<p>I really think it is up to the individual and the opportunities the different universities can offer the individual (if all majors were equal). For example, my older son was accepted to UF, FSU and USF. He went to USF because he is interested in working in sports and he was able to work in the athletic department with the football program (yes, due to connections) as a freshman and sophomore. I would think my younger son will be accepted to UF on Friday (his stats, GPA, etc is higher than his brother’s was) but has realized FSU is stronger for his major (Actuarial Science) than UF. Now, if he wanted to do engineering I would definitely have him go to UF. So, it really is an individual person’s choice, especially if the area of study does not favor one school over the other. Both schools are quality universities.</p>
<p>It may be hard to believe for us Floridians, but outside of the state of Florida, few people who are not directly involved in academia really distinguish between FSU and UF. In fact, most of the country regards Florida public education, in general, as a joke. This is not entirely fair, but that’s our reputation. in fact, if you are worried about the academic prestige of your school, you should be less worried about whether the name says “XYZ State” or “University of XYZ” or “University of [cardinal direction] XYZ” and be more worried about the fact that it says “Florida.” </p>
<p>I attend FSU and I can’t tell you how many times people have said “Oh, you mean the Gators?” whenever this comes up in conversation. According to non-Floridians, FSU is the Gators, coached by Bobby Bowden, and is where Tim Tebow once played. Again, outside of Florida, few people care to distinguish between the two.</p>
<p>Also, keep in mind that academic rankings can change over the years (as UF has discovered). Without checking USNWR, which is the higher ranked school? University of Arizona, or Arizona State? Ohio University or Ohio State? University of Louisiana (pick any one) or Louisiana State? Indiana University or Purdue? Answer: Unless you live in these states or attend this schools, or have a particular interest in a major that one of these schools excels (or is particularly crummy) at, who cares? Just go to a decent school that you feel happy at. As long as it’s a reputable school, don’t sweat it.</p>
<p>GOOOO florida state gators!!!</p>
<p>^LOL. (ugh!) ;)</p>
<p>Sweetheartc— a university member of the AAU is no “joke.” Too
many bubbas on this site. Just my .02 David</p>
<p>
I dispute this notion. For example, the current FSU vs UF US News ratings in political science, one of the most popular undergraduate majors at both universities, goes like this:
FSU: 39
UF: 49</p>
<p>We should note that for some years UF led FSU in the US News Political Science ratings, but the rating was essentially worthless, due in part to two actual academic studies concerning this particular academic discipline. One academic study by Simon Hix, at the London School of Economics, rated FSU at #26 in the world and UF at about #153. Another academic study looking at PhD placement set the FSU poli sci department again substantially higher than the UF department. Not to mention FSU is located in Tallahassee, the center of state political operation, which naturally lends an advantage to Florida State for this discipline in terms of internships.</p>
<p>However, in US News poli sci ratings in prior years UF led FSU due to what? Nothing but misplaced quality due to effective marketing by UF and I think the Flutie Effect of success of the UF sports teams in recent years.</p>
<p>How about the sciences? Like physics, for example? There is a perception UF leads FSU in the sciences like physics due to principally the same reasons as applied to political science. However, if you dig into the real performance we find FSU was awarded the only National Laboratory in Florida (The National High Magnetic Field Laboratory) and not UF. However, in US News UF somehow rates a #36 while FSU comes in at #48. Yet, FSU has been awarded more National Science Foundation money than any other university in Florida. If there is such a qualitative difference, why didn’t UF earn the right to host the mag lab? Why isn’t the rating reflective of the Federal Government’s investment in physics at Florida State?</p>
<p>I asked a hopeful student one time which would be the better university for meteorology, FSU or UF. The student confidently replied “UF”, to which I then mentioned that UF does not offer meteorology as a major. Clearly the student was basing their answer on a perception and not reality.</p>
<p>Another recent query focused on actuarial science. The perception was UF was the place for this mathematical major, due to supposed strength in the sciences. Except UF’s section for this is weak, at best, compared to offerings at Florida State.</p>
<p>What about medicine? UF has the oldest operating state med school, having started around 1958. It generates a lot of NIH research investment. Florida State’s med school started in 2000 and is just now at full capacity. Which builds a better MD, the primary reason a med school operates? FSU Med’s operating concept is intended to train MDs in academic settings and regular medical facilities, not just a single teaching hospital. FSU Med has already earned a visit from the CEO of the AAMC, something that UF took years to accomplish.</p>
<p>When it comes to these two flagship schools I strongly recommend a careful review of the topic you want to study and then visit the department. Speak to the faculty. Dig deeper than US News magazine ratings, which are still intended to generate magazine sales by stimulating artificial controversy.</p>
<p>usnews should not be what determines whether a school better or worse than another in a major. It should only be used if the schools are many ranks apart. Otherwise, a rank 55 and rank 56 school are practically identical. There’s just too many factors.</p>
<p>If FSU is ranked 39 and UF is ranked 49. What is 10 ranks less going to show? There’s no difference so FSU doesn’t necessarily beat UF and vice-versa. Now if we were talking many ranks ahead, i.e. engineering, UF places several ranks ahead of FSU.</p>
<p>Few would dispute that UF has the better engineering program. </p>
<p>USNews focuses heavily on things like 4/6 year graduation rates, class size, freshman retention, peer assessment and freshman profiles.</p>
<p>From what I can tell, UF edges FSU by a small amount in most of these items. Therefore, I think it’s reasonable to conclude that UF is slightly more competitive school. The tricky thing is that if you just look at the main USNews rankings (UF: 58/ FSU: 101) it gives the impression that UF is “twice as good” as FSU, when the reality is that UF just has a slight, but consistent edge in most categories.</p>
<p>The reality is that there are dozens of “good” state schools that are similar in quality, but there are so many schools that are so close together that even a slight difference can cause one to jump way ahead even though the practical difference is minimal.</p>
<p>My point here if you look at the breakdown of various indicators, there is not that much of a difference between FSU and UF. You should base your decision on personal circumstances, campus visits and the strength of individual majors, rather than things like the main USNews ranking or AAU membership (which based is largely on research spending and has little to do with the actual quality of the education).</p>
<p>“However, if you dig into the real performance we find FSU was awarded the only National Laboratory in Florida (The National High Magnetic Field Laboratory) and not UF”</p>
<p>While the program is headquarted at FSU, your statement does not recongnize that FSU is partnered with Los Alamos and UF in its programs. Indeed, UF was part of the original proposal team. Further, while FSU has an outstanding physics program, you will note that US News is not alone in ranking UF superior, as the r- and s-based NRC rankings also both favor UF.</p>
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<p>The only people who will agree with you are your fellow FSU people. That’s about it though.</p>
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<p>Please don’t confuse the delusioNoles with facts! 
