My D has narrowed her wonderful acceptances down to 3 schools.
CMU, Oberlin and Rice.
I’m trying to help her make the best informed choice possible. I know there are others here doing the same in the next 2 weeks. I also know that we have some superb VP parents who have been in this same position over the years who have a real long term view and valuable experiences to share.
The merit & FA at the 3 schools is beyond our wildest dreams, so that’s not an issue here. It’s all about the teachers and the programs now, and possibly the locations.
My feeling today is it’s really between Oberlin & Rice as CMU is a BFA program, not a BM.
D knows Oberlin well. Has done a summer intensive there. Has friends there. Loves the teacher. Not sure how rural Ohio will feel after a few months or years. Not sure if it’s too comfortable.
D loved Rice audition weekend. The area. The other musicians she met. The teacher has emailed and called her since they first met. She is being told by her current voice teacher ( who is on the faculty at 3 top conservatories) that The Shepherd School VP program is small ( rumour is they took 2-3 sopranos this year) and highly selective ( does that mean better? I do not know?)
Oberlin does not have a VP grad program. Shepherd does. Texas is…well… Texas. I have concerns 
What’s a girl to do?
I’m grateful for your responses, as always.
I’ll be starting my Master’s at Rice next year!
I wouldn’t worry about Texas for the sake of Texas. The area that Rice is in is the SAFEST and best part of Houston by far. I did my undergrad in Texas also (UT Austin) and have never really had too many problems with the state. Yes, the program at Rice is very small, and that was a huge part of the appeal for me. My teachers were telling me that I will not get the same kind of individual attention anywhere else. I think a big advantage over Oberlin is that Rice has a graduate program, and that your daughter will be able to hear singers that are a few years older than her. As an undergraduate, that experience was INVALUABLE. I have quite a few friends who have gone through the program at Oberlin, and while some thrive, some think it is a little bit TOO cut-throat. I don’t know any undergrads at Rice, but from what I’ve heard about the grad program, everyone tends to be very supportive of their colleagues.
Feel free to PM me!
I’ll take a shot. These are just my opinions and I don’t know your D so please only take them as generalities.
Having a graduate program - This can be good…or so-so. Would the grad students be a motivating factor or competitive issue? Grad students will get the bigger roles. Would she be OK taking a back seat or would she do better being more recognized? What’s her current position? Is she always getting roles and attn? Will she be OK with a change? Some students under-estimate this - my D did. It worked out but she definitely had a bit of an awakening and shift in her position. I was glad she didn’t have a lot of other pressures as she worked doggedly to catch up with grad students (see last pt).
BFA vs BM - A smart teacher once told my D during high school, there are many talented kids who do theatre or BFAs and come out with wonderful skills. However there are only so many kids who can really sing at a high level. It’s a way of setting yourself apart.
We visited Rice (but never Oberlin). I was worried about the atmosphere too. But we found a really cool part of town slightly north of Rice and I could definitely see my D living there. The one question I would consider is the academic rigor at Rice. If your D is quite strong academically, she may just be fine. Tough academics can take away from music. I wanted my D to have solid academics. And she was a good student. However I worried about tough academics AND a competitive program. So I wanted solid academics but nothing tough bc I knew she would need to compete. If your D doesn’t have this type of personality (I was very aware of it in high school - music teachers saying she has perfectionist tendencies) you may not need to worry. But I still think the rigor of the academics is worth a consideration.
Of course, there is the simple, short answer - pick the best teacher.
You have wonderful choices. Good luck!
DD loved her time at Rice. For one, the music students are housed in with the other students and not separated. This gave her a chance to make friends outside of music and broaden her experiences. That is pretty important for VP I believe. The academic rigor can be managed. There are courses that can be taken to satisfy the distribution requirements that are not on the super high level. If she got in she will be fine. DD found that although she did not get big roles in the operas, Rice does not believe in pushing young voices, she got many other performance opportunities and a wonderful education. The grad students were like having older siblings that were paving the way and could help out with the various struggles and issues facing young VP students. The RIce studios were like a family. I would recommend though that she plan on summer programs to boost her roles experiences. Rice will most likely have her do scenes for the most part.
Huge thanks to @TheFlagmaker @bridgenail & @Singersmom07.
I am so grateful for your input.
D is not going to have any issues with academics. She is graduating from a NYC specialized HS with a dual mission in arts and academics. She’s spent 4 years in a pre conservatory HS voice studio at the same time as juggling a full program of academics. She is also at a conservatory pre college. So she’s used to going to school 6 days a week. I’m confident that she will be fine in that aspect.
It’s really the performance opportunities that might be difficult to give up. Saying that, D is in this for the long haul and knows that she should not & will not be singing large roles. She is determined to not be a soprano that will be abused, used up and broken in horrid undergrad practices. She’s talked to her current teacher about this at length. It’s finding the balance. Always.
This is not an easy decision whatsoever.
