Vandy ED double legacy help or hurt? [AL resident, 4.0, 1520]

Chance Me / Match Me!
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Demographics
US citizen

  • State/Location of residency: Alabama

  • Type of high school: small private

  • Gender/Race/Ethnicity (white female):
    DOUBLE LEGACY - does this HURT at Vandy???

Intended Major(s)
Linguistics and classics

GPA, Rank, and Test Scores

  • Unweighted HS GPA: 4.0

  • Weighted HS GPA *4.6 - highest possible at my small school given honors and AP
    Courses Available

  • Class Rank: doesn’t work rant but too 5-6/60

  • ACT/SAT Scores: 1520 (760 verbal, 760 math - taken once as a spring junior)

Coursework
*APs:
French, biology, Chemistry, B/c calculus, literature, us history) - all that is offered at small school
Honors - every class since 8th grade, nothing below a 97/100
7 years of French
3 years Latin
Independent study classics due to being only senior in 2 languages

Awards
National honors society
French national honors
Latin national honors
Policy debate state champion 3x
State wide individual theater gold medal
State wide pole vault champion 3 x

Extracurriculars
Honors society member - one of 6 students chosen by faculty and students to enforce school honor and diversity code, responsible for discipline and AI regulation for entire5th-12th school
Heritage panel - leading grade by grade small group discussion and training regarding diversity, bullying, social media ethics, etc, including statewide training and collaboration with other schoos
7 years policy debate
Debate team captain
French club president 2 years
Track and field pole vault and high jump- 4 years
Theater - lead in several productions
8 hours a week of out of school ballet, jazz, tap and modern dance training and performance, 4 years
Summer:
Debate camps and Emory and Dartmouth
Internships:
Alabama Appleseed - center for sentencing reform and legal representation for inmates whose sentences would change based on newer sentencing laws
Prosper Birmingham : research for a nonprofit focused on development of and advocation for minorities in business leadership in our area

Essays/LORs/Other
Solid essays, oldest of 4 with 5 year old brother, writing about him, my cat and my parent separation and subsequent reconciliation
LOR:
Math, excellent
French, excellent
Additional, internship boss and debate coach

Cost Constraints / Budget NONE

Schools
If I don’t get into vandy (they don’t have a competitive debate team) plan to continue to debate in college
ED 1- Vanderbilt - truly at a loss as to whether double
Legacy (both parents) hurts or helps at this school
ED 2 - Emory -recruited by debate coach, applying for debate scholarship
EA-
Georgia honors (recruited by debate coach)
UVA
Michigan ( debate team)
Vermont honors
Regular-
Middlebury (language program given interest in multiple languages and linguistics)
Tufts
BC
Georgetown ( relationship with debate coach, he will contact admissions)
Wake (debate again but not recruited bc don’t personally know coach)
Maybe Dartmouth - coach likes me but they can’t recruit, he will write a letter and reach out to admissions
Richmond
Northwestern (debate team)
Maybe florida
Harvard - have met in person with debate coach and he will speak with admissions, can’t recruit but gives a tilt toward acceptance if on the fence, grandfather attended and was HBS professor, uncle HBS grad

Re safety - given meetings with coaches and admissions pretty confident about UGA, Vermont and Emory but none are my dream. Emory probably above the other 2

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Emory and Vandy share a similarity. UGA and UVM don’t - especially UGA which is HUGE.

Why would legacy hurt? It would never hurt but at some it won’t help. But that’s not the case at Vandy - if you have the qualifying legacy, it will help.

Good luck.

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Re legacy - bc vandy has worked so hard to move up rankings and change its reputation I’m
Worried they will be bothered by it. Maybe that’s silly but it’s one of those schools where
It doesn’t seem clear? Like if it was Yale I would be confident it helps ni just don’t know enough about how vanderbilt approaches it because it’s worked so hard to change the rep. Does that make
Sense?
I wouldn’t really be considering UGA except the coach really is pushing me and I will probably get money and it’s close to home.
I just can’t stay here so Alabama and auburn are out even though I will get a full ride. I’m a queer woman in the Bible Belt. I need out!

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Vandy fell in the rankings, and had a hissy fit about it. It’s the same school - many fell. Very similar WUSTL fell practically out of the top 25.

I’m not sure how legacy ties to that.

It seems clear. It would not hurt - and potentially could help. So it doesn’t make sense (to me).

If you need out, why are Vandy and Emory your top two choices?

Vanderbilt brings back legacy admissions as factor in admissions - The Vanderbilt Hustler

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And thanks for replying!