UF is significantly better than FSU in all relevant metrics: research money (by a ridiculously large margin… actually, isn’t FSU 4th in the state in research???), average GPA/SAT/ACT scores, graduation rates, average salary per graduate, overall rankings, the vast majority of department rankings, etc. FSU only does better than UF in liberal arts stuff. Mind you, liberal arts is important, but it doesn’t bring home the bacon. Oh… and FSU has an AMAZING clown/circus college!!!</p>
<p>
More like a bit player. The MIT publications detailing the loss of the Bitter Mag Lab mention UF only as an add-on, much like MIT mentioned other schools Plus, FSU still kills UF in total NSF funding.</p>
<p>See: <a href=“http://tech.mit.edu/V110/N31/magnet.31n.html[/url]”>http://tech.mit.edu/V110/N31/magnet.31n.html</a></p>
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<p>Still reeling from the loss (sorry - losses) to FSU? ;)</p>
<p>Don’t be guilty of cherry-picking your facts p2n. FSU has a great physics program, but there are certainly valid references available that do not support your contention that is better than UF’s.</p>
<p>UF has a fine physics department - one of the best. However, there are those facts that support my point. Personally, I think they are very comparable, but FSU has the lion’s share of the only national lab in Florida and UF can claim a mention, but that’s it. Having the Mag Lab is huge. Diminishing this fact is silly. If FSU were to lose the Mag Lab the entire state would suffer. If UF’s physics department were so much superior then the Mag Lab would be at UF, not FSU. But that didn’t happen. [Jack</a> Crow](<a href=“http://www.sptimes.com/2004/09/04/State/Jack_Crow__who_landed.shtml]Jack”>http://www.sptimes.com/2004/09/04/State/Jack_Crow__who_landed.shtml) was an FSU faculty member, not a UF faculty member.
</p>
<p>Regarding cherry picking facts - you mean like UF claiming state agricultural funding for purposes of plumping their US News per-student funding rate, so that the UF per-student funding rate looks better than it actually is? Really. This is like FSU Med claiming the budget of every hospital, med facility, medical office, lab and so forth. Unfortunately, US News doesn’t support this model yet. However, when it does, FSU will greatly benefit from the many billion-dollar facilities and their manifold budgets in figuring US News per-student funding.</p>
<p>p2n, you are one that was that was claiming FSU has the better physics department. The cherry-picking comment came from your disregard of the US News and NRC rankings that contradict your claim. You and I are both laypeople in the world of physics, and it is disingenuous to ignore the accepted rankings of people that live in that world.</p>
<p>With all due respect Rogracer, as I know you are a legitimate poster here and a parent of a UF student I think FSU does have the better physics department than UF. Even if the difference may be regarded as narrow. The NRC rankings [url=<a href=“http://www.stat.tamu.edu/~jnewton/nrc_rankings/area33.html]here[/url”>NRC Rankings in Physics]here[/url</a>] hardly prove your point. US News rankings are, as virtually everyone but UF fans know, burdened by some limitations. The actual total NSF investment in FSU’s program alone proves the massive confidence the best academics have in FSU’s department. We should note that actual investment by itself connotes substantially more weight than mere rankings.</p>
<p>^Not sure why you say the “NRC rankings hardly prove my point”. My only claim was that UF’s physics program is ranked higher by US News and the NRC. Nothing more. By the way, your link to the NRC rankings was from a decade ago. Here are the latest s- and r-based rankings:
[Ranking</a> of Physics Graduate Schools — PhDs.org Graduate School Guide](<a href=“http://graduate-school.phds.org/rankings/physics/rank/_MM_____________________________________________________________U/2]Ranking”>http://graduate-school.phds.org/rankings/physics/rank/_MM_____________________________________________________________U/2)</p>
<p>The NRC rankings do consider total program resources, not just that from the NSF. Notice that both UF and FSU are in the same general strata as Yale and Rice. Let’s just call them both good programs and leave it at that.</p>
<p>^ rogracer, you’re noticing the same things I’ve noticed about p2n. He will pull some stat from like the mind-80s to show that FSU was better than UF. Then he will take that stat and claim that it means more than any stat that is relevant today. FSU is like an old, used Oldsmobile. haha.</p>
<p>We can do that, Rogracer.</p>
<p>C’mon, GfG. You know better than that. Universities are the sums of centuries and decades of investment. People pour their lives into making a university what it is and what it shall be. This is why FSU and UF are Florida’s so-called “flagship” universities, a term best defined by the head of the AAU - Robert M. Berdahl, PhD.</p>