My kid was very VERY excited after a recent tour of MIT and is thinking about applying EA. He loved peeking to the labs and hearing about the research opportunities. However, I have concerns after doing some online reading.
I read an article from the school newspaper talking about how most of the required classes are large traditional lectures which the author said he often stopped attending after the first few weeks. Is this a common student experience?
I read on the MIT website that there are small learning communities, but after searching on CC it seemed like they were not typically a good experience. Does anyone have experience with these communities?
I also read here on CC that students at MIT look down on the Humanities and even Biology is considered somehow “less.” Is there a kind of anti-intellectualism or lack of respect for anything that isn’t Physics, Chemistry or Engineering?
I know these examples are all anecdotal. So, if anyone who knows MIT has any thoughts about them I would love to hear from you. I want to get on board with my kid…
Partly. It's true that most required classes (incl. GIR's) are large lectures. Most of the larger classes have lectures, as well as recitations, which are smaller (e.g. 10-20 students) meetings where a TA or professor goes over certain concepts or pset problems. Skipping lectures isn't that uncommon but some large classes I've taken (e.g. 5.111, 6.005, 8.02) take and require attendance.
There's ESG and probably many others - I'm not a part of these but I know many students who are, and they say it's a really good experience because it feels a lot more relaxed and professors take time to know you.
Biology - not really. Humanities and Course 15 - maybe.
@whatthewhat:
If there was any truth to these, would they gate your son’s decision to apply to MIT?
Every school has it’s pros and cons, and the concerns you mention can be found at most large schools.
@jpm50 If they are true I think there are probably better fits for him to apply EA or rather SCEA/REA.
And I haven’t gotten the sense about other research institutions, like Stanford, that humanities are disrespected. But I guess if I am going to dig deep on MIT I better do the same with all the other top candidates.
I am interested in what you have read about item 2 (ESG, Concourse, and the other one- I don’t recall what it was). Those communities serve the needs of specific student types. I would speak with the people in them and running them. I believe Concourse is especially good for a transition from High School (perhaps a younger student) or someone who is humanities-inclined. ESG is for those independent souls who want minimum infrastructure between them and the material to be learned. Not really sure about the other learning community.
I would love to hear the tenor of the negative comments on these communities. What do people have to say?
Item 1- lower division courses that are not in the learning communities are very large lectures and smaller recitation sections.
Item 3- Humanities are not disrespected; unless you are a single-major in course 21. I am not sure those exist. Course 15, and to some extent course 1 and course 3, take a bit of a ribbing; just because someone has to and no one knows any “Urban Planning” majors IRL. Biology has great respect. The degree of these feelings of respect/disrespect is very shallow- you are differentiating dimples on a golf ball at this level. The Institute is an inclusive family.
The degree of these feelings of respect/disrespect is very shallow- you are differentiating dimples
on a golf ball at this level. The Institute is an inclusive family.
What I read about the learning communities was that the classes didn’t prepare the students for the next level in the series. Also I read the teaching was uneven. It is interesting to read how you differentiate the programs. After looking at their websites I wouldn’t have understood that distinction.
When I was at MIT, 6.001 was the largest course on campus by enrollment. We met twice a week in a large 300 student lecture led by a full professor, twice per week in a recitation session of 28 or so, also led by a full professor, and once per week in a tutorial session of 6 students led by a grad student. There was a large lecture theatre, but I definitely did not feel that I lacked personal attention.
Large lectures exist for many of the freshman core classes (GIR’s) and some of the larger majors (ie, EECS). Smaller majors will have smaller core classes, and there is still the possibility of smaller electives in large departments. Skipping classes is common/noticeable, but not typical. Most of my classes have at least 50% attendance, and plenty have near-100% attendance past freshman year.
I personally go to most my classes, though I tend to prioritize lecture over recitation (smaller sections). Last semester I only had recitations on Friday’s, so I often didn’t go to class on Friday’s. It takes maturity to figure out what classes you can and cannot skip, and I think lots of people figure that out: sometimes that extra hour of sleep or that afternoon relaxing with some friends and a bottle of wine has a lot more value than an hour of lecture or recitation.
I’ve seen the learning communities as a mixed bag. For some people, the learning communities will serve as a bridge between hs and college thanks to the more intimate (read: smaller) classes and a sense of community. For others, however, the learning communities can become a crutch or hindrance. Several of the departments at MIT are large and impersonal. I know some people who were hurt by the learning communities because they chose majors in such departments and only made the adjustment to large lecture classes in their sophomore year, under far greater stress from much harder sophomore classes.
There are also issues with the pacing of classes. Some of the classes use similar/same problem sets and exams to the traditional lecture class, but the pacing of the classes may desync. There are also plenty of opportunities to form community outside small learning communities (dorms, FSILGs, clubs, etc.)
There are some circles of people who have this “mightier than thou” attitude regarding academic field. So, I’ve met plenty of physicists who think chemists are ignorant of quantum mechanics for knowing less theory, and the humanities are generally underemphasized. But there are still plenty of opportunities to pursue the humanities. MIT is strong in several of the humanities disciplines (political science, economics, music, philosophy, linguistics, science/technology/society). There is also a program for appreciation of the humanities:
There is also the opportunity to cross-register at Harvard, which is stronger in some humanities fields and has more niche options. If you want to see an MIT humanities major’s perspective on the matter, some of the episodes in this podcast series may be of interest:
“but I think my son wouldn’t care what people thought.” MIT is so refreshing that way. No airs or pretense and no over investment in what others think.