Very odd situation -- Desperate for Legal advice

Paying for College
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<p>Hey everyone -- I'm new here, so any advice on my problem will be greatly appreciated, it's a rather complex situation, but I'll try to be as elaborate as possible without going overboard.</p>

<p>I go to a University in the great state of Michigan, my dad was drawn to a job opening at the University, because one of the benefits is free tuition for your kids -- so long as you take a pay cut relative to how much my dad COULD make at another place of work. My dad was more than glad to take a pay cut for this. Then, upon my first year attending, I took one of the University's "Welcome" classes, called "University 1010", where they told you everything you need to know as a freshman in college. One of the things they told me was "no matter what your financial situation, scholarships, grants, income is... always apply for scholarships and grants -- it can make the college ride much smoother!"</p>

<p>So after a couple years, as I started to have more bills and class materials became more expensive, I realized: "hey -- maybe I do need to look into a grant or scholarship to help pay for books." (I used to have the Michigan Promise Scholarship -- which essentially turned into the Michigan Broken Promise Scholarship, because they terminated it prematurely) So the past two years I was awarded the Pell Grant, I was given a reward of $2900 and then $5600 this year. </p>

<p>Now I just want to clarify, I don't need all of this money, I just wanted enough to pay for my art supplies, books, and perhaps a printer. Based on my lousy income per year, the government determined those amounts were how much I was awarded. I've read that MANY student athletes in the NCAA organization get full rides, as well as apply for Pell Grants, and get all of it -- and the University lets them with no qualms or issues.</p>

<p>So now, I get these grants, and my school decided that they wanted that money, so they made this rule that says "Employee Tuition Waiver >>may be<< affected by scholarships or grants". Nowhere in the handbook does it give a definite percentage or anything more detailed than a "may be affected".</p>

<p>The first year of my $2900 Pell Grant, I received $500 of it, even though my lady who handled my account told me to my face I was allowed $1100 for gas alone.</p>

<p>Now this year, I was awarded $5600, and my school said they had another policy change, stating that I'm only allowed $500 just for books, and the rest of the money goes to them. They just limit the amount of free tuition I get, JUST enough to where they can give me $500 and take the rest.</p>

<p>Keep in mind that I haven't seen any of these "policy changes" in writing, they had some personnel changes in that department, so the whole department is understaffed and a giant mess.</p>

<p>Now I want to clarify, that I realize most kids have to pay for school, so I'm blessed to have free tuition. However, my dad could also be making a LOT more money doing something else, and was lured to the school by the benefit. So in my opinion -- it's all relative.</p>

<p>And I'm not asking for all the money... hell, send the rest of the money back to the government or the University can keep it once I got everything I absolutely needed for my education... but I just feel like I'm being lied to by the university for their gain only.</p>

<p>So my question is -- are these antics just poor business ethics by the University and there's nothing I can do about it? or do I have a legal case here brewing?</p>

<p>Lastly, I'm just hoping I can get more than 10% of the $5600 I pretty much just handed to the University. It's ridiculous, I would honestly MUCH rather not get the $500 per year and honor my dads "Full-tuition waiver" had I known all this mess was going to happen.</p>

<p>Thanks for hearing my story -- and if I sound like I'm being spoiled, feel free to voice whatever opinion you have on the matter.</p>

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<p>And if anyone wants me to elaborate further on the matter, please don’t hesitate to ask… The situation goes much deeper than that with errors from the school’s Department of Financial Aid and stuff where I ended up owing them money… just a giant mess of a department.</p>

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<p>The Pell Grant is an entitlement. If you and your custodial parent(s) have a low enough income to qualify you get it. Generally it is applied to billable costs first. However, institutional aid can be adjusted for having received Pell. Pretty much they probably can adjust the terms of the Employee Tuition Waiver as they want. You can dig deeper into that but I think it’s unlikely you are going to find cause for a legal challenge.</p>

<p>Is your mom your custodial parent? Even with your Dad taking less salary than he might get elsewhere, it would be surprising that his income is low enough to warrant Pell.</p>

