would pay for part of it - but CalArts might clean us out. Besides I’m concerned about the academic aspect of it as well. It doesn’t look as prestigious as UCLA involving a person not aware of the business. And my dad went to UCLA so there is that subtle pressure going on there - I mean he is not doing it blatantly. I can just tell he would be so proud of me if I went there. But I know very little about UCLA’s drama program. Nobody seems to talk about it with me. All they talk about is CalArts. Does that make it better? Does it have a better network? At least I know if I went there I would be taken care of by two professors. But I am so confused! I guess what I am asking here - if anybody knows - which school has more artistic resume weight? I know UCLA clearly trumps on academic resume weight. But what about artistic resume weight. And if anybody knows about networks that would be great. Thanks.
Hope my mom doesn’t get mad because I hacked on her account.</p>
<p>^ You need to get back in touch with the head of acting at CalArts and tell her what you’ve told us here to see if they might be able to sweeten your financial deal a bit if they’re what you really want. You still have time and can wait until the last day of the month to declare if need be. Be like a sports ‘hold-out.’ </p>
<p>Don’t worry so much about resume weight. Nobody will care about that two years after you’ve graduated. Where do you feel the most connection? Where do you feel most at home? Where do you feel like you’ll grow the most as an artist? That’s the stuff that counts most. Obviously, finances have to be a major part of the decision, but seriously look into whether or not a negotiable balance can be struck. Have you gone back and visited UCLA and talked to any current students, yet?</p>
<p>Thank you! Well, I went to Cal Arts and felt really taken care of. The last time I went to UCLA I wasn’t sure I felt the same - but their audition was largely a cattle call, like Juilliard’s audition. Except there were a lot of people and they put numbers on you. I didn’t really like that much. But I saw a video on UCLA this morning and I got really excited about the program. I also think the price is better. However they don’t have a senior showcase and an abroad program. But, the senior showcase is no guarantee for an agent and the year abroad at CalArts you have to be chosen. So it all may not matter anyway. So far, I feel I will grow a lot at CalArts because they do a lot of movement work. I need to work on that. I am very intimidated by it though. But my mom thinks I should go to a school I feel intimidated by. I like how UCLA is in the middle of things and their facilities are better. CalArts has similar facilities to Juilliard - they’re not amazingly great. But the education is obviously fantastic. I don’t know if they do a lot of musical theater there. I didn’t know you could negociate with the colleges financially. We don’t qualify for FAFSA and they haven’t offered me scholarships. How should I go about doing that? I keep waffling back and fourth. I just know wherever I go I will say “God I should have gone to (the other one)”. Oh and UCLA’s alumni list has a lot of younger more curent alumni and their actor list is longer. So I was excited about that. I really don’t know much about them. Thanks.</p>
<p>Hi CB’s daughter! Have you narrowed your decision down to the two California programs? If you’ve eliminated the other choices you have at least made a good start on your final pick. </p>
<p>I don’t have any words of wisdom, just good wishes for you during this decision-making process and best of luck in the program you choose. My son is a junior and just getting started thinking about monologues, songs, etc… it is an exciting time but I can see how it would be uber stressful!</p>
<p>You’ll definitely get a lot of movement work at any of the conservatory programs. Seems like I’m always a little sore, but I’ve learned to like it. Tadashi Suzuki has kicked my ass in oh so many ways … and I started life as a freakin’ gymnast! LOL I think they do that at CalArts … But don’t be intimidated … Your body will tell you SO many amazing things about your roles if you learn to listen … </p>
<p>As far as MT, I don’t think CalArts does musicals per se, but given their forward-looking vision, I believe they incorporate a lot of singing and dance into their work. I know very little about UCLA, but I believe they have a full-blown MT major. The head of MT was co-author of Making it on Broadway and you’ll need to see what the real opportunities an Acting major would have to participate in those shows if that’s what you’re into. A.S.K. ;)</p>
