wait what...M.S.??

College Majors Engineering Majors
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<p>I brought this up in a different thread but thought it may be a good thread. I am going to finish BS in 3 years and feel like I still want to further investigate and specialize in my area so want go to grad school for engineering. I want to eventually either MBA or PHD but then realized that...MS is like a waste?</p>

<p>I hear that you can do PHD without MS How will that work? Is BS+MS+PHD usually longer than BS+PHD or is it the same because MS may be the first two years of PHD? can someone clear me up there?</p>

<p>I will definitely work after MS and if I decide management is my thing I will end up doing MBA. Will that make my 'extra' knowledge from MS a waste? And in the work field how much bigger an advantage does the MS have over BS?</p>

<p>Thanks in advance! I will be applying for MS in a year so wanted to get this cleared out.</p>

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<p>An M.S. Is not a waste. Saying your eventual goal is a PhD or and MBA is kind of odd though. An MBA is a professional degree that needs 1 to 2 years work depending on the program and a PhD is a very in depth degree that is only useful for a select subgroup of people. If you want to continue down a technical track, M.S. And PhD are you options. An M.S. will open some doors beyond a B.S. and will make you more marketable for most positions. A PhD will open more doors for you but will actually most likely close more doors than it opens since you are overqualified for many positions. Usually a PhD makes you less marketable overall than stopping at M.S. A PhD is required for things like research positions (usually) or jobs in academia, however.</p>

<p>Basically, only get a PhD if you are sure you want to go into research or some area where a PhD is required or strongly encouraged. If you have any doubts about that, then stick with an M.S. and use it to just get your feet wet and see if you like research as a potential career and then decide further down the road if you want to continue to PhD.</p>

<p>As for time, skipping the M.S. will probably save you a couple semesters in the way to a PhD, but if you aren’t absolutely sure you need a PhD then there is no reason to skip M.S.</p>

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<p>boneh3ad nailed it, but I wanted to address a few specific questions:</p>

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<p>An MS usually takes 2 years and saves 1 year on your PhD. At most schools, the first year of the PhD program is just master’s level courses. On occasion (and this is common in IE programs), an MS will save you no time since PhD students take PhD level courses in the first semester.</p>

<p>It’s also worth noting that many PhD programs give you an MS as part of the program. So you’ll enroll for a PhD, take PhD courses, and after 2 or 3 years (post comps/quals), you’re given an MS. It’s also customary to give someone an MS if they drop out of a PhD program (as long as they’ve put in a few years).</p>

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<p>It depends on the company. Some corporate cultures are such that everyone expects you to have an MS and they treat you differently if they find out you don’t have one (don’t ask why - that’s just the corporate culture).</p>

<p>In most companies, that’s not the case. An MS in engineering really doesn’t increase your salary much and is equivalent to one year of experience.</p>

<p>So why do people get MS degrees? First of all, it’s much easier to get into an MS program than a BS or PhD program at most schools, allowing you to upgrade from a second tier school to a first tier school (or a first tier to an elite, etc). Do you want to go to MIT? It’s incredibly difficult to get in to the BS and PhD programs, but the MS isn’t so difficult. So if you want the MIT name on your resume (and access to MIT’s career services department), an MS is a good way to do it.</p>

<p>Also, you can take the MS in the different direction (going from a top tier school to a second tier school) to increase your GPA. Have a problem finding a job with a 2.5 GPA from a top school? With a good GRE score, a second tier school will probably take you. If you start over and earn a 4.0 at that school, you can go on the job market with a 4.0 GPA. </p>

<p>And the final (and intended) reason for the MS is for students that want to research. Maybe you want to go to a top school, but didn’t have the opportunity to research as an undergraduate (perhaps you went to a teaching school, for instance) or perhaps you think research is for you, but you’re not sure. You can go to a research university for an MS program, join a lab, and perform some research. Then you can apply to PhD programs with research under your belt or can decide to go into industry.</p>

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<p>In some fields, structural engineering being the example I’m most familiar with, many of the top companies won’t hire you without an MS, however. Talk to people within your intended field, figure out what you need to have in order to do what you want to do, and then go get those degrees. Speculation on your part, and on ours, isn’t really going to serve you well.</p>

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<p>I can’t imagine being a structural engineer without having an MS. I know people do it, but it must be hard. You learn so much more in grad school.</p>

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<p>UCSD offers an accredited BS in structural engineering, so we at least take more classes on structures than a general CivE curriculum. I do know though I’ll ultimately have to get a MS just to be a competitive job applicant.</p>

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<p>I am going to add one more thing about an M.S. in Engineering. Now my area is I.T. and the last 6 years has been Federal Defense/INTEL contracting and before that…about 14 years private sector.</p>

<p>While in the private sector, whether it was my own employer or a client (and I happened to see job postings), an I.T. director’s usual requirements were: BS + 12-15 years experience OR M.S. + 8 years. Hey, if I can save 4-7 years by doing an M.S. which is 2 years part-time, why not?</p>

<p>Since being in the defense sector the positions are like this:

  • Lead Engineer: BS + 10, MS + 7
  • Principal Engineer: BS + 15, MS + 10
  • Senior Principal…
  • …
  • Chief Engineer: MS required</p>

<p>Also, some government contracts (for whatever reasons) will specify that they want certain technical positions to have employees with M.S. degrees. I would have to say that my M.S. in Engineering helped my marketability.</p>

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<p>Experiment8, I was an Architectural Engineering major, not general civil, so I took more classes in structures, also. I still felt that an MS was essential. Don’t put off getting an MS - I know several people who thought they would work for a couple of years and then go back, but they never did. It’s too hard after getting used to a salary and being out of school, I think.</p>

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<p>Sorry for hijacking your thread, but is going to master’s in engineering after a undergrad in science (i.e chemistry -> chemical engineering) better than trying to transfer after, say, junior year? or not?</p>

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<p>G.P.Burdell, is it worthwhile to get a BSE in one field, and an MSE in another (specifically if I were to do that I would want to get an undergrad degree in Computer Science, and a graduate degree in Operations research) at the same school? One issue I am seeing is that the starting salaries for the BSE in Comp Sci are usually slightly higher than the starting salaries for the MSE in IOE (which at my school is Industrial and Operations Engineering).</p>

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<p>That IOE sounds familiar…Michigan?</p>

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<p>Thanks for your input guys. Just one final question from my side. Boneh3ad pointed out that it’s weird that a MBA or a PhD as my goal because they are totally different fields…but he also mentioned that I may decide not to do PhD in the end. </p>

<p>That’s exactly the scenario where MBA would come in. In either case, I will only decide after working for 2-3 years. First of all, is there anything wrong to apply for PhD 2-3 years after completing MS? I fall in the category, as G.P.Burdell mentioned, of wanting to get into MIT and then being able to apply to a top PhD program from there or getting access to excellent career services. </p>

<p>However, what if I go for MBA, wanting to be able to manage at the high level in the industry? People say with MBA having some technical background is an awesome combo, but is MS too much when going into management? Or will I need the knowledge? I know ppl with MBA’s later on go into banking or something very finance. But even if I don’t want to be one of them, does BS always suffice?</p>

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<p>“That IOE sounds familiar…Michigan?”</p>

<p>Yep</p>