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<p>This is a personnel matter for your father to deal with. Don’t apply for Pell if you don’t want it (although it might be a requirement of the employee tuition program).</p>

<p>You have the right to turn down the tuition program and just apply for federal aid if you think that will be more beneficial to you.</p>

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<p>You should know exactly how financial aid works for you, including the employee tuition program and the financial aid policies. Make an appointment with the financial aid directors and have them go over it with you and ask for the documents that explain this.</p>

<p>Though PELL is an entitlement that a student CAN receive above an beyond need met by other sources, just about every school I know will use it to meet need and then subtract out whatever aid they give by that amount, with varying exceptions, so what UM is doing is not unusual. But you should know what the rules are and how it works. My understanding also is that University of MIchigan at Ann Arbor guarantees to meet full need of its instate students so I don’t know how much of a benefit your father’s employee tuition program might be to you as you qualify for PELL, so probably substantial aid. However, need is often met by self help including loans and work study, so if you are getting pure grants, you can come up with how much of a benefit the tuition program is for your. You and your dad should do the math. No sense in his being stuck at a job to get benefits that don’t add up to the differential you’d be getting anyways. Something to consider. But you and he need to get all of the facts before coming to any such conclusions.</p>

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<p>What your are describing is very normal policy for a tuition benefit. Federal and state aid are applied and then the tuition benefit makes up the difference. Yes, for the student not eligible for fed/state aid, the tuition benefit is technically larger. Because this benefit is expensive for the institutions, being required to file a FAFSA is also very common.</p>

<p>I can’t imagine you’d have a legal case here. A tuition benefit isn’t any different from other voluntary benefits. Like other voluntary benefits, it can be changed and the changes go into effect immediately. For example, think about your employer changing from sick and vacation days to PTO days. You really don’t get a choice or a vote, and you can’t decide that the policy shouldn’t apply to you.</p>

<p>You may not have much luck with fin aid on this one as personnel policies are not under their control. They can tell you what they have to enforce, but if you want to a full explanation of the employee benefit, you will have to send your father to HR. That office probably won’t talk to you alone because you are not an employee. </p>

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<p>Cpt, I’m almost positive that this is not University of Michigan and it’s not Michigan State either. </p>

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<p>you qualify for full Pell when your dad works for the university? What kind of job does your dad have at the university? Does your mom work? </p>

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<p>In the very vast majority of cases, the Pell Grant is applied to billable costs by the university FIRST. You only get a refund IF there is excess money in your bursar’s account. You don’t just automatically get a refund of Pell money. And you don’t get to “choose” what to spend the money ON. It goes to billable costs FIRST. </p>

<p>Unless you have it in writing that you would receive the scholarship for ALL years of your schooling, I’m not sure what you expect to do. Are you receiving any institutional financial aid? Do you get a tuition remission of any sort due to your dad’s employment? </p>

<p>I also wonder how you are Pell eligible. Your family income would have to be below $30,000 a year, I believe, for a $0 EFC which is what you would need for a full Pell Grant.</p>

<p>You say you don’t NEED the money. So what is your beef? The school is NOT under any obligation to fund your art supplies, printer, and even books. In fact most schools expect students to make a contribution to their schooling for these things.</p>

<p>You are NOT a student athlete, so stop comparing yourself to one. That is pointless.</p>

<p>Honestly…this story has a LOT of holes in it. We don’t know your family income, what criteria a scholarship might have had for continuation, what your actual college costs are, what benefits you are getting due to your dad’s employment, the number of people on your family, etc. all of these variables could affect your money situation.</p>

<p>Is this a private university? </p>

<p>How do you feel this school is stiffing you?</p>

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<p>Thank you everyone for taking the time to respond – Almost all were very helpful responses. I’d like to take this opportunity to respond to everyone individually, but I just want to clarify a few things:</p>

<p>1) First of all — I want to reiterate the fact that I did NOT name the school I am from, I do not attend UM Ann Arbor or Michigan State. I was afraid that might be confused, haha.</p>

