Villanova - Class of 2023 - Early Action Discussion/Decisions

@collegemomjam @WineLover Her GPA was unweighted at 3.99. She didn’t apply to BC. Happy to give you the full 14 list and results when I have them. I went to a Catholic HS and appreciate the value of those educations. Understand your point on the essay but we started as early as possible on essays and forced lots of re-writes, etc. (not every school required full additional essays) so I expect her essays were up to snuff. And honestly ok not to be sympathetic. I really wanted to address this as an academic exercise and ask a question around very well qualified students not getting in. It has sort of morphed into the idea of value. First off I understand if you ever mention any school people will get all bent out of shape, I realize that and sorry if I am ruffling some feathers there. My arguments are probably no different than other pockets of the country and many other schools vs. this school, so not here to incite a riot. My comment on Nova and the NCAA championships was simply two things: 1. More applicants and 2. Great marketing tool. Never implied that people are going to 'Nova just for sports. Schools market anything they can - on most school visits they all talked about dogs being available to pet during finals and the great award winning food! Hey, why not.

I am a native New Englander and know many, many people, good friends that went to BC and their kids looking at BC. I am not bashing BC. BC is a good school. Not saying UMass and Rutgers are better. Beautiful campus, good sports, etc. I am sure that your children will do well and have a great 4 years there and I know your kids will get good jobs afterwards. What I am saying is at $73,357​, I just think it is hard to justify nearly $300,000. They give little to no merit so unless you are getting grants or an athletic scholarship or if money is no issue it’s a lot of money to be saddled with as a parent or adult. The idea that you can have a good job is excellent, but I know plenty of state school graduates also getting good jobs with 1/3 the debt. It’s hard to justify $70k+/year on any school, but perhaps there are a handful of schools and I am just not sure BC is one of them (and friends that are BC alums from 20 years ago have told me the same that the price has grown astronomical since they went and it is changing the equation). That was my point. And this goes for lots of schools not just BC or 'Nova, I don’t mean to pick on them. I could rattle off a list of 50 more that are similar. That was my point. My daughter has applied to several others in that category, but has a shot at significant scholarships at two. If she gets in but does not get the scholarship, same story, not worth it, won’t be attending. Perhaps I didn’t express that enough. I think 'Nova and BC are good schools, it’s the price point that changes the equation for me. Please don’t mistake me trashing the school vs. trying to weigh the value, that is where the overrated part comes in.

Specifically to @collegemomjam I think willing to pay depends on who is paying. All of the schools you mentioned are about the same price $65k+ (assuming you’re out of state). If parents are willing to pay and it doesn’t affect their retirement or life then I guess there is no issue with money and no real argument (or a separate argument). But a student saddled with that debt or parents putting themselves in debt is where it comes up. I have no doubts your kids will be/are in a good place for jobs and had a great experience (assuming no $300k debt), but with that debt, I guess I would need a stronger brand name that an Ivy brings or maybe a small handful of other schools bring (MIT, Stanford, etc.). After that the value question is real. Look, I know good examples of state school millionaires and some Ivy league slackers, so this is a very linear argument and all depends on the kid. But I have found that what you do after college is so much more valuable, than where you go. Very quickly people stop asking you where you went and start asking you what you have done.

@TheBigChef yes, thanks for the clarification on Jesuit. I should have said Catholic schools. I am a Catholic and should know better!

Thanks all for reading and for spirited debate!

Has anyone who was accepted EA received any information about scholarships and/or honors? Thanks

Also, was reading through the comments, and thought I may add this in: I read that the acceptance for the VSB was 22% last year and could have gotten even lower this year. With this being said, students deferred/ denied shouldn’t be too discouraged - it’s a tough admit.

