<p>What an ugly win! How many dropped interceptions? Gardner was lucky not to have been intercepted a half dozen times today. But the Defense place decent football, we seem to have found a better option at RB in Derrick Green, our last drive of the game, ending in a perfectly executed field goal to tie the game was amazing and Gardner did play very well in overtime. Hopefully, the team can find a way to win at Iowa next week.</p>
<p>How about some Gardner appreciation?</p>
<p>His 2 pt celebration was rolling over on his back and just trying to catch his breath</p>
<p>I agree ThisIsMichigan. I personally think his OT performance was excellent. Overall, I am a supporter of Gardner and have often laid as much of the blame for Gardner’s struggles on the OL and poor running game. I just can’t help but wonder how amazing he would be if he just learned how to avoid risky throws and get rid of the ball in a timely fashion. Then again, I always try to remind myself that he is still learning the game.</p>
<p>That being said, I am also please with the defensive effort today, as well as with the running game under Green.</p>
<p>Gardner appreciation? He would have had at least 5 pick-6s (and truly aweful pick-6s to boot) today if we weren’t playing Northwestern. It’s so bad that my Northwestern friend started joking about which team he plays for.
What’s the excuse for him this time? The offensive line that protected him so well all game (All the sacks he had were dumb sacks 10 yards behind LOS when he had ample time to call it a day and throw the ball away)? Or the lack of running game that went off for over 100 yard for 4+ yards per carry by our two running backs?</p>
<p>That’s not to mention, being in field goal range with no timeout to begin with, Gardner almost singlehandedly lost us the game in regulation by taking a sack out of field goal range when there was ample time to throw it away. 119 out of 120 D1 QB knows you throw the ball at the ground pass the LOS in that situation.</p>
<p>Thank goodness for special team, Gibbons and Dileo in particular (btw did you guys see the way Dileo just slid into the holder spot?)for bailing Gardner out. The team won today DESPITE Gardner, not because of Gardner.</p>
<p>The struggles of OL and lack of running game was a large part of Gardner’s doing, but we know by now it’s a chicken or the egg question and we’ll never agree to anything :)</p>
<p>This is truly awesome</p>
<p>[Michigan</a> field goal - YouTube](<a href=“- YouTube”>- YouTube)</p>
<p>“I just can’t help but wonder how amazing he would be if he just learned how to avoid risky throws and get rid of the ball in a timely fashion.”</p>
<p>That’s more than 50% of being a good QB. That’s like saying, I can’t help but wonder how amazing a running back I would be if I run a 4.3 40 and can get to top end speed in a timely fashion.
I think because we had robinson, forcier, threet/sheridan people forgot how good real Michigan QBs of the past were. Even if Gardner cuts down the number of mindblowingly dumb throws and magically learn to make faster decisions, he would still be nowhere near a Henne. Henne routinely made beautiful throws after beautiful throws either with great touch or on a rope (when he’s healthy without the nagging dislocated shoulder anyway).</p>
<p>“Then again, I always try to remind myself that he is still learning the game.”
He is a 4th year junior with over a year’s worth of starting experience under his belt. There are a dozen younger QBs in college football who are light years ahead of him when it comes to understanding the game and doing the aforementioned things you wish he could.</p>
<p>I’m sorry, but we ****ing suck.</p>
<p>I have lost hope :/</p>
<p>Bearcats, if you are going to be hard on Gardner for today, then you also need to give him credit for his play in overtime. He did a good job in overtime today.</p>
<p>Also, let’s lay off on the criticism. We won the game :)</p>
<p>“I think because we had robinson, forcier, threet/sheridan people forgot how good real Michigan QBs of the past were.”</p>
<p>I have not forgotten. From 1992 until 2000, Michigan had a string of six straight QBs that were taken in the draft, including Grbac, Griese and Brady. Henne was a good QB, but his 0-4 record vs OSU and 1-3 Bowl record don’t cut it.</p>
<p>“The struggles of OL and lack of running game was a large part of Gardner’s doing, but we know by now it’s a chicken or the egg question and we’ll never agree to anything.”</p>
<p>Nor will the majority of sports writers or football analysts, most of which put the blame chiefly on the OL and RBs. Gardner is an above average/good QB with little experience. I never claimed he was the second coming of Tom Brady. Put him behind a good OL and give him a solid RB to work with, and Gardner will get the job done, nothing more, nothing less. No matter how you rationalize it bearcats, the fact that Gardner, a pretty mobile QB, is the most heavily sacked QB in the nation says it all. Hopefully, Morris has the kind of talent you refer to…the Brady-type talent, but we won’t know until next year, or perhaps even 2015. If he has the talent, it would be awesome and would complement WRs like the ones we are about to get in Drake Harris next year and George Campbell in two years. A good QB would do a lot of damage with a pair of 6’4", 200 LBS WRs…assuming the OL holds up!</p>