<p>2) I don’t really care about the money, basically what this is about, is that they refunded me an amount of money I assumed to be a small portion of my Grant, and then a year later they told me that they gave me too much, and they need me to pay some of it back. They gave me 20% of my Grant last year, and then this year gave me 15% of it, then told me they need 5% of it back again, due to a “policy” change. Keep in mind THEY have the final say in how much they refund to me, I waited for them to take what they wanted, and then whatever they refunded me I assumed was what they determined was necessary for the year.</p>

<p>3) All I wanted from the University was some fluidity, or consistency with what they were saying to me and with handling my account. The lady who handled my account told me how much debt I owed to them last year, which I have been paying back, and after doing some research… I realized the initial number she told me was wrong, and I met with her and her superior to show them, and she apologized and said she would re-audit my account to make sure it was correct again. She told me she would have the full audit to my email by January 25th, it is now March 6th and have not received a single message from her. </p>

<p>4) I am more-so calling the system into question. The University offers this attractive free tuition job, which my dad takes, but struggles on a monthly basis to pay bills due to low-pay from the school. Then the school tells me to apply for any grants and scholarships I can get my hands on, and then they change their policies several times so they can take a vast majority of that money, thus rendering my dad’s role in the situation useless. It’s a vicious cycle, if you ask me.</p>

<p>It’s just frustrating to see the cost of books and tuition going up every year, but the quality of education doesn’t necessarily equate to the cost, our country doesn’t have the “prestige” right now to justify charging so much. I know many people graduating and struggling to find jobs. The books are essentially just reprints but declared a “new edition”, and you can’t sell back last year’s edition. I could rant for hours about how broken the education system is – and how other countries are doing it much better, but that’s besides the point.</p>

<p>It just upsets me to see my dad get taken advantage of, due to “fine print”.</p>

<p>So I figured what they were doing was legal, but questionably unethical in my opinion. I just wanted to hear the opinion of people with experience in the matter before going further.</p>

<p>@annoyingdad – I don’t know my father’s income. I file my own taxes, and when I apply for FAFSA it asks me to link my dad’s information as well. I can’t explain to any of you how I qualify, other than the fact that my income per year is very low.</p>

<p>@twoinanddone – You’re right – I’d rather just not apply for it anymore. But at the meeting I had with the lady she told me they require for me to fill out a FAFSA form. Although if all I get back is $500 it’s not really worth dealing with their mess of a department.</p>

<p>@cptofthehouse – just to clarify – the school in question is not University of Michigan. Also, you are right, I should have taken the time to go over everything I needed to know before applying for aid. I only have one more semester left until graduating – so my dad will be leaving the school soon regardless.</p>

<p>@ordinarylives – yes, that is what I figured to be the case. I understand that the Tuition Waiver can be expensive – we just feel slighted by the idea that they never told my father that grants/scholarships would dramatically effect the amount of tuition waived during his initial sit-down. It was all fine print.</p>

<p>@mom2collegekids – I can’t explain it, apparently I do qualify, I even went over the forms and made sure everything was filled out correctly a dozen times.</p>

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<p>If you think for a minute, it makes no sense to take a low paying job for a tuition benefit if that tuition benefit makes no difference in bottom line. IT’s the same thing I tell kids and family about scholarship. The school that gives you the biggest award is not the winner–it’s the bottom line which is what you PAY, not what you get. The same with salary. IF the tuition award plus the paycheck plus other benefits makes it MORE than what he would get at comparable jobs, then it’s a great deal. </p>

<p>I know a number of folks who work at schools and their kids don’t even get the benefit of the tuition benefit which was something in mind when they took the jobs. The kids might not get accepted at the their schools, choose to go to other school for any number of reasons including a comparable or even better bottom line cost, the benefits may have changed to make them unavailable. In the ten years, I’ve known one family, the husband’s tuition benefits have changed drastically, and been reduced. A friends who taught at a Catholic high school for the tuition benefits ended up with her son getting accepted to a prestigioius full ride high school. Actually, had she done the math, the 4 years of free tuition that she had tunnel vision for were less than what she would have amassed had she looked for work at a public school and gotten in over time. It was not well thought out in terms of bottom dollar but until it was clear her son wasn’t going to go to her school, she never went over the numbers. </p>