@tbrixton, great response. Student debt is real and has doubled over the past 5 years. Parents are going on the hook for these loans as well. It’s just unconscionable to me that schools charge $70k a year. I know a lot of people who subscribe to the State U for undergrad at $30k and sink your money into Grad school. Once you get out of school and in business it’s where you received your graduate degree that matters more for the most part anyway. Still these schools have seen application rates skyrocket and can now say no to kids they would have swooned over 5-10 years ago

ACT: 34 (35E 33M 34R 33S)
SAT: 1330 (did not send)
GPA: 93ish unweighted, 99.08 (school calculates out of 100)
Rank: 4/125
Rigor (APs/honors): Honors English - 9th, 10th, 11th; Honors Math - 9th(algebra), 10th(geom), 11th(alg 2), 12th(pre-calc); Honors History - 9th(west civ); Honors Spanish - 9th, 10th, 11th; Honors Science - 9th (bio), 10th (chem), 11th (physics and neuroscience); 12th (anatomy and physiology); AP World History, APUSH, AP European History, AP Spanish, AP Literature, AP Psychology (17 honors and 6 AP’s; only non honors/ap courses taken are religion, art, and choir)
Extras: varsity soccer, basketball, softball all 4 years; spanish club president; class officer - 10th, 12th; athletic council; presidents council; class committee; national honor society officer; peer minister; week-long service trip through catholic heart work camp (2017 and 2018); volunteer at special olympics; volunteer at numerous events at my school and in my community; tour guide; video game club
State Residency: CT
High School: Holy Cross (small, private co-ed Catholic high school)
Ethnicity: white
Gender: female

Applied date: 11/1
Decision date: 1/11

Decision/College: ACCEPTED into College of Liberal Arts and Sciences
Major: Arts Undeclared (will choose Spanish as first major with hopes to double major in bio or some science)

@tbrixton, thanks for taking the time to engage in the “spirited debate.” Of course the issue of money was not top of mind for me. This discussion reminds me that we are all approaching this admissions game from so many different vantage points!

I am with you on the issue of value. Our family does not qualify for any financial aid, and thankfully loans are not necessary for us. But if I were in that situation, we would be approaching this completely differently. To be honest, I would not be thrilled about paying $70K to have my son attend most of the schools he applied to (including Villanova). Fortunately, he got into Notre Dame, and for us, there is value there there. If he hadn’t, he would have been a candidate for the Presidential Scholarship at Villanova, or would likely have received another smaller scholarship there…which would have been great. BC is another story. Not much merit available there. So if he had gotten into BC and Villanova, he would have been pursuing the scholarship at Villanova and then weighed the value between the two. But once he got the acceptance to ND, even a full ride to Villanova was not going to cut it lol. For him it is a once in a lifetime opportunity, and because we have the means, we will support him.

We are also from New England (I lived there for 40+ years), so very familiar with BC and other NE schools. My husband was at Brown for a number of years (a school my son had absolutely no interest in!).

All the best to you, and again, I do hope your daughter gets the ideal college opportunity.

My daughter was accepted to Villanova last year EA. Just wanted to let you know she was accepted into the honors program in July. Most honors students found out earlier.

You will not receive any financial information until the end of March which is extremely stressful. She had other offers coming in, but we couldn’t make any decision until we heard back from Villanova about cost.

I think around March 28 it came and we were surprised at the amount of aid through grants we were given .
Yes, still pricey however a good chunk of change…

Her stats were 1500 SAT and 99 unweighted GPA. Many AP and honors and she is playing for Nova.

Good luck everyone!

ACT: 31
SAT: 1360
GPA: 94 unweighted, 99 weighted
Rank: school does not calculate
Rigor (APs/honors): will graduate with 4 APs. (scored a 4 on APUSH & a 3 on ApLang)
Extras: four year soccer player, two years of lacrosse, Captain of a school spirit activity, Eucharistic Minister, two community service clubs, & a chair member of a social justice club called She’s The First)
State Residency: New York
Ethnicity: White
Gender: Female

Decision/College: Accepted into College of Engineering
Major: Civil Engineering

@tbrixton thanks for your thoughtful reply and for clarifying.

I agree with you on “value”…my kids/we did not need to take out loans, and while it certainly may impact when my husband retires, he has always said he would not let money be the reason our kid didn’t go to the school they wanted to go to. I realize this is NOT the norm and I do think that value is something important to consider. In our minds, BC and Georgetown were worth the price, but if they didn’t have jobs lined up, I might feel otherwise, I suppose.

I don’t personally know of kids coming out of Rutgers with similar offers, but I’m sure they exist. I just think that it is harder to stand out. In fact, a good friend of mine’s son graduated with a finance degree from Rutgers 2 years ago and had a very hard time finding a job, despite the 3.9 GPA and strong resume. He ended up taking a job with a hospital supply company in Chicago. I think he likes it and is making the most of it.