<p>I agree that Gardner played poorly against Northwestern yesterday. I said as much in the opening post of this thread. But as 777Blue77 said, Gardner deserves credit for his play in the final drive of regulation and in OT. </p>
<p>Player of the game today, however, goes to Dileo! What excellent reflexes. Without him, we would never have snapped the ball on time.</p>
<p>No, you guys. Bearcats is right. He is all knowledgeable in all areas, including football. </p>
<p>Gardner also got us 1st downs and important plays late running the ball. Also, it wasn’t 5 or 6 dropped interceptions, no. Not to mention his WRs also had some bad drops that could have made him look better. </p>
<p>We saw Gardner succeed last year. We have not seen the OL or running game succeed for multiple games (though today was an alright start). </p>
<p>I give Gardner credit for still being in one piece. He has been beat to hell. Something no one ever gave Denard credit for when he probably was one of the most hit players in college football.</p>
<p>Some of these “Michigan fans” over the last few weeks have been sickening. The same crowd that wanted to blame Denard for everything too no doubt, when the man carried us through the RRod era on his shoulders…</p>
<p>All the pessimists ready to just give up on the season, jesus christ. Support the team or don’t call yourself a fan. It is fair to question the coaches, maybe even question a player occasionally. But every week, hearing how bad this player is and how bad this player is. All while quitting on the team and giving up all hope. Please, if you have tickets don’t come to the OSU game. Give them to someone else. We don’t need you in the stadium.</p>
<p>“Some of these “Michigan fans” over the last few weeks have been sickening.”</p>
<p>I agree ThisIsMichigan. I count myself among those spoiled fans at times. This season has tested my patience, but there is no excuse. I still believe in Hoke though. The only gauge I have for a head coach is integrity and recruiting, and he excels at both. And I don’t take back my criticism of Borges and Funk. From what I have seen so far this year, they need to go.</p>
<p>Gotta echo ThisIsMichigan. Sitting on the bus and in lobbies/restaurants on campus over the last few weeks has just been painful. The sheer amount of f-it attitude I’ve heard from “fans” has been disheartening. It’s not enough that they have to give up, it’s the need to bash the team, the coaches, everything under the sun… on… and on… and on… </p>
<p>One of my good friends is a Wolverine through-and-through. I literally don’t remember the last time I saw him without some sort of Michigan apparel on and he’s a MMB alum. But my god, I can’t even think of talking to him on game days. He’s just so negative (he is a rather negative person in general when things don’t go his way, but he’s an extreme of the overall trend). </p>
<p>Today was ugly, but a win. I predicted this win on the other thread. I thought it would be a cleaner win than this. I have no idea how next week is going to go, but I don’t think it’ll be pretty no matter the outcome.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>I know people are trying to sell them for $100 and it’s Thanksgiving weekend too. it’s funny
and they’ll probably plummet to $10 because no one wants to pay $100 just to watch us to get violated by OSU</p>
<p>ThisIsMichigan</p>
<p>You made some really good points.</p>
<p>“I think because we had robinson, forcier, threet/sheridan people forgot how good real Michigan QBs of the past were. Even if Gardner cuts down the number of mindblowingly dumb throws and magically learn to make faster decisions, he would still be nowhere near a Henne. Henne routinely made beautiful throws after beautiful throws either with great touch or on a rope (when he’s healthy without the nagging dislocated shoulder anyway).”</p>
<p>Henne threw 37 picks in his collegiate career. Denard threw 39.</p>
<p>Looking at the numbers and awards, honors, etc., Denard had a better collegiate career than Henne.</p>
<p>Yards gained and touchdowns scored count the same whether you run the ball or throw the ball.</p>
<p>If only Michigan had a defense in 2010.</p>
<p>People are desperately trying to pawn off their OSU tickets. I know people in the SPH that have been trying to get rid of them now for almost 2 weeks. No takers. No offers at all.</p>
<p>Idk, maybe it is because I spent all of middle school and high school IN Ohio without Michigan beating OSU, but I don’t complain and moan about every little thing that isn’t winning a national championship. </p>
<p>Like the freshmen, sophomores, etc that just constantly ripped on Denard… god that was awful.</p>
