Unmotivated Junior- What do you do?

Parents Forum
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<p>Wow! I admit I did love Cornell but it would not be my first choice for her. She won’t even listen to any of my suggestions of schools that might be a better fit for her academically. I am concerned about workload with sports as well. I really have been encouraging DIV III schools…I think she would do better with a small LAC but she won’t hear of it. </p>

<p>I can stomach the advice to: Love the kid on the couch. I came to the forum to vent; I would never say these things to her or anyone about her. I do admit to being resentful. As far as XMAS gifts- am I the only parent who is resentful as kids get older? The only thing I am asking for is to study for your SATS a little bit. I’m resentful when they don’t do the dishes too. I know it is too soon to expect gratitude but when you do for others eventually you want some appreciation. Even your own kids. Sorry! I find both of my kids selfish, ungrateful, and stupid a lot of the time. I recognize it is age appropriate most of the time but doesn’t mean I have to like it. </p>

<p>I will probably helicopter and make her study for small increments each day leading up to Jan test. I like the suggestion of someone else delivering the motivation and news and she has a young teacher at school who fits that description well. If she does not do well enough on the test, I imagine I will slowly relax and learn to love the kid on the couch. </p>

<p>It is just frustrating to have the years of knowledge and to watch her make stupid :slight_smile: 16 year old decisions that **** opportunities away. End of the world…NO …but still frustrating.</p>

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<p>OP</p>

<p>I agree with you - Frustrating!</p>

<p>I hear where you are coming from with Cornell – I have high expectations for my son. I worked hard for my achievements and yet I see my son not working hard & having 1,000 times more potential. Your post sounds the way I feel. I know my kids are great. I know my kids can achieve greatness. I don’t know how to get them to have that perfect balance of confidence and work ethic.</p>

<p>You are not alone. </p>

<p>I do second putting off SAT until March. She may not by any more ready by then, but it will give more time if your family does opt for tutoring.</p>

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<p>Dazed: I admit feeling a little angry and resentful towards my kids. It’s mostly when they are not living up to what I feel their potential is. (So, the problem is really my expectations since they think they are totally on track!) Both are in college now but had “motivation” problems in high school and still suffer from the “magical thinking” syndrome at times. There is nothing you can MAKE her do. If money is not an issue, I would suggest one on one SAT prep for even as little as 4-6 hours. She can also contact the Cornell coach and ask what being a “recruited walk-on” would require. Some colleges let recruited walk ons in with slightly lower test scores and gpa’s. The coaching staff has a very clear idea of who gets in with what. If they want her, they will come right out and give a score range. If they waffle, she needs to look elsewhere. Some kids step up to the plate once getting in to a top college and others fail. It’s hard to know in advance how your daughter would do in that situation. The sports camps are a great idea in my opinion. She should go with her strengths. Maybe you can try to get her to attend a camp at a smaller, less competitive school- it could be a mind-opening experience as far as the college list goes.</p>

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<p>I do understand the feelings parents have when their children who have so much opportunity, do so little with it. However, for me, it is less a feeling of resentment towards them and more a feeling of fear. Fear that they will grow into frustrated adults who don’t understand why they didn’t achieve their potential. I’m afraid that if they don’t do their best now, they will have limited opportunity in the future and they won’t, frankly, be able to live in the manner I’ve raised them.</p>

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<p>I am glad to see other parents also feel anger, resentment and frustration. It’s not just me! Been there, done that, still doing that. I think the OP has some very valid concerns. Thankfully, I can say S1 saw the light and things are better at 21. A work in progress…hopefully. Still though, some stupid things I didn’t do at that age. S2, age 19, not even seeing the light as he continues to make bad decisions and create problems for himself time after time. Informed us this week he is quitting college and joining the Natl Guard. Just brilliant. I opened his Christmas laptop to install Word and found the website to join. So I also second the motion to take back Christmas presents…</p>

<p>There have been lots of helpful posts giving the OP good advice and direction. The last 18 months of high school are torture both for parents and students. You WILL get through this :)</p>

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<p>“Fear that they will grow into frustrated adults who don’t understand why they didn’t achieve their potential. I’m afraid that if they don’t do their best now, they will have limited opportunity in the future and they won’t, frankly, be able to live in the manner I’ve raised them.”</p>

<p>I empathize with you, and have been through this with both of my sons. Finally, I had to learn that I did my best, but the rest was up to them. In my case, that meant that I had to accept that while my sons had the brains to get wonderful scores, they lacked the motivation to obtain high school grades that were anywhere near their potential.</p>