<p>I don’t know that you can “negotiate” so much as to let them know what your situation is and sometimes they’ll make moves to help you out a bit. Again, that’s more from my knowledge of some other schools that aren’t part of this discussion, but it’s definitely worth a try. Get your parents to coach you up a bit on how to approach it. There was a kid on the MT forum last year who was accepted to the MT program at UMich - like HUGE scholarship offers from some other schools - who had some of the same issues and he came out of it with a better deal than he had at first. The key is communication.</p>
<p>Okay. I will see if I can do that. My mom doesn’t seem too jazzed on the idea - I don’t think she thinks it will work out that well. If it doesn’t work out, would I look bad? Sorry if that is not that great of a question. We’re just a little nervous. I heard today that UCLA’s program specializes more in film acting and CalArts specializes more in theater acting. I do want to break into film because I know that is where the money tends to roll in - so they say. I am very excited to check out UCLA. I hope it’s a hybrid of CalArts and CCM. I really liked how down to earth everybody was at CCM and I really liked the facilities I really liked how much work gets done at CalArts and how helpful and talented the faculty is. The individualized attention you get there looks amazing. It is very avante garde and I am excited about that but I am also still a little unsure. I know I would grow a lot as an artist there. My drama teacher says I shouldn’t worry about resume weight and alumni networks and I should worry about where I feel the most at home. I think both schools are very good… and both have their definite minuses and pluses. Decisions suck.</p>
<p>Thanks for being so helpful! Skipsmom you are so nice! And fishbowl freshman you have some wonderful words of wisdom!
(By the way . . . what do you think about the whole BFA /BA thing? I have heard so many things. Some people say BFAs are better, some say BAs are better, some say it doesn’t matter, some say the school is what matters, some say BFAs are better if you want to get your masters and if you get a BA it could hurt you when you try to get your masters, the list goes on. I have heard at least 7 different answers as of today.)
Cal Arts is very conservatory like. And it is a perfect BFA program.
UCLA appears to be a BFA-like program under the guise of a BA. It seems conservatory like after freshman year.
But I don’t know.</p>
<p>Chrissyblu’s D,
I don’t think it would look bad. I think they’ll understand and respect that cost has to be a factor. If anything, it would show that you’re thinking down the road and looking out for yourself which could be considered nothing but a plus by any reasonable person who isn’t blind to the realities of the biz. You just need to be diplomatic in your approach. As for theatre vs. film, I personally believe that the best film actors come from an intensive theatre conservatory background although I have to admit that most of the ones I’m nuts over got their training in the UK. But, hey … “The Hoff” went to CalArts! How can you argue with the freakin’ Hoff?! … unless you’re Chuck Norris … ;)</p>
<p>As for the BA vs. BFA question, there are as many schools of thought on that as there are actors. There is a big mix in the middle between the less intensive BFAs and the more intensive BAs training-wise. There are BAs that actually offer more training than some BFAs and while I’m not particularly familiar with UCLA, I would assume them to be one of those. It’s actually a problem in US training that there really is no standard for what does and does not constitute “professional training.” I was actually talking to your mom awhile back when I posted a psuedo rant in the second half of a post that pretty much summarized my view on the issue … <a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/1060537497-post19.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/1060537497-post19.html</a> I can’t say for sure, but I would think the UCLA BA would be more akin to a “liberal arts college/university BFA.” It’s not really a matter of which is better. It’s a matter of what’s best for YOU. (As a side, where I’m from, screen acting is considered “commercial” although there’s a difference in that terminology in the actual industry.)</p>