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Because I really want a midsize
Liberal
Arts school close or in a city with a strong
Classics and foreign language department. I have 3 younger siblings and I am
Hesitant to be so far away that I miss milestone events. After living at Emory last summer and visiting candy several times I am
Confident that their urban environments provide a very different experience than my current hometown. I don’t have to be with only
Likeminded people. I just need a more intellectual and curious community. Does that make
Sense? If I could just choose I would go to Harvard, penn, brown or Columbia but let’s be real :). I know those aren’t realistic so I’m
Trying to
Find a happy medium
For
Liberal arts universities
With 5-7k students and close or in a city on this side of the Mississippi River due to how close I am
With my
Family. I’m open to other options but I don’t know
Of
Any. I would be interested in Chicago but over heard it’s where “fun goes to die” :joy:. Many liberal
Arts colleges are
So small and after attending a small high school I want a diffeeent experience.
I get the sense that the honors college at UGA may provide a midsize schooler
Experience. I really am open to other ideas if anyone has any! Thanks for your time!

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Also please excuse all the typos - I’m using voice text. I promise i can write properly

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So let’s be real - why aren’t those your ED/ED2.

Why ED at the schools that aren’t your top choice?

And while the acceptance rates are near impossible, why not you? If not you, who? You seem impressive to me.

So no pain, no gain.

Good luck.

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You’re kind. Last year at my school 3 kids gor into Ivys. It has been hammered into me that restrictive EA schools are not worth the risk and I would be missing my chance at schools like Vanderbilt and Emory that fill half of each class from ED. My college advisors told me that I less I apply early even BC and Richmond may not happen because they are so focused on yield and my GPA, scores and ECs would make it seem that I would not go there unless I had to. Why not me? I haven’t won many national honors or had the opportunity to do research. I’m not a minority, 1st gen college student, or athlete that could compete at the college level ( maybe Emory or middlebury for pole vault bc it’s a bit unique). Debate is my only hook and I’m not sure it’s really a hook outside of UGA and maybe Emory. Basically all I have been told for 4 years is college is impossible nowadays and I shouldn’t expect much. Depressing but also trying to be realistic. I don’t want to be the kid who reached for the stars and ended up without any options. Honestly I will be thrilled to get into college because I don’t have any safeties and I know it.

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Most who go to top colleges haven’t won national awards or done research.

Yes, it’s a risk not being hooked at Vandy / Emory but you could just as easily get shot out there. Penn fills half the class ED and you’re not business or STEM. In fact, your major will be a hook at some schools.

I personally just think it’s ridiculous to ED to schools that aren’t your favorite.

Ps why is Florida potentially on your list ? Add a UMD or Wisconsin or UIUC or UMASS or for strong debate, Michigan State. And UVM is a safety.

Not sure if you ever look at Campus Pride but Vandy is not rated.

Emory is 4.5 stars of 5, UGA not rated.

UVM is 5 star.

Penn is 5 star. Pitt is another you might look at - has the “urbanness” of the others, for you a safety, and it’s not overly huge. Check the major of course.

Good luck whatever you decide to do - but there’s great schools out there you’d get into - a Brandeis instead of a Richmond for example…so if you’re worried about your list, add a PItt, a Brandeis, etc. and get yourself a fantastic fallback. UF - ??? After what you said about the South…by the way, Bama - 4.5 on the CPI. UF - not rated.

Best of luck.

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I think you have an excellent list and plan. I think the people who advised you did a great job. I do not agree that you need to go for Harvard restricted. It is super competitive and you did not treat cancer. I am sure you will be great at Vandy. I do not see a reason to add UMD (it is huge) or Upitt. You probably will have a lot of great options but I cannot imagine you will not be accepted to Vandy with a double legacy ED.

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Doodlemama, here are some random comments, hopefully one or more of which may be helpful:

1)Double legacy at Vanderbilt will help IF YOU APPLY ED. If you apply RD to Vanderbilt, it will not help nearly as much, and it could hurt. Generally speaking, colleges and universities that consider legacy do not appreciate legacy applicants applying RD and passing on applying ED, if ED is an option.

2)The ED1 acceptance rate at Vanderbilt is significantly higher than the ED2 rate.

3)You say you have no hooks, but you do. These include (stronger hooks at some schools moreso than others) state debate champ 3 years in a row, state pole vault champ 3 years in a row, being from a state (Alabama) that high end universities have some difficulty getting a high number of qualified applicants from, your intended major, and at Vanderbilt, double legacy status. If you are being recruited by multiple colleges for their debate team, being offered scholarships for debate and talking to Ivy League debate coaches who cannot recruit but are willing to put in a good word for you …. debate is definitely a hook for you!

4)Vanderbilt has a reputation for considering SAT/ACT score to be slightly more important than many other top universities do. You have a great 1520 SAT score.

5)You said that if you could attend any college, your favorites at this point would be Harvard, Penn, Brown, or Columbia. Harvard and to a lesser extent Columbia are truly a crap shoot for almost anyone. But your profile fits nicely with a potential acceptance to Penn or Brown. Maybe you should reach out to the Penn and Brown debate coaches if you have not done so already. Maybe they would be willing to put in a good word for you with admissions. Penn and Brown both sound like potential great fits for you both academically and socially.