<p>When I let go, and let them feel the consequences of their actions, that took quite a load off my back. I had to realize that much though I love them, I can’t make them live the kind of life that I think would be best for them. I also had to recognize that their decisions weren’t my fault.</p>

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<p>Op- it may help to reframe your dilemma in adult terms. What if your spouse observed that you are home every night by 7 pm whereas your neighbors spouse routinely stays until midnight and seems to make a lot more money than you do? How would you feel being criticized for squandering the wonderful opportunities you have by not burning the midnight oil and showing your management that you have what it takes and are ready to take on the world?</p>

<p>My guess is you would resent the implication that the choices you’ve made re: work/life balance are less valid than those of your neighbor. And I would agree with you.</p>

<p>That’s how your D is perceiving your comments- even if you think you are being very subtle with your disapproval. She has chosen the kids she wants to be friends with- possibly not the most ambitious or driven kids in her HS. She has chosen to focus on her sport and not to spend those hours in a biochemistry lab working with an Intel mentor. She has chosen to relax and “chill” instead of studying for some standardized test. Her current life’s goal may be to live in a McMansion and to get her nails done every week (but that’s going to be her choice in life- even if she goes to Cornell or Tufts and graduates Summa Cum Laude and Phi Beta Kappa.) And the fact that her friends (right now) would support that choice makes it supremely irritating for you— but frankly, disapproving of her friends for being shallow and vacuous isn’t something you get to voice. (unless you’re going to tell me that they’re doing something immoral or illegal. It’s not illegal to be shallow.)</p>

<p>So you need to break the cycle of you disapproving of her choices, which makes her defiantly dig in to those choices. I don’t see evidence that she’s lazy. I see evidence that she’s being a teenager and is tired of you weighing in on the choices she makes. Just as you would dig in if confronted about why you leave the office when you’re tired and ready for dinner, feeling like you’ve done what you can reasonably do for the day.</p>

<p>Your conversations might be more productive with her if you focus on the following:</p>

<p>“Hey, you are so great at X sport. Have you talked to some of the older kids from your HS who are playing in college to find out about their experiences?” This is non-judgmental. She needs to hear how demanding sports/academics are from real live HS students and not from you.</p>

<p>“Gosh, it was fun seeing Cornell. If you are interested, there are other pretty schools in rural/non-urban settings that we could visit some weekend. We can just call it a vacation if you don’t want to do the full tour. I was thinking of Franklin and Marshall or Lawrence or XYZ college. Let me know if you are interested.” This helps her re-set her clock. Your goal in life is not to remind her of all the reasons why she can’t or won’t or didn’t get into Cornell- your goal is to launch her towards a productive adult life with a college degree.</p>

<p>“I’m so proud that you did so well on your ACT and PSAT without the kind of angst and aggravation that a lot of other kids seem to have about standardized tests. Why don’t we take a look at a list of schools where your scores suggest you’d be a competitive candidate? Or you can make an appointment with your guidance counselor to do that? I know I’ve been nagging you to study to raise your scores- if you’re happy with your current scores and where you are likely to get in-- then great. If you’d like to aim a little higher, let me know how I can help you prepare for the next set of tests or if we should postpone until Springtime to give you more time.” This sets out for her very reasonably, and in a non-judgmental way, that she is the master of her fate- do some prep, she may score higher. Do no prep, she may not score higher. But either way, you will support her choice. But she is the one who must understand that higher scores often mean more choices, and lower scores often limit those choices- even as an athlete, and even as a pretty, fun HS girl.</p>

<p>And don’t forget the most important message which you need to deliver at least three times a week, “Gee, I know it seems like I’m always nagging you about something or other. Just wanted to remind you that I love you and am proud of you for who you are, not for what you achieve or how fast you run or how many medals or awards you win. You are a special person and I’m proud to be your parent.”.</p>

<p>If you can see your way through the very judgmental cycle you two seem to be locked into right now, your D may or may not decide she wants to shoulder the burden of lifting her performance. But either way, she needs to know you are in her court. And you need to know that you can’t make her study and the only motivation worth having in life is the one that comes from inside.</p>

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<p>Great advice, blossom!</p>

