A few months ago I did my UC and CSU applications. I applied to San Diego State, San Francisco State, UC Irvine, UC Santa Barbara, UC Riverside (pretty much a safety), and UC San Diego. I don’t think I’ll like UC San Diego at all from what I’ve heard - all work, no play and a cutthroat environment just isn’t for me, and I don’t think I’ll like the other schools as much as I’d have loved UCLA, but my dad pushed me to apply to UCSD even though I don’t really like it that much because their medical program is apparently really good, but UCLA’s is good too and I know I really should have applied. I looked up the virtual campus tour for UCLA the other day and cried. I looked into USC because it’s in Los Angeles too, but I don’t feel as connected to the school, if that makes any sense - mostly because it’s in a terrible neighborhood from what I’ve heard. The only school that sounds somewhat appealing to me is UCSB, but it’s not in Los Angeles (obviously because “Santa Barbara” lol) and it’s a pretty long drive away. So I got to thinking - UCLA accepts a lot of community college transfers, right? So should I just go to community college for two years, apply to UCLA and hope for the best, or just go ahead and go to UCSB or USC?
And for those who will probably ask - the reason I couldn’t just “add” UCLA to the list of my applied schools was because I only got four fee waivers, and when I told my dad the price of an extra application is $70 he was just like “no”.
UCLA will be just as “cutthroat” as UCSD especially if you are leaning towards Medical school. I would not make any decisions until you have some acceptances under your belt. If you are unhappy with your choices in the Spring, community college is always an acceptable option. Also do not disregard any of the Cal States or UCR (they do have a Medical school now) for pursuing your interests. If Medical school is your ultimate goal, it will not matter where you go for undergrad. You want to maintain a high GPA, have access to medically related EC’s and do well on the MCAT. You can make it happen at any of these colleges.
How did either you or your dad come to this conclusion?
Premeds at a UC take the same classes for med school as they do at any other college, except at a UC you’ll be in a class with 200-300 kids. Recs are crucial for med school admission but the only way the profs will get to know you is if you take the initiative to go to office hours. As for advising, at most UCs they don’t even have an advisor specializing in it and meeting regularly with med school adcoms to build up and understanding of what they want and build up an understanding by the med schools of what makes the college special. Instead they funnel you thru the career center; one minute they’re talking to you about med school, the next kid is wondering about law school or accounting. You want to see the advising at the “really good” UCSD? Go to http://career.ucsd.edu/undergrads/interest-areas/pre-med.html and there it is. It gets better: they “encourage” younger students to meet with a Career Peer Educator; in other words, some kid that’s a junior or senior at the college. How is all of this “really good”?
Some UC and CSU schools have programs set up where you can get volunteer experience in health care. It’s worth looking for these since this experience is an unofficial requirement to get into med school.
The real question to address at this point is not what college, but why an M.D? Have you looked into the medical field and considered the alternatives before you committed to a 11-15 year path? Its almost a reflex action among HS kids, they think of a career in medicine and its “I’m pre-med!” Doctors are far from the only ones in the health field that help people. Physical therapists, radiology techs, nurses, speech pathologists, physician assistants, to name but just a few. Spend a few hours browsing on http://explorehealthcareers.org Unless you’ve considered the alternatives and have spent time actually working in a health care setting (which is an unofficial requirement to get into med school, BTW) its better to think of yourself as interested in exploring a career as a doctor rather than someone who has already made the decision.
If going 100 miles or so from home is too much change for you, you might want to reflect on what it is that in 4 years will allow you to enter a profession where the decisions you make can literally kill people.
Don’t discount UC Riverside which, as someone mentioned above, now has the newest med school in the UC system.
They also have a unique program called Fast-Start, which is a 5-week program for college Freshman; advising them early on how to traverse all of the ins-and-outs of medical school and science-related fields. https://medschool.ucr.edu/pipeline_programs.html
Most other UC’s, including UCLA, will not have these types of early mentoring or identification programs.
Wait to see where you get in and then do some visits prior to deciding which path to take. See which schools (for both the UC and CSU choices) have the most inclusive pre-med advising and find out about their medical school admit rates. Note too, that some medical schools require you to take certain science pre-req’s at your four-year school (not at your two-year CC), which could impact your ability to graduate in four years.