<p>I definitely understand about these decisions sucking … Just so you won’t feel alone, here’s where I was at three years ago … <a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/musical-theater-major/173731-decisions-decisions.html?highlight=decisions[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/musical-theater-major/173731-decisions-decisions.html?highlight=decisions</a> Just looking back, there are some good arguments offered by Kellster for the BA/MFA although those obviously come from the heads of some MFA programs with that bias reflected. Actually, I didn’t go to any of those three schools since another I had written off as too expensive upped the financial ante in the eleventh hour. The previous year, I dove headlong at a school that offered me a full academic scholarship without even finding out the results from all my auditions. Big mistake … Had I not done that and looked for a balance in expense vs. efficacy, I would be graduating from NCSA this year … </p>
<p>Maybe that’ll help you out some? I’m always a little apprehensive to post on these decisions threads because I’m always afraid of saying something that will hurt more than help. I guess the best I can do is offer some things from my own experience to think about because I would in no way try to answer your questions for you. I don’t have a horse in the race and just want you to come out with what will make you happiest in the long run.</p>
<p>Chrissy…I know there are various opinions. And when it comes right down to which program, which degree or which school what really matters in the end is how you audition for the part. They really don’t care what is on your resume as to those things just that what they see is what they want. But I thought this reply to the BA v BFA question was one of the most complete and thoughtful…</p>
<p>[Acting</a> in Plays, Singing: b.a ?bfa?, mfa programs, bachelors of arts](<a href=“http://en.allexperts.com/q/Acting-Plays-Singing-695/2008/11/b-bfa.htm]Acting”>http://en.allexperts.com/q/Acting-Plays-Singing-695/2008/11/b-bfa.htm)</p>
<p>^^^While that link is a good explanation of the differences between a BA and a BFA…</p>
<p>To my knowledge, UCLA’s BA program is considered very similar to many BFA programs in terms of its training. That’s not true of most BA programs but I would agree with chrissyblu’s assessment that UCLA is “BFA-like under the guise of a BA.” It also has the audition to get in as well.</p>
<p>The difference in chrissy’s D’s choices considering they are UCLA and CalArts is not quite as much the usual BA vs. BFA dilemma considering that UCLA is “BFA-like”, but a big difference is that one is a stand alone conservatory and one offers BFA-like training within a university.</p>
<p>I agree with Hoosiermom that when getting cast, it will come down to the audition and not what is on the resume. However, the experiences you glean to have those things on the resume will make a difference in how well you are trained and prepared for the auditions. In that vein, a BFA program (or UCLA’s BA program which is similar to a BFA) involves much more training than a BA program. You can be cast coming out of a BA program too. But looking at the training and preparation is important more so than what is written on paper on the resume.</p>
<p>I’m not familiar with UCLA’s program. Does it not include academics then?</p>
<p>Yes, it includes academics but so do most BFA programs.</p>
<p>We are also embroiled in the BA vs BFA debate at our house. My D has narrowed her choices down to a BFA and a BA program – and is leaning strongly toward the BFA, mainly just because it is a BFA I think. The curriculums are very similar (the BFA program has a good liberal arts component). She feels that both are a really good fit (thus, the debate). The BA program may actually offer more opportunities. But she has her heart set on a BFA. In her mind, it is what she has been working for and seems to legitimize or validate that work/her talent. It would be good if they could look past that and judge the program fit by the program rather than the degree, but the degree may ultimately be that elusive tie-breaker.</p>
<p>HoosierMom: This is ChrissyBlu (not ChrissyBlu’s D.) That article that you linked is the best one I have read on the difference between a BA in Theatre/Acting, a BFA in Acting and an MFA. I printed it out for my D. I actually think it points in favor of a program like UCLA’s BA program, which is a very good BA AND conservatory training for the actor. As fishbowlfreshman pointed out, in her link, if you want to get an MFA, you should probably consider a BA, then an MFA, which is considered the “terminal degree.” My husband knows an actor who did a BFA, worked many years (he was a soap star) and then, when he got tired of the life, found he had to go back to school because his BFA didn’t have enough general ed so he could get his MBA. It set him back quite a bit. The article you pointed to alludes to this problem. What a helpful piece of information. </p>
<p>IMHelpful… I encourage you to read it and share it with your D.</p>