I would argue that coming out of BC business can get you are far as an Ivy, for what it’s worth. BC is a target school for many of the top firms (as is Georgetown,which is also a target for the top three consulting firms). But, if you happen to be following the stats of the kids getting in/not getting into BC business, you would be seeing that they pretty much need 35’s and 1500’s to get in. As it specifically relates to BC, I’m not sure you realize how selective the school has become (particularly the business school) and how highly regarded it is by potential employers. I cannot speak for Villanova from personal experience, but that business schools is also really HARD to get in now. These kids are getting good jobs and the top companies want them. Those of us that have done this sort of peeling back the onion on the career outcomes of the pre-professional programs know this already. But if you just use US News rankings you are definitely going to miss some fine details that might be completely relevant. (I’m not saying you are…but I definitely think there are people out there that don’t realize this.)

Probably a topic for a different thread, but a lot of top business programs like BC’s and more recently Villanova’s are being chosen over schools that might have a higher overall university ranking on US News and other rankings, because they graduate students in top jobs just like their more highly ranked peers. My BC daughter has many, many friends, boys and girls, going into IB jobs this year. Some people understand this “value” and are willing to bite the full pay bullet because they know their kids will have the opportunity. This of course is mostly the case for students that are interested in the more financial careers.

You didn’t bend me out of shape as it relates to BC (lol), this just happens to be a pet peeve of mine and I truly think you make a lot of great points. Both of my girls chose schools that were technically “lower ranked” (I think I mentioned my BC girl got into Michigan and USC, and my Georgetown girl got into Dartmouth), but I honestly feel that they had a better shot at the east coast financial careers they wanted coming out of the collaborative and stellar (and extremely selective) business schools they decided to attend. Sure, not as selective as Duke, but not that far behind. And Duke has ED and BC and Georgetown don’t have ED (Villanova now does) and that impacts the selectivity numbers, too.

I just want to mention that dd22 graduated from Rutgers business school (NB) with a masters in accounting after 4 1/2 years, received a great job offer junior year, accepted it but put it off, passed her first CPA exam, and will have all 4 under her belt before she starts. She did graduate at the top of her class. She was inducted into Beta Gamma Sigma sophomore year and received a scholarship. Paying $70,000 a year is not an option for us, 5 kids, 1 income, no need based aid.

My daughter:

ACT: 31
SAT: not submitted
GPA: 4.54
Rank: 3rd out of around 320
Rigor (APs/honors): 12 AP classes (all A’s)
Extras: President of Key Club, school rep to county School Board, Honor Society Officer, Math Club, Computer Club, set up her own non-profit to supply Title-1 schools with school supplies, lots of volunteer, leadership (HOBY), has worked part-time for 3 years
State Residency: MD
Ethnicity: White
Gender: Female

Applied date: by Nov. 1
Decision date: Jan. 11

Decision/College: ACCEPTED!!! M. Louise Fitzpatrick School of Nursing
Major: Nursing

@BlueIvy12 Do you mind sharing your stats? I was deferred EA for nursing

Thanks to all for sharing their stats and results. As a parent of a HS junior, I am finding these results eye-opening and sobering. Many exceptional students deferred or denied; no doubt you guys will have many excellent options though. I am also guessing that many of the kids who were deferred will get accepted in the RD round.

And yes, an interesting discussion on the subject of value. @tbrixton , I totally get where you’re coming from. All of the above mentioned are great schools; however, I have already had the, “I’m not paying $70,000 per year for x school” discussion with mine. If I were a multi-millionaire, or if mine wasn’t looking at attending graduate school after undergrad, I may have a different mindset.

I was accepted EA to Villanova’s School of Business.