While there are certainly financial advantages to the CC>UC transfer, the downside to transferring may be that you can’t get into the courses you need (often a problem at places like SMCC, which have a high percentage of UCLA transfer admissions) and it may take you longer than two years to qualify for transfer. Because of the narrow window for UC applications, this can often mean an additional one to two years added to your undergrad time frame.
Again, wait and see where you get in and be open to the opportunities on offer, remembering that a bird in the hand is worth, well… you know.
Bottom line is that while you may have had some regrets after seeing UCLA via their web site, there are other schools that you may get that same positive feelings from when you see them in person, which is much more important.
@mikemac Honestly most of what I “know” about the programs at UCSD are based on hearsay. A lot of people have told me that the engineering and premed programs at UCSD are top notch. Your take was really helpful though. I wasn’t too crazy about the school to begin with but the situations you mentioned don’t sound ideal. Both of my parents are in the medical field - my mom is a registered nurse working towards being a nurse practictioner, and based on sheer observation, being a nurse just isn’t for me. I’m more interested in diagnosing diseases and helping people upfront. Funnily enough, I’ve previously looked into all the of the careers you listed and none of them is for me. A physician’s assistant? Honestly I was considering this at one point, but I realized I’m not one that likes to play second fiddle to someone else. And my mom, being a nurse for 20 years explained to me how hospital politics work, and physician assistants aren’t viewed too favorably, and a lot of people in the hospital workplace discount their opinion because they’re not a “real doctor”. I don’t see the point in going to school only to play second fiddle and have people not value my opinion when I finally start working. Techs get paid pretty much nothing and are generally not really respected. Being a speech pathologist just wouldn’t satisfy me and I’m certain I would hate my job and life if I had that job. I read the job description and it’s just not for me. If you really want me to be specific, I want to be a dermatologist - great hours, great pay, and I’m actually geniunely interested in being one and helping people. I had to research all this a few months ago. Lol I was worried about distance from Los Angeles because I really like the West Hollywood area and knew I wanted to be able to go there while I’m in college during weekends or something. I also intend to work in that area when I get older. I know UCLA is ridiculously close to West Hollywood and I thought it would be fun to get familiar with that area. Even if it was for another reason, I don’t see the correlation between wanting to be near or in a certain area and not being able to handle a medical profession lol. Thanks though.
@Gumbymom Thank you. I was under the impression that UCLA wouldn’t be such a cutthroat environment. Cutthroat environments just aren’t my cup of tea. I guess I’ll just have to find another dream school. I’ll try to investigate UC Riverside and San Diego State more
:-<
@hop Thank you. That’s actually really helpful advice. I don’t think I can do the community college option if I’ll have to graduate later lol. The path to becoming a doctor is long enough. I’ll try to do more campus tours Thank you so much!
I thought you were saying you weren’t ready to be away from home.
There is a good premed guide at https://www.rhodes.edu/sites/default/files/PreMed_Essentials.pdf. There is another good handbook at https://www.amherst.edu/campuslife/careers/gradstudy/health/guide and no doubt many other websites, as well as books. It’s worth reading so you have an understanding up-front of what you should be doing. Then you can go find the people to answer your specific questions once at the large U although for the most part its on your shoulders to provide the general direction towards med school.
Understand, too, the work it takes to succeed. Most good students in math & science courses are spending 6-10 hours per week outside of class for each of these classes. Doing homework, reading the chapter, doing extra practice problems. And this doesn’t count time writing up labs. It isn’t that you can’t have fun, its just that you’ll have less free time than your friends in the humanities and when push comes to shove you have to decide whether to pass up time with your friends to go spend a few hours in the library.
If UCSD’s “all work no play” environment is too much for you, are you sure medical school is where you want to go? That’s 4 years of that same environment, then 4, 5, 6, 7 etc. years residency with that same environment, and then a profession where your schedule is not your own if you work in a hospital, and difficult to start off if you try to open an independent practice (and having to deal with many complicated federal regulations abt. electronic records and whatnot)…
@angelsweetz: I know a few Pre-Med students at UCI/UCD/UCSD/UCLA (friends of my son’s) and they all say the same thing, that Pre-Med at many of the UC’s campuses is pretty cutthroat especially the Freshman/Sophomore Pre-req courses (weeder courses). As mentioned above in several other posts, if you cannot handle a “cutthroat” environment, Medicine may not be a good option for you.