<p>Here’s the thing: the two most prolific QBs in Michigan history have been Denard Robinson and Devin Gardner. It’s not even close. The top 10 game performances by a Michigan QB as measured by total yardage all belong to Robinson and Gardner. </p>
<p>Problem is, that’s come at the expense of a huge drop-off in production by conventional RBs. In part that’s the offensive scheme, especially in the RichRod era; tailback production was secondary, and DR was clearly the best RB on the field. Hoke & Co. wanted to transition to a more conventional power running game, but the interior of their OL proved inadequate to that task and we ended up with a lot of runs stuffed for a loss.</p>
<p>Today was better, partly because Northwestern’s defensive front is weak, partly because Derrick Green showed some explosiveness and power to run through tackles, partly because of some interior OL personnel changes, partly because the Michigan offense established the short pass to the flat then effectively faked that pass to create some room for the OL to open holes inside. Whatever, it started to click. Let’s hope this is the start of a trend.</p>
<p>I thought DG played well overall. He forced some passes that could have been picks, but they weren’t. By the same token, his WRs dropped a lot of balls that should have moved the chains–or in at least one case, should have won the game. It was cold, windy, at wet; you can’t blame DG for that.</p>
<p>I hope DG comes back for a final year of eligibility. We sometimes forget, this guy is just finishing a year’s worth of experience as a starting QB. And this is mostly a very young team. I think their prospects next year are very, very bright.</p>
<p>“Nor will the majority of sports writers or football analysts, most of which put the blame chiefly on the OL and RBs.”
Similar to the proof you want on the selectivity data, please show me proof that over 50% of sports writers and football analysts said so. In addition, please show me the audit that the data collected is accurate.</p>
<p>“No matter how you rationalize it bearcats, the fact that Gardner, a pretty mobile QB, is the most heavily sacked QB in the nation says it all.”
That’s because he can’t make decisions quickly to save his life/refuse to throw the damn ball away when the play is toast.</p>
<p>"But as 777Blue77 said, Gardner deserves credit for his play in the final drive of regulation and in OT. "
It doesn’t work that way. As I said, he almost singlehandedly lost us the game in regulation and had to be bailed out, repeatedly. If I lose 20 million from Jan 1 - Dec 30 and make 20.1 million on Dec 31, I don’t get paid a bonus on the 20.1 million; but chances are I would have gotten fired before Dec 30, similarly, Gardner should have lost the game for us big time in regulation. We have the dropped interception god and our special team to thank.</p>
<p>"Also, it wasn’t 5 or 6 dropped interceptions, no. "
Yes it was. That was my count and Glen Mason said so on the broadcast.</p>
<p>“All the pessimists ready to just give up on the season, jesus christ. Support the team or don’t call yourself a fan. It is fair to question the coaches, maybe even question a player occasionally. But every week, hearing how bad this player is and how bad this player is. All while quitting on the team and giving up all hope. Please, if you have tickets don’t come to the OSU game. Give them to someone else. We don’t need you in the stadium.”</p>
<p>I support the team during the game; but outside of the game, I choose to be objective and analyze based on facts. Sorry I don’t drink the koolaid.
You of all people don’t have the right to judge who’s needed in the stadium. After all, you are not even passionate enough to get to the games early to get better seats.</p>
<p>"We saw Gardner succeed last year. We have not seen the OL or running game succeed for multiple games (though today was an alright start). "</p>
<p>Right, that was before Akron provided the blue print for the rest of the college football world to make him a non-factor. Akron basically exposed to the world that he can’t make fast decisions/get rid of the ball and will panic if you just overwhelm the box and rush 8/9 guys. Furthermore, rush wide so he cant spin himself out of trouble because he only has one move on the run. As Herbstreit said, until Gardner can make the defense pay for cover-0 defense by consistently hitting receivers and not throwing boneheaded interceptions in the process, defenses are going to keep playing the same way.</p>
<p>This is similar to how Robinson seemed unstoppable until that Moo U game, when Narduzzi showed the world how to stop him. From then on everyone who has the personnel to execute that scheme stopped him.</p>
<p>But Hoke said if Manziel was here he would be backing up Gardner so he must be great. Can’t disagree with our all-knowing head coach, the same guy who hired Borges, the third highest paid and 120th best offensive coordinator of college football.</p>