6)You also said that you may be interested in UChicago, but you were turned off by the “where fun goes to die” reputation. I have a son who is a sophomore at Cornell (who is happy as a clam) and a freshman daughter at the University of Chicago (who is equally as happy as a clam). At the present time, the whole “where fun goes to die” thing is not accurate. I don’t know how accurate it ever was, but it certainly is not a fair representation of the current undergrad experience. UChicago provides a broad, world class, rigorous and rewarding academic experience. The social life of UChicago students is alive and well, despite the awesomeness of the education at the College. My daughter has made great friends quickly. This past weekend they went picking apples at an apple orchard. Honestly she would tell you that her social life at UChicago is better than it was in high school.

7)UChicago loves loves loves ED1 and ED2 applicants, especially academically strong, well rounded and mature applicants like yourself. I am fairly confident that you would have a very good chance of admission to UChicago if you applied either ED1 or ED2. Please consider investigating UChicago in more depth.

PLEASE DON’T SELL YOURSELF SHORT and GOOD LUCK :blush:

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My comment is related to this -

“I’m a queer woman in the Bible Belt. I need out!”

That’s not being in TN or GA.

The student also stated -" If I could just choose I would go to Harvard, penn, brown or Columbia"

So my comment is not trying to steer the student away for academic reasons but for the student not chasing their desires.

UMD or Pitt were mentioned because OP said they don’t have any safeties (I think UGA is likely and UVM is safe) and OP mentioned U Florida which I questioned due to her previous comments. OP has Michigan on their list so I was simply listing more accessible schools, etc as the list is very heavy - but the student is outstanding as well.

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But the student also said about 3 younger siblings and willingness to stay relatively close not to miss their major milestones. Is she going to do it from Chicago or Michigan I have no idea…
OP also mentioned had no problem with Emory. So Atlanta is totally fine. I would think that Vandy will be fine too.

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Yes - but she listed other schools she’d rather be at - and her ED1 is further away.

My main point is - the student is capable of taking her shot at the school she likes best. If it’s Vandy, then great - but it seems like the student wants to be at a “top” school - and with the legacy, Vandy gives their best chance. Or that’s what she is thinking.

I would also look at the Linguistics/Classics majors at each.

For example, look at Vandy’s - which isn’t linguistics and it doesn’t appear they have a linguistics major or minor. Just things to think about - rather than just looking at the school name.

Major and Minor | Department of Classical and Mediterranean Studies | Vanderbilt University

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If you really prefer one of the other schools why not apply REA or ED to one of them and if it doesn’t work out you can apply ED2 to Vandy or Emory? (That is the current plan in our house, ED to the super reach and then ED2 probably to Emory)

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It will not hurt you. Vanderbilt’s common data set says legacy is considered when making admissions decisions. As noted by another poster, that bump is likely to be strongest for students applying ED.

It sounds like you have a good college advisor who is aware of where students from your HS are placed every year. I would be more inclined to listen to that person who has a more complete picture than we do.

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This. And a very good luck to you as you apply.

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@helpingthekid73 That is precisely our plan. REA and hope to not get deferred(no man’s land). Hoping the REA will be canary in the coal mine so we can pivot for ED2.

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Obviously legacy will help you and I think you’ll likely get in (kids with legacy and your stats typically get in from what was our kids’ HS) but why ED where you don’t love unless your priority is getting into the best “ranked” school?

Here’s examples of doing that and not doing that. One of our sons ED’d to a legacy school that he really liked, mainly bc he grew up watching its sports - he didn’t tour any schools bc of COVID and had no “loves”. He got in, and is doing fine there, but maybe could’ve had a better fit elsewhere (though our sports fanaticism continues!), but he’s also very mainstream.

Our daughter (now a jr) had a “dream” school (I still don’t know why), Brown, she Ed’d, didn’t get in. But, she got into other great schools (including Cornell and Northwestern, I list bc of “rankings”) and ultimately chose one, Barnard, which I would urge you to look at as a queer woman (as is my daughter). Her path was to try to find a place she resonated with - like-minded people, a wonderful city, great academics, etc., regardless of ranking (outside of her ED school, which I think was due to yes, it being quite liberal with the open curriculum and great academics, but also prestige, but it was also the right “fit”). She loves her choice and has grown so much as a person there (prob would happen anywhere, but she’s no longer a bit of a fish out of water).

Also, one of our sons went to Richmond and, while I think it’s a great school, it’s 180% different from Barnard/Columbia, as is our son from our daughter. Richmond would not have been a good choice for her (I believe it’s quite like Vandy but smaller?; we know many people who apply to both). I would not include it on your list unless there’s a reason you haven’t stated.

Good luck. You will be honestly be fine wherever you choose, but you need not be in the south or a small minority amongst the frat boys/sorority girls unless you want that.

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