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<p>To the OP:</p>

<p>Recruited athletes from our own school can get into top schools, including Ivies such as Harvard, UPenn, Columbia, and Princeton, with SAT scores significantly lower than most students who are waitlisted or rejected from the same schools. Sometimes a coach will even give a prospect a specific score that they would like them to obtain in order to be admitted, such as asking a student of they could raise their SAT from 2050 to 2100. Perhaps if the OP’s daughter hears this from a coach she might become more motivated to study for her SAT’s, if her goal is to attend an Ivy or top LAC?</p>

<p>I know you are anticipating a summer sports program for this summer, but might it also be possible to enroll her in a three week course at a top college? (Her 202 PSAT plus her grades should qualify her for many of these programs.) This would give her the experience of being around other academically motivated students, and it might bring out a side of her that is missing at a high school where she is “the smart one” without having to try much. She might have a better idea of what she wants in a college after such an experience. At the least, she will have had the experience of being around other students who are aiming for elite academics and will have an idea of what to expect should she matriculate at this type of school.</p>

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<p>The whole xmas present question probably deserves its own thread, but here goes. Maybe it is time to look at the whole phenomena of gift giving in your family. We have been scaling back on gift giving now that the kids are older (late teens/early adult) and all I can say is “what a relief!” The ritual of using gifts for saying “I love you” is so much more simple now, has a lot less drama about it, and is being done at a fraction of the cost. Gone are the days of buying the newest video console or some other wow-gadget… granted, there were years that it was really fun going for that wow-factor, but it also built up unrealistic expectations for giver and receiver. </p>

<p>I recommend reading “Scroogenomics” for a different look on things. Just interesting ideas to ponder.</p>

<p>All I can say is if a parent feels resentment about giving gifts because the child won’t do XY or Z, then the gift wasn’t given for the right reasons and the whole paradigm needs to be revisited. It’s just no fun anymore for parent or child at that point. I also believe the resentment the OP feels is normal, natural and a <em>signal</em> that they are over-providing at the moment. The push-pull is that in this society, many parents value the idea of a college education for their children that they will ignore the natural biological urge to kick the oversized “baby” bird out of the nest. That leaves the parent “hostage” to their two conflicting urges… to helicopter-parent a grown child in order to get them in and thru college… and to kick the unproductive lout out of the house to get a job. Even 100 years ago 17 year old kids didn’t laze about the house… they apprenticed, got married, worked on the family farm, learned the family business, etc. Only our strange times - western culture and affluence - has delayed adulthood until mid-20s or later. (Read articles on “emerging adulthood” for more on this.)</p>

<p>I say honor both urges by pulling back on too many privileges and perks (or drowning them in showers of xmas presents) while still keeping doors open for college.</p>

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<p>Blossom and Annika, Thank you for the good advice. I make choices everyday regarding quality of life vs. $$$…I’m kinda of a crunchy csa loving crunchy foodie…not crazy but a little judgmental …big reader…Judgemental…ready to redo the xmas thing…will look into Scroogenomics (not so wealthy that I can afford to pay full for Cornell-esque just priviledged compared to most) I will let everyone know how things turn out…She pierced her ears tonight (2ND hole) with gf’s tonight…she still may be an idiot but I do know to choose my battles. Maybe it will all kick in…I am going to pay for the camp…Cornell and Dartmouth ( lots of small LAC coaches attend) and hope for the best. Meh…whats another 1100 bucks at this point ??? and I am going to make her study for sats…going to have conversation about taking in March …I can’t tell if that is spelled right …have a nice NYE everyone :)</p>

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<p>Wow! This thread has been absolutely cathartic! I so wish I’d seen this last fall when it began. I was too busy going the therapy/medication route to figure out what was wrong with my daughter who had Princeton aspirations and Third Tier state public U. grades. </p>

<p>I FEEL the initial poster’s pain! So frustrating when teachers, counselors, EVERYONE says: “she’s so smart!” – but grades, test scores, and refusal to do forward planning say otherwise!</p>

<p>So alluring the route suggested by some of the previous posters – allow her to slack off to her detriment, and release myself from responsibility. Unfortunately, our financial situation is such that we’re going to have to pay full freight – without any $$ to do it. That means that if she doesn’t perform well enough to get SOME merit money (like her older sister, with the SAME parenting & privileges who got a free ride to a top liberal arts u), I HAVE TO LIVE WITH HER AFTER SHE’S 18 & graduated!! </p>

<p>THAT eventuality is simply not acceptable. One of us WILL murder the other. WHYYYY oh, whyyyyy didn’t someone TELL me that all my youthful sins would karma back at me??!!</p>