<p>@Bill0510:</p>
<p>I agree with you on a couple of points. FIrst USNA and USMMA are two very different animals from their mission to their size, etc. Further, from your numerous other posts over on the USNA Board, I suspect you either attend or are a graduate of the USNA. I won’t hold that against you however, I’m fairly sure your comments were meant to spark debate and illicit a response from the Kings Pointers on this board and of course it surely will starting with me. (As Sinatra sang it: “I gotta be me”)</p>
<p>If I’m wrong and you have any actual first hand knowledge from having spent time at USMMA either as a Midshipmen, Staff member or otherwise, please speak up and I may retract some of my statements.</p>
<p>First, in your general characterization of the USMMA, which some may construe from your statement : “BUT, consider that if you do not intend to become a commercial seaman, there may be better educaitonal opportunities [see Harvard, Rice, and other schools] available to you that result in that Ensign’s title.” is in my opinion very misleading and likely to drive people in the wrong direction. Fact: The USMMA is a fully accredited college offering BS degrees in six different majors, yes all do indeed have applicability to the commercial maritime industry as well as the transportation industry. Per the Transportation Research Board, an arm of the National Science Foundation, 1 in 7 employed in the US have carrers that are in some way directly related to or affected by said transporation industry. The USMMA is fully accredited by the Middle States Association, which is a very respected higher education accreditation body. Further two of the engineering degrees are ABET accredited and also highly rated/ranked. In fact, per this year’s US News and World Report Rankings: USMMA’s Engineering Programs are tied for 26th nationally among all Baccalaureate Colleges. The USMMA is also ranked third overall among Baccalaureate colleges in the North behind #1 Cooper Union and #2: USCGA.</p>
<p>RE: “The two academies shouldn’t and, to some degree, can’t be compared.” … On this we agree but for differring reasons. To me USMMA and USCGA are basically small colleges while USAFA, USNA, and USMA, are at ~5,000 students quite large. Sure if you know today you ABSOLUTELY want to spend 30 years in any one particular service I’ll agree the logical first choice for you should be THAT SERVICE’S Academy - that is indeed their primary mission. Of course the career paths of numerous four stars did NOT start at their particular service’s academy and that’s because the rigorous selection process for the “Up or Out” policy of the service values a lot of things that are over and above the ability to “knock your ring on the table.”</p>
<p>“Facilities? No comparison. On this we will agree.” USNA has larger facilities, and a far bigger budget to support them. For your information, the SecTrans’ Blue Ribbon Report clearly bears out the issues you allude to and clearly indicates a 15 year planned effort is needed to ensure the USMMA facilities reach the world class standards all our nation’s service academies should be at. Further as you allude fedral budgets flucutate and we’ll see how that goes for USMMA. BTW where in the budget approval process is the USNA’s $41M request to moderize and upgrade your dining hall’s galley? My point, this is a true statement at ALL federal facilities.</p>
<p>“Faculty? Not much to compare. USNA has a richer, more diverse faculty. [And I don’t mean dollar-wise or in terms of ethnicity.] It might beinteresting to compare–and those o fyou who will be quick to attack this post should do it–the academic standing of the civilian instructors.” Sure do including a malcontent or two with tenure who author numerous diatribes on every problem at your institution as well as any professor at KP ever even thought of doing. As for diversity, yes you have more majors, etc. but to what end and why, I’ll never understand and I say that not as a blast but as a taxpayer. Why on earth the service needs so many history majors or Poly Sci majors I’ll never understand. I’ll certainly never understand why they need any from the USNA when as you rightfully point out places like Harvard and University of Pa - Ivy League Schools, as well as UVA a great Public Institution of National Stature have NROTC programs. That said since as far as I know neither of us make those kinds of deceisions what’s the point here. The question was far more specific relative to becoming a SWO out of USMMA for someone who doesn’t yet or at least didn’t at the time they asked the question have USNA as a choice?</p>
<p>“Budget? Not even close.” Granted however, both are federally funded academies so what’s the point here? In the end I’d agree with you though, KP needs more money again see the Blue Ribbon Report for detaisl at least as far as the physical plant. However the current 2010 GFY budget proposes increases to only two places in the Department of Transportation Budget from the President to Congress - USMMA is one of them.</p>
<p>“Sports? Not even close.” Well depends on what you want. USNA is Division IA, while USMMA is Div III. For some that might meant they can participate at USMMA while they would not do so at USNA.</p>
<p>Re: “Sea Going Experience? You have to give this edge to USMMA.” Yes if you want to know what you are doing on a ship’s bridge or in the engine room when you get out of school, or know how to move either commercial cargo or some little military things like a battallion of Marines and their gear from two places like Cherry Point, NC and say Kuwait, then the education you’d get at USMMA will prepare you very, very well. Of course, no reason a naval officer needs to know that sort of thing.</p>
<p>RE: “History? USNA
Options upon graduation? USMMA
Books, supplies, allowance while in school? USNA
Prestige? Depends on how you define it but prestige is a function of public awareness and recognition; USMMA lags behind the other service academies.”
On these items we’ll also agree except on the prestige statement I’d add that within the smaller circle that know Kings Point “America’s Best Kept Secret” it too is very well respected.</p>
<p>Re “The point is: USMMA offers a very specialized education. They are good [by all accounts] at offering that specialized eduction. [AND, their graduates, on average, make a whole heck of a lot more money than do USNA graduates AT THE TIME OF GRADUATION.] If you want to be a commercial seaman, you CANNOT beat the deal offered by USMMA. Free ride, more or less, by the taxpayers AND a six-figure salary at graduation? Can’t be beat.”</p>
<p>Here’s my biggest disagreements with you all in one hairball of a statement by you. </p>
<ul>
<li>-First - USMMA really doesn’t give you a “specialized education” - it gives you a great baccalaureate degree - any one of six and basicaly they are relatively general degrees. The 3 enginering degrees basically give you a Mechanical Engineering degree with exposure to and some depth in one of three areas. The Marine Transportation majors give you a general business degree again with exposure to and some depth in one of three areas. Many, many Kings Pointers then suppliment that with a graduate program when they choose to “specialize” and after they have started their careers.</li>
</ul>
<p>–Second, further while it’s (these sorts of decisions) not and never should be about how much money you are likely to make. On average across their lifetimes and on a per capita basis I’d be more then willing to bet that USMMA grads make more. In the long run when you look at the “private sector” where USMMA grads tend to end up sooner and again on a per capita basis end up in “leaderrship/executive” positions, such folks make more than the typical career officer who stays in the service for 25 - 30 years. It’s really just math. However, I’d further add when you retire for the service as an O-5 or O-6 you have an excelllent and secure pension and good benefits. Something those higher paid guys might not get or might find themselves as enterprenuers having to risk “to stay on top” at age 50+. </p>
<p>My point is it’s not usually just “at the time of graduation”. In the end I agree with you, if you are realtatively confident you want to make a career of either the US Navy or USMAC and have the choie of going to USNA then that’s probably the right place to go, unless there is some sort of extuniating circumstances I don’t see.</p>
<p>However, if you don’t have that option or aren’t sure after looking at both USNA and USMMA that you want that path, then you needn’t regard USMMA as any sort of second choice. It’s an excellent institution and upon graduation you will likely find a solid road to “fame and fortune” ahead of you that is to your liking.</p>