@hop gives a lot of good advice. My youngest son’s roommate is Biology/Pre-med at SDSU and is very happy with the pre-professional advising and the SDSU alumni networking that has helped him land some good volunteer and research opportunities. Definitely look in to the programs mentioned by @hop and do some further research.
UCSD/UCLA/UCB/UCSB etc… are excellent schools academically, but you need to find a school that is a “fit” for you. Good Luck.
Pre-med in general is a “weeding” process, since the number of medical school spaces is limited. Only about half of those who apply to MD medical school in the US get even one admission, and many pre-meds do not even apply after realizing that their GPA and/or MCAT are too low to have any chance of admission.
Just to clarify for EVERYONE, lol, I want to have a good college experience and I don’t feel like I can have any sort of fun in a cutthroat environment where people are trying sabotage me and I’m not able to take any breaks or I’ll fail the class. No. I can’t do that for my college years. Medical school I have no issue with. It’s not that I can’t “handle” that environment, persay, but I’d rather not look back on my college years and while other people reminisce on parties I’ll be reminiscing about the time I pulled 7 all-nighters in a row to pass a biology test. I understand that I will have to work hard and study no matter where I go, and I’m capable of doing that, but I’d rather have some breathing room my undergraduate years.
@“mohammad wong” I just don’t want that environment during my undergraduate years because I want to have something of a good college experience, especially considering my high school were definitely NOT “the best years of my life”, or at least I hope they’re not. It’s not that I can’t “handle” that environment, but I’d rather avoid it my undergrad years.
@Gumbymom I’m literally just gonna copy and paste my last post in response to your advice about the cutthroat thing. “I just don’t want that environment during my undergraduate years because I want to have something of a good college experience, especially considering my high school were definitely NOT “the best years of my life”, or at least I hope they’re not. It’s not that I can’t “handle” that environment, but I’d rather avoid it my undergrad years.” SDSU? I was told that going to a CSU minimizes your chances of going to med school. Is that not true?
I know several students that have gone from a CSU to Medical school and my son’s current roommate doesn’t seem to think it is an issue by attend SDSU. If the school has the available resources including Reseach/Internships etc… available to you as a Pre-med student and you can get a competitive GPA along with a high MCAT score, what difference will it make where you did your Undergrad. I am sure there are many posters that will say the contrary, but if you are a motivated individual, I am sure you can accomplish anything you set out to do.
@ucbalumnus I’ve seen a lot of people who have gone to med school say it’s more beneficial to go to a “lower-ranked” school because apparently it’s easier to get a higher GPA and you have a better chance of being accepted to med school because med schools value GPA more than school name. Would you agree with that sentiment?
So now we’re getting off the main part of the post, but if you ever do an all-nighter you’re doing something wrong!!
The point of college classes is to understand and apply. There is some memorization involved, to be sure, esp. in a class like organic chemistry. But cramming only puts info into short-term memory and its not hard in a math or science class to ask questions that require you to understand and apply instead of regurgitate. That’s why so many kids hate tests with word problems; you can’t just recognize them as being similar to a homework problem and apply what you can remember for at least partial credit.
The way to learn material is not by rereading or cramming, but by techniques like distributed practice and self-testing. There is a great book “Make it Stick” that talks about the science of learning, along with tips for HS and college students on how to put the science to work.
The stats may indeed show fewer CSU kids go, but the causes are not due to a poorer CSU education (if that even is true). For one thing its harder to get into a UC, esp. an upper-tier one, than a CSU. Better students coming out of HS tend to stay that way competing for med school, so thats part of the population statistic. There are also peer effects that come into play even for a bright kid attending a CSU. If enough of your friends are thinking of med school and know what to do in order to be a strong applicant (get to know profs, volunteer work, study habits leading to good grades) then its bound to rub off on you. If instead you’re trying to figure everything out on your own, and a lot of your friends are more interested in happy hour in Pacific Beach than an afternoon studying, that tends to have the opposite effect.