ACT: N/A
SAT: 1570 (800 M, 770 R) Writing: 20
GPA: 3.51 UW, 5.09 W
Rank: School does not rank
Rigor (APs/honors): All honors classes since freshman year, took hardest classes posible- Soph: AP US Hist (5), Junior: AP Lang Comp (5), AP World History (4), AP Physics 1 (3), AP Macro and Micro Econ (Self studied), Senior: AP Calculus, AP US Government, AP Literature- all others Honors courses
Extras: Drum Major (previous section leader) of 180 person band, Yearbook design editor, FBLA (went to Nationals, states multiples times), NHS, Tri-M Honors Society, Highest band, Church youth leader, Worked 40 hour weeks during the summer of 2018 (split between one job-tutoring and one internship-beauty supply store), local Rotary Club’s September Senior of the Month, Questbridge College Prep Scholar and National Match Finalist, etc…

State Residency: NJ
Ethnicity: East Asian
Gender: Female

Applied date: 10/31/2018
Decision date: 1/11/2019

College: School of Business
Major: Management

Additional Thoughts: at first glance, my GPA is extremely low, but I think that Nova saw that the reason for that was because I challenged myself with the hardest classes I could possibly take. I also go to an extremely competitive public high school (we sent ~20-30 kids out of a 600 student graduation class to the Ivies). In the end, I think my essays really made the difference. Villanova is a much better alternative than my state school, Rutgers, due to its much smaller size. I’m excited to potentially be a part of Nova '23!

@fran01 my daughter was accepted EA for Nursing. She has an ACT of 33. GPA of 3.97 UW. Our HS doesn’t do class rank, so nothing there. I think about 10APs. Varsity athlete - Captain, job, volunteer at hospital, etc

Decision: Deferred

ACT: 29
GPA: UW: 3.1 W: 3.9
Rank: school doesn’t rank
Rigor: All IB classes (11th and 12th) . IB HL English, IB HL French, IB HL Theater, IB HL History, IB SL Math, and IB SL Environmental. I go to an elite, highly ranked private school in NYC.
ECs: Captain Varsity soccer 3 years (played four). Varsity Basketball 3 years (JV 1 year). Varsity Volleyball Captain 2 years (played 4 years), Model UN, Student Ambassador, worked in restaurant in Paris during summer, volunteered for a Congressional candidate (who won in an upset) for a few weekends.

Applied date: 10/28/18
Decision date: 1/11/19

College: College of Arts and Sciences
Major: Arts Undeclared (but I am gonna do political science).

Additional thoughts: I have family members who went to Nova and one of them wrote a letter for me. My common app essay was very good and my Villanova essay was also very good. My problem was clearly my grades but the rigor and the school I go to keeps me in it. ACT also could have been a little stronger. ECs are good. Rigor is good. Essays are very good. Rec letters are very good.

I have source within Nova and this is by far their most competitive year. They were blown away by the applications they received this year and it’s turning into an ultra competitive school.

praying for regular decision.

@kyir11, So this is why the process is so frustrating. I hope kyir11 gets in after deferral, I do.

My stats are mesureably better:

1420 SAT
3.8 UWGPA
14 Honors/6 AP’s
Tons of EC’s

And outright rejected…so please stop trying to explain the process

@oneiota2 I can understand your frustration seeing the admitted and deferred applicants all over the board in terms of stats. But remember, when you are looking at these stats on CC, you are not getting visibility of the whole picture. Someone may have had some sort of a strong hook. Someone else was a legacy. Someone else may have had an essay that really tugged at heartstrings. The application process in most schools are holistic. I saw this when reading about kids admitted on the Notre Dame forum. Someone with a 29 ACT got in, while someone with a 35 was denied. But she had a brother there and was first generation. It is happening everywhere…not just at Villanova. I don’t know what other schools you applied to, but I do hope you end up in a place you love.

My son just told me his portal was updated letting him know he did not receive a place in the honors program. Has anyone heard about St. Augustine?

@WineLover, thx for the message. It’s simply frustrating taking on average 5 AP or Honor classes every year and scoring 1420 on the SAT which I think is in 95th % and have ‘Nova outright say no. It’s a good school but it’s not top tier. Anyway, my 1st choice is NYU, hoping for that one. Thx

ACT: 33
SAT: 1320
GPA: 4.0
Rank: 22/645
Rigor (APs/honors): 11APs
Extras: orch prez, hosa prez, i run a charity, lots of volunteer hours (NHS)
State Residency: Texas
Ethnicity: African American
Gender: Female

Applied date: I forget, Early Action
Decision date: Jan 12

Decision/College: Accepted
Major: Biology