It should not be. We are learning so
much and asking questions…
D was singing a master class at Young Arts NY today and the teacher said said “don’t go to CMU, but the other 2 are almost too hard to choose from…just so different.”
She’s not wrong. Sigh.
While I understand your concern about Rice being in Texas, Houston is a big city that up until recently, had a mayor who was an open lesbian, so it isn’t exactly some bible belt town, and from what i know of it, the area around Rice is really nice, plus keep in mind that Rice the school attracts students from all over the country and the world. I can’t speak for the VP program there, but I have known a number of instrumental students who went there, kids who grew up in places like the NYC area, the Bay area and so forth, and they all loved the school and the area it was in, some were openly LGBT, and they said it was a great community, so I suspect your D will be fine if she went there.
Thank you @musicprnt.
Yes, that’s all great for sure.
My issue is the gun culture in Texas.
Open carry on some campuses, etc.
Rice isn’t one of them now, but that could change.
It could also change in Ohio or Pennsylvania.
We spent almost week in Houston in January after her audition. It’s got loads going for it. We loved Rice village and the climate was great.
Lots of pluses.
Over the years, several CC families have sent their kids to CMU’s Vocal Performance program and those kids are doing well- I know that a couple have gotten into great graduate schools. What’s right for one student might not work for another, but that doesn’t make that option wrong.
Thank you,@Mezzo’sMama. I appreciate your thoughts.
Again, no one said CMU was bad or wrong or anything. It’s about a BFA vs. a BM. that is all. Guess what? She still might go. It’s a pheneomal school. That’s why she applied and auditioned.
I do appreciate your help and your experiences.
Just to be clear: The master class teacher asked my D a question. She wanted to know about my child. We didn’t go to her looking for her to bash a school, and she didn’t. My daughter answered her question. Nothing sinister. Nothing untoward.
As someone with a son who “wants” to seriously consider applying to Rice this coming fall, I have some reservations about it. Come August 1 of this year, Texas’s conceal carry gun law goes into effect at all college campuses. We’re not talking about the normal issues of crimes around the campus here; we’re talking about any students with the conceal carry permit can carry guns into any of the classrooms or studios, or at drunken Friday night parties. Because of this specific reason a long time Dean of Architecture at UT recently quit his job for a lateral move to UPenn: https://www.texastribune.org/2016/02/25/ut-architecture-dean-cites-campus-carry-reason-dep/. I’m sure more will follow suit.
My specific reservations are: 1) gun related accidents on Texas campuses; 2) “brain” or “talent” drain of star faculty and students out of Texas campuses; and 3) inability to recruit top faculty and students to Texas campuses.
There’s a top faculty member that my son’s interested in working with at the Shepherd School of Music at Rice. He’s famous enough, like the Dean of Architecture who decided to move to UPenn, that he’s not going to have any difficulty moving on to another school of music where he’ll be welcomed with warm open arms. To me, this is not a far-fetched imagination. It could very well happen, and I really am uncomfortable having my son commit to the school only to find a vacated studio down the road.
Well, Rice is a great school but just want to say that several years ago we visited Oberlin- twice- and came to love it. With a child who was also interested in NYC and cities in general, it was surprising how enthusiastic she was about Oberlin, the town and the school. Depth was apparent, and incredible support in the community. We ate at a restaurant where a professor was having dinner with several students. We went to student performances that were packed. The professors were welcoming. Combined with the kind of rigor and excellence she wanted. Loved the vibe in the conservatory.
We stayed in three different places, one a b and b and one through a local church, and one a charming airbnb. We sat on front porches and watched people walk and bike by and got the vibe of the place, which we liked a lot. Laid back but sophisticated.
I believe students do get out of Oberlin quite a bit, and not just to Cleveland
Tough choice, all three are great ones!
My two cents. Son (MM) auditioned at Rice this year. Houston is just such an amazing city-albeit humid! Rice seemed very firm on the no guns on campus and I don’t see that changing. It’s private and the schools that seem to be agreeing to it are public.
Best advice to any kiddo debating on undergrad choices-choose the teacher, then the city, then the school. You will live there for four years…and if you just hate it, you can always transfer!
I would check the Texas law, it applies only to state campuses, Rice and any private school have the right to ban guns on campus and there is nothing the legislature can do. While I am in no way, shape or form enamored with places that are gun happy, I don’t think that should be a factor with possibly going to Rice. I suspect that Houston is much like any big city, that it all depends on where you are in terms of crime, even when NYC had 2500 murders a year most of them were clustered in specific areas.
Rice recently opted out of the campus-carry legislation and will continue their policy of a gun-free campus. I take continuing education classes at Rice and have a niece who attends (not in music) and feel very safe walking on campus using common sense precautions. Other parts of Houston, not so much…
http://news.rice.edu/2015/12/03/rice-opts-out-of-campus-carry-law/
Thanks so much to @MomOf2TeenGirls, @musicprnt, @classicalpercmom, @compmom, @TiggerMom.
We are headed back to Houston & Ohio.
I appreciate all your input.
Good luck!!