<p>None of us know for sure if your Dad’s employee tuition benefits are integrated with PELL and other awards. One has to look at the rules for them, and your father should request what the are from his personnel department. But, it is not unusual though not always, that such they integrate, and these rules can change year to year, especially as schools look for placed to get more money. Harvard even integrates PELL and requires a student contribution in their financial aid and I don’t know a school that does not, though upon appeal or under special circumstances, they may let it alone. </p>

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<p>Such a good point. Currently, when my friends start in with the “well those of us who have to pay tuition” and “must be nice” comments, I remind them that I’ve earned every cent by working for the very low wages my employer pays. </p>

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<p>Blackmesa. You specifically stated that you would provide clarification. I asked for that. </p>

<p>You are asking about money issues. My point (and I was NOT the only one who made it) is that your billable costs get paid first. Only if there is a balance in your bursar’s account do you get ANY refund from your Pell.</p>

<p>In addition, you CAN (easily) find out the parent income by simply going into your FAFSA. Someone upstream provided you with HOW to do that. </p>

<p>Also, you say you went over the form dozens of times to see if the information was accurate. BUT you still claim here that you do NOT know your parent income. Sorry but that is impossible.</p>

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<p>I’m wondering if OP filed FAFSA (incorrectly?) as independent, which would explain the Pell and the lack of knowledge about parental finances.</p>

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<p>The bottom line is that the student will not be kept apprised of changes in HR policies that affect an employee tuition benefit … only the employee will be informed of such changes. If this is a public university, I can just about guarantee that the benefit is clearly explained in the benefit information published by the HR department. I imagine the same is true for private schools. Whether or not employees read what is published is another story.</p>

<p>It is not uncommon for benefits to be reduced by available federal aid. It is also not uncommon for tuition remission programs to change … in fact, I would bet there is a disclaimer stating that very fact on the HR website (or in the benefit handbook, published annually).</p>

<p>It sounds like someone in financial aid was not knowledgeable about the way the tuition remission program works with other aid, which is not really all that odd … it is an HR thing, and usually is packaged by managers rather than regular aid officers. It is not “common knowledge” in the aid office. It is, however, common knowledge in the HR office, where questions about how employee benefits work should be directed.</p>

<p>Spoken by a college employee who has enough to know in her own world and cannot possibly know everything! ;)</p>

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<p>No, I didn’t file as independent. I was required to file my FAFSA linked with a parent’s tax forms. </p>

<p>To Thumper – The reason I “don’t know” my father’s income is because I don’t know it off the top of my head, I’m sure I could look it up, however his income is completely irrelevant to my initial question. Everyone seems to be interested in my income and my father’s income, but I came here to ask if it was right for the school to make several “policy changes” and retract refunds in such a confusing manner, not whether I qualified for Pell Grant or not. But from the looks of it, the school can do whatever they please, because I am a student in their business, and I have less power over the situation. </p>

<p>@cptofthehouse – It seems that you are fully grasping my point, and you’ve been the most insightful on the matter. I don’t care if the school takes the Pell Grant money, it’s really just the fact that they would give me a refund and say “here’s leftover money for books and whatever you need” I spend the money, then a year later they tell me that their policy changed and they want me to pay back that leftover money from last year. They admit their mistake, and show no accountability for it, just expect me to pay it back. It’s like baiting me into taking mini-loans from the university. I don’t get it. </p>

<p>I could go on for hours about things the school has told me and then gone back on their word from, but it’s pointless. I found out what I needed to know here – and I appreciate everyone’s input! Thanks all! I’ll check back on this post a few more times if anyone has any more questions that pertain to